Simonis 860

fastone371

fastone371

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Silver Member
Hey folks, I have Simonis 860 on my GCI that is just over 3 1/2 years old. I shoot about 15 hours a week on it, I dont jump on my table, but it has terrible burn marks all over it. You can see the lines going to the rack from breaking, stripes in the rail grooves, 2 very light spots 1 diamond in from foot rail corners where the corner balls of an 8 ball rack hit the short rail on the break, and also the stripes from the rack area to those 2 spots on the short rail. I keep my table clean, it gets vacuumed every week or 2, I do not chalk over the table. I have 3 sets of balls I bought when the Simonis was new or shortly thereafter, Centennials, Aramith Tournaments, and Cyclops. I keep the balls clean in my Diamond polisher. Why do I have all of this cloth wear? People were using periods of 10 years between covering a home table, it could stand to be recovered at any time now. I did go with traditional green instead of tournament blue, maybe its just more obvious on a darker color or maybe I have all this wear because I did not use 860HR, anyone have any ideas?
 
fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
Fastone to planet earth, anybody there????

Anybody???

Nobody???

I am probably on every-bodies ignore list and just do not realize it, boy do I feel like an idiot now!!!!

:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:
 
K2Kraze

K2Kraze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Guess you've slipped by my ignore list

Few thoughts:

1) are you sure it's authentic Simonis 860? Would have had the logo imprinted on the cloth when it was installed.

2) are you cleaning it regularly with a slightly damp rag and one of the table cleaning solutions? Most of the burn marks will come out with minimal effort on the 860 - just make sure you don't spot clean them though and cause excess wear and fading in those spots.

3) you "could/should" be using a small cut-out circle of your cloth as a breaking pad below the cue ball during your breaks which will nearly eliminate all break burn marks and tracks...




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Ralph Kramden

Ralph Kramden

BOOM!.. ZOOM!.. MOON!
Silver Member
fastone371 said:
Fastone to planet earth, anybody there????

Anybody???

Nobody???

I am probably on every-bodies ignore list and just do not realize it, boy do I feel like an idiot now!!!!

:shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug::shrug:
Click to expand...

Ground control to Major Tom... ?????

I have 3 year old 860hr and it hasn't shown as much wear as the 860 that was replaced.

You're not on everybodies ignore list... You just had to say the magic word :groucho:

.
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
pocket said:
Care to expand on that?
Click to expand...

Sure, it builds up a yellowish discoloration on the cloth in the pockets, nose of the cushions, one the playing surface....which adds increased friction....and additional looking wear on the cloth.
 
pocket

pocket

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
realkingcobra said:
Sure, it builds up a yellowish discoloration on the cloth in the pockets, nose of the cushions, one the playing surface....which adds increased friction....and additional looking wear on the cloth.
Click to expand...

Ok that sucks, it's what I use. What do you suggest as an alternate if I may ask?
 
K2Kraze

K2Kraze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
realkingcobra said:
Sure, it builds up a yellowish discoloration on the cloth in the pockets, nose of the cushions, one the playing surface....which adds increased friction....and additional looking wear on the cloth.
Click to expand...



My thoughts on your thoughts, Glenn....

The only way any "yellowish" discoloration can be transferred to a table from the Aramith Billiard Ball Cleaner used to routinely keep balls maintained is if the balls are not wiped down completely/properly after being polished. Using a separate, clean microfiber towel of course will guarantee that.

If folks are hastily polishing their ball sets by hand and tossing them back into play without using a separate clean microfiber towel AND unknowingly leaving the slightest residue on them, then it's possible. Which leads me to my second point....

Cleaning the ball sets from oils and chalk is only part of the care required for often-played equipment ---- let's not forget the proper care and cleaning of that beautiful (and flawlessly installed) Simonis cloth you put down. Proper cloth cleaning will easily remove (most) burn marks and those irritating cushion marks. Let's not forget to wipe the back and bottom of those pockets now.

99% of any yellowish anything can be prevented by ensuring the balls are simply wiped diligently with a clean towel. Burn marks and rail wear lines are most often caused from inferior ball finishes, poorly maintained balls, and driving the cue ball down into the cloth while breaking with enough force to raise that friction temp above 400 degrees or so. Again, the fix for that is to use a small "break pad".

Perhaps you can post a quick reply on your thoughts and techniques to best clean Simonis cloth, Glenn. I'm open to learning something new if I'm not doing it perfectly now - like I am when it comes to ball cleaning and care

Always appreciate your input, RKC.

K.


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fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
It was most definitely real Simonis.

I do use the Aramith cleaner, not the restorer on my ball sets.

I almost always break from the center area of my table but in the last 6 weeks I have

I was using a small sheet of paper for a break pad that was working fantastic but when I noticed I had lines at the foot rail where the corner balls hit on an 8 ball break plus other marks I quit using the break pad. I use a microfiber towel on the ball sets out of the polisher. Nothing I do seems to diminish of fade the burn/wear marks. Its not really a big deal anymore because its time for new cloth, just trying to decide on 860 or 860HR.
I heard that the 860HR was slightly faster than 860, then I heard that 860HR was slightly slower, although that may have been because someone thought HR stood for high resistance as in higher rolling resistance.

I will post some pictures of the table after the weekend, maybe I am getting worked up for nothing for the hours played on it so far.
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
K2Kraze said:
My thoughts on your thoughts, Glenn....

The only way any "yellowish" discoloration can be transferred to a table from the Aramith Billiard Ball Cleaner used to routinely keep balls maintained is if the balls are not wiped down completely/properly after being polished. Using a separate, clean microfiber towel of course will guarantee that.

If folks are hastily polishing their ball sets by hand and tossing them back into play without using a separate clean microfiber towel AND unknowingly leaving the slightest residue on them, then it's possible. Which leads me to my second point....

Cleaning the ball sets from oils and chalk is only part of the care required for often-played equipment ---- let's not forget the proper care and cleaning of that beautiful (and flawlessly installed) Simonis cloth you put down. Proper cloth cleaning will easily remove (most) burn marks and those irritating cushion marks. Let's not forget to wipe the back and bottom of those pockets now.

99% of any yellowish anything can be prevented by ensuring the balls are simply wiped diligently with a clean towel. Burn marks and rail wear lines are most often caused from inferior ball finishes, poorly maintained balls, and driving the cue ball down into the cloth while breaking with enough force to raise that friction temp above 400 degrees or so. Again, the fix for that is to use a small "break pad".

Perhaps you can post a quick reply on your thoughts and techniques to best clean Simonis cloth, Glenn. I'm open to learning something new if I'm not doing it perfectly now - like I am when it comes to ball cleaning and care

Always appreciate your input, RKC.

K.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

All I know is I'm batting a 1000% everytime I look at a table....then ask the owner if they're using the Aramith ball cleaner to clean the balls....because I always see the same build up of cleaner and always in the same places.
 
K2Kraze

K2Kraze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm guessing they're all cleaning them improperly then, RKC. I'll wager 1000%.


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D

d_day

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Why do you have so much wear? Well, let's do a little math shall we?

You play 15 hours a week. You've had the cloth for 3.5 years. That's 15x52x3.5 which equals 2730 hours.

A busy table in a pool room will average around 8 hours of play per day. If it's a quality place they're replacing the cloth every six months or so, and a busy table will need it every six months. That's 8x7x26 which equals 1456 hours.

So you've got nearly double the life out of your cloth that a table in a pool room would get. I think you're doing pretty well myself. As to your comment about people having cloth that lasts 10 years, I'd bet they don't play at home nearly as much as you do.
 
realkingcobra

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
fastone371 said:
It was most definitely real Simonis.

I do use the Aramith cleaner, not the restorer on my ball sets.

I almost always break from the center area of my table but in the last 6 weeks I have

I was using a small sheet of paper for a break pad that was working fantastic but when I noticed I had lines at the foot rail where the corner balls hit on an 8 ball break plus other marks I quit using the break pad. I use a microfiber towel on the ball sets out of the polisher. Nothing I do seems to diminish of fade the burn/wear marks. Its not really a big deal anymore because its time for new cloth, just trying to decide on 860 or 860HR.
I heard that the 860HR was slightly faster than 860, then I heard that 860HR was slightly slower, although that may have been because someone thought HR stood for high resistance as in higher rolling resistance.

I will post some pictures of the table after the weekend, maybe I am getting worked up for nothing for the hours played on it so far.
Click to expand...

Post some pictures of the cloth wear....and where did you buy the cloth from?
 
fastone371

fastone371

Certifiable
Silver Member
d_day said:
Why do you have so much wear? Well, let's do a little math shall we?

You play 15 hours a week. You've had the cloth for 3.5 years. That's 15x52x3.5 which equals 2730 hours.

A busy table in a pool room will average around 8 hours of play per day. If it's a quality place they're replacing the cloth every six months or so, and a busy table will need it every six months. That's 8x7x26 which equals 1456 hours.

So you've got nearly double the life out of your cloth that a table in a pool room would get. I think you're doing pretty well myself. As to your comment about people having cloth that lasts 10 years, I'd bet they don't play at home nearly as much as you do.
Click to expand...

Yeah, you are correct about the hours I have played. People were saying you could go like 10 years before recovering a home table which made me think 3 1/2 years was kinda early.
 
jtompilot

jtompilot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have heard the HR doesn't burn as much and is slightly faster. Someone can let me know if that's right
 
Poolhalljunkie

Poolhalljunkie

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
860 hr

The 860 HR is faster and also doesn't have the initial Simonis slide during the break in period. ( The only burn marks are from masse, and repeated breaking in the same spot, use a break cloth and you should be fine.)
 
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