Rules Clarification Please

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AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The game is eight ball, assuming BCA rules, and regarding the first shot after the break. Specifically, if you use a solid to pocket a stripe (or vice versa) in a combo, then you call the stripe and have designated your group, right? Now, if the solid goes in also, you're still stripes, since that is what you called. That is always the way I played.

The confusion started while I was watching TWO separate 2001 Accu-Stats Eight Ball Invitational videos. In one, Bustamante had the above scenario and the solid went into the intended pocket and the stripe went into the opposite pocket. The commentator, Billy Incardona (I think) stated Busta still had an open table and he was willing to wager that Busta didn't know it, since the group he ended up choosing was more difficult than the other. The second, Archer vs. Immonen. Archer has the first shot and is lined up dead straight on a stripe solid combo into the corner pocket, and almost makes them both. Again it was Incardona who stated he bet Archer was trying to make them both to keep an open table.

What's the deal? Is this a rule that was adopted just for the Invitational Tournament?
 
Maniac

Maniac

2manyQ's
Silver Member
Unbelievably, the BCA rule book for 8-ball is vague concerning this matter. I have always played this to where if you make both a stripe and a solid ball during an open table condition, the table remains open, whether or not you have "called" and made your intended category.

Maniac
 
Snapshot9

Snapshot9

son of 3 leg 1 eye dog ..
Silver Member
I don't think so ....

You have to call the ball and pocket in BCA 8 ball, so unless you call both and make both, the table would not be open. If you call a stripe off a solid, and make it and the solid both, you still have stripes.

The first shot after the break and making a ball designates the group you have.
 
M

MikeJanis

Banned
Snapshot9 said:
You have to call the ball and pocket in BCA 8 ball, so unless you call both and make both, the table would not be open. If you call a stripe off a solid, and make it and the solid both, you still have stripes.

The first shot after the break and making a ball designates the group you have.
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Snapdhot9 is correct if you are playing BCA rules.

Re: the tapes you watched.

Who knows what the rules were ?????????? Most invitationals and TV shows seem to make their owns rules for each event. Heck, even the IPT made up their own rules.

I for one wish everyone would just use the same rules.

I prefer the WPA's World Standardized Rules at my events which are the same as the BCA rules.

If you want a copy visit the WPA site, there is a link to the rules at the bottom of my signature.

Mj
 
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GADawg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Snapshot9 said:
You have to call the ball and pocket in BCA 8 ball, so unless you call both and make both, the table would not be open. If you call a stripe off a solid, and make it and the solid both, you still have stripes.

The first shot after the break and making a ball designates the group you have.
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I think this is correct under BCA/WPA rules. If you make the ball you called in the pocket you called it in, whatever else goes in is of no consequence and you have determined the ball groups.

As mentioned above, who knows what rules were being used for these torrnaments.
 
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AzB Silver Member
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Snapshot9 said:
You have to call the ball and pocket in BCA 8 ball, so unless you call both and make both, the table would not be open. If you call a stripe off a solid, and make it and the solid both, you still have stripes.

The first shot after the break and making a ball designates the group you have.
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I agree and that's what I thought. Your response brings up another question... Have you ever seen anyone call two balls, one from each group? What happens if you call two and only make one?
 
Bob Jewett

Bob Jewett

AZB Osmium Member
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lights_out said:
... ... Have you ever seen anyone call two balls, one from each group? What happens if you call two and only make one?
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So far as I know, you are permitted to call only one ball and one pocket. Whether a two-ball call is valid in any way is another issue -- it is outside the rules.
 
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GADawg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
lights_out said:
I agree and that's what I thought. Your response brings up another question... Have you ever seen anyone call two balls, one from each group? What happens if you call two and only make one?
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I don't think you can call two balls and cannot imagine what the purpose of such a call would be anyway. If you call one and make it, anything else that goes down stays anyway.

For sure you can't call either/or.
 
K

Klopek

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Ditto, provided it goes in the pocket you called, the ball you nominate is your group and the table does not remain open.:)
 
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AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
GADawg said:
I don't think you can call two balls and cannot imagine what the purpose of such a call would be anyway. If you call one and make it, anything else that goes down stays anyway.

For sure you can't call either/or.
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I didn't think so either but I have been in situations where this could come into play. For example, say a solid is in the jaws and a stripe just outside of it, straight in. After the break this is your only shot, but solids are tougher to run out than stripes. Call them both, then if you make them the table remains open and play position for the easier run out of stripes. Just a thought but I still don't think it's legal.
 
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GADawg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
lights_out said:
I didn't think so either but I have been in situations where this could come into play. For example, say a solid is in the jaws and a stripe just outside of it, straight in. After the break this is your only shot, but solids are tougher to run out than stripes. Call them both, then if you make them the table remains open and play position for the easier run out of stripes. Just a thought but I still don't think it's legal.
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I don't think that is legal. In that situation , you could call safe, make them both and leave the table open. Or you could call the stripe, make them both and have stripes.
 
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grc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
not to hijack but say you have make a combo with any ball combination (minus the 8-ball going in), the table isn't still open is it? Are those IPT rules where if you combo anything it still isnt the decider for your ball group?
 
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