"Blind Test"

kasparovII

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
A bit of history. I'm 62 yrs. old, been playing for over 50 yrs. Let go of the game in my mid 50's. Came back to it right around the time Predator was making huge inroads into the business. I have played their shafts and supported their products. Never was enamored with the feel though. However, yesterday, I met a guy who was selling Predator cues, Joss, Schon , Lucasi and had a couple of custom cues, which he claimed were as good as any of the above.One was very expensive, probably due to the full ivory joint, and another custom house with a price in line with the top line production cues (I will refrain from naming these cuemakers..they do make good cues). In my limited experience I have owned Meuccis when they were good solid players(prior to the "dot" shaft, powerpiston debacles), an expensive Joss and an SP Schon, which would have been my favorite had it not been for the ultra-short shaft taper, which I could never get comfortable with.
Since I am "in the market" and this guy met me at my hall, the proprietor made a good suggestion. The suggestion was a "blind test" to hit some baisc shots, i.e., middle ball, some draw shots a couple with side spin, look at the result but base the entire process on "feel". The tip diameters ranged from 12.25mm to 13mm, the joints were stainless steel to full ivory with others being wood to wood phenolic.
To my surprise, the "feel" category or "hit" was hands down the stock Schon. Before the test, my proprietor told me I wouldn't be able to tell the difference in a top shelf cue with a ss joint and a full ivory joint because the butt construction had alot to do with "hit"...which I thought was ridiculous. But he was 100% correct. The Joss was, frankly, just not as solid as most of the others. The Predotor I was able to recognize because it felt the most butt heavy. I was never able to tell, by feel wich joint was which, except for the sound of one cue...and it was a phenolic...not the ivory joint. So, in the first round Joss and the Predator Ikon were out of the running.
I also chose the standard Schon shaft over the same butt with a laminated, low deflection shaft. And oddly enough, the perfoermance was also best with a standard Schon butt/shaft combo. I will say that the Schon shaft that I played had a much more comfortable taper...not like a 314 (13" pro taper), but what I'd call a Schon modified 10 or 12" taper...incidentally the Schon stock water buffalo tip felt better than the Everests that were on the 314's and his two custom cues. I had preferred MooriIII's, but the stock Schon felt and played identically to te MoiriIII's. I would have loved to have played the stock Schon with a Kamui Black soft.
Well, as a player who was figuring that I needed a custom cue, regardless of some of the high quality "production" cues available, what do I do? I have a few makers in mind. Do I simply say...."make me a cue that hits like a Schon"..with a taper that I want? Do I discard my "requirement" for a wood to wood ivory joint?
For the hell of it I discussed this with Evan Clarke today and he laughed, applauding my methodology, but saying, in essence, "been there...done that". His messge was a fair one.. It was ..there are a lot of great custom cue makers out there but you have to hit a bunch of there produt to see if the consistency that brought you to them in the first place is there. Secondly, we stay with a easily reproducable , but complicated butt manufacturibg process that does ensure a consistent hit. If not, I don't care where you buy it from, as long as they're on our list of authorized Schon Sales List, we'll take it back and give you your money back. Finally, as far as shaft taper, his advice to me was ask your dealer about giving you the type of taper that your most comfortable with and if you don't like it , we'll turn it for you for free. Just don't order a "toothpick" ...we can't add wood'!
So, I'd like to hear from Schon users who have had customs as well. Does what I've experienced make any sense? It was kind of an eye opener to me...especially as far as shaft and joint vs. "hit" goes. Schon is still one hell of a cue.
 

HollyWood

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm hoping the quality doesn't change

Schon makes great cues- coming to Walmart- drop shipped I expect. For the best prices contact koinnkid- he has about 35-50 schons. mark
 

kasparovII

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Got to say, I don't understand your reply. If I go with a Schon again, I wouldn't expect them to be vacuumed packed in plastic and dropped shipped to Wal-mart. There are tons of places to buy any of the top production cues.....and so many cue makers out there looking for business it's a pretty simple task to look at their rep or if you get a chance, to play one..then figure out what you want to spend. So are you saying that Schon product quality is going south or what? The Schon I hit wasn't even available on their website, so I assume, it's probably a few years old. It was an all-ebony wrapless with a rosewood or cocobolo (?) handle. Haven't made up my mind yet if I go custom or Schon...just passing along an interesting experiment with a bunch of cue/shaft/joint combinations. I would have gone with one of a few custom cues, prior to this, but I really don't want a half year lead time.
 

measureman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I did a blind test mid 80's when i bought a Schon.
I hit balls with the Schon and a Gus Szamboti cue. And they told me after wards that they would hand me the Schon a couple of times in a row then the Gus once and then switch it up the other way. Now there was a difference in the hit but i couldn't tell which cue was which. So i bought the Schon. I no longer have it but to this day it was the best cue i ever had.
 

TheBook

Ret Professional Goof Off
Silver Member
A team mate went into the local pool hall. He sought out the owner and said he was interested in getting a buying a cue. The owner brought out a $2000 dollar cue and my buddy being a smart ass asked if he had something more expensive. The owner came back with a cue and said I think that I have a cue that you want, it is a $12,000 Szamboti. He then got scared and said seriously I was just kidding. The owner insisted that he hit a few balls with it. Reluctantly he did. Asked what he thought and would he buy it. My friend said sure would love to, it was the best cue that he has ever tried but the price is out of the question. The owner asked how much could you afford. He said about if the cue was $300 he would buy it. The owner said it is yours for $99. I don't want to cheat you.

Granted this guy was not a expect or had much experience with different cues but he got a cue that he was happy with for under $100.
 

DWoods6354

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Schon hits

You will hear a lot of comments about a Schon - Things like:
Production cue
Wal-Mart
CNC'd round points

But you very seldom (if ever) hear anyone complain about how they hit.

My player is an old R6 - and in my opinion it hits as sweet as any cue I have ever played with.

I love cues, the workmanship, design and work that goes into them facinates me. I am lucky enough to own a few - and most of them are customs from well respected cue makers. I trade around some and the cues I keep all play excellent and are simply gorgeous (to me).

But - if the prize is on the line - I do like having my Schon in my hands.
 

WilleeCue

The Barefoot Cuemaker
Silver Member
Go with the Schon cue that you like and have a cue maker custom re-taper the shaft to something that feels better.
Just dont go to far with removing wood from the shaft or the "feel" will be changed.

This is gonna require that you work closely with the cue maker and slowly adjust the shaft in small steps.
For that reason a local cue maker would be your first choice.
 

WilleeCue

The Barefoot Cuemaker
Silver Member
A team mate went into the local pool hall. He sought out the owner and said he was interested in getting a buying a cue. The owner brought out a $2000 dollar cue and my buddy being a smart ass asked if he had something more expensive. The owner came back with a cue and said I think that I have a cue that you want, it is a $12,000 Szamboti. He then got scared and said seriously I was just kidding. The owner insisted that he hit a few balls with it. Reluctantly he did. Asked what he thought and would he buy it. My friend said sure would love to, it was the best cue that he has ever tried but the price is out of the question. The owner asked how much could you afford. He said about if the cue was $300 he would buy it. The owner said it is yours for $99. I don't want to cheat you.

Granted this guy was not a expect or had much experience with different cues but he got a cue that he was happy with for under $100.


Psychology is a big factor for cue buyers.

Most will base their opinion of a cue by the cost or what their buddies say about it.

"Hey ... its just a piece of wood with a bit of leather glued on the end"
 
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