A Huge Thank You from CueSports International (CSI)!

Fast Lenny · Aug 13, 2015

If you are not loyal to those who sign your paychecks then you will be looking for a new job soon enough. Its so obvious to see where loyalties lie when certain threads pop up with many members here. I am not exempt from that just like with Bonus Ball but its dead and possibly gone and haven't cashed a check from it in a long while but I will still stand up for it because I know those involved meant well for the most part trying to organize players and give them a paycheck and not just a payday.

Pool in the US might never see anything like it again even if it ended up being a disappointment with many mistakes. One mistake they didn't make is any player could go and play in what they wanted if they wanted to pass up that paycheck, it was okay to play TAR, Tunica, BCA or whatever else that was going on. I learned a ton from it and made some life long friends so even though it was not a good move money wise for me it still was an invaluable experience.

P.S. No hockey jerseys, odd ball games even though I liked the game and make sure the head guy is in touch with American pool. Yes to teams, shot clock and good looking ball girls. :grin:

BeiberLvr · Aug 13, 2015

If only we could convince Barry Hearn to come over to the States for a while.

Mr. Bond · Aug 13, 2015

Celtic said:
CSI is great, as long as you toe the CSI line. It is CSI'S way or the highway, and pretty much anyone who has disagreed with them has found that out triple quick.

Everyone involved in the recent CSI " incidents" had a choice. All players, and indeed everyone on earth has a choice. Sometimes you might hear the phrase " choose your battles"...

Rodney had a choice, Ralph had a choice, Oscar, Ray, Skylar, Ozzy....they made their choices and they will live with them. So let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That being said, if you look at the bigger picture, there is a pattern forming here. And this pattern is something that many of you may not have ever witnessed before in the pool world, which is accountability and consequences for your actions. Consequences that are sometimes good and sometimes bad, but they are consequences all the same.

An entire generation of pool players, and fans, have grown up in a chaotic world, without authority, where anything can and does happen. Players dump, make savers, sandbag, cheat and lie, quit during events, dis the promoter, dis the sponsors, dis the TD, dress like bums, show up late, show up drunk or high, miss matches altogether, throw their equipment and tantrums, backtalk and freely slander each other - including minorities, women and anyone else they hate, beg for free entries and better seeds, even the promoters have gotten in on the action with late and and skipped payouts, manipulating brackets and draws, even harrassing or leveraging players....and ALL THIS is done without anyone ever paying the price for their wrongdoings.

In a professional world, your ass would be on the street at the first sign of impropriety or damaging the company name, image, or pocketbook. In pro sports your ass would get heavily fined, you would miss games, and your wallet, stats, future eligibility and sponsorships would all be at stake.

Jay made mention of some of the hardcore shit that goes on the world of big business every single day, and you know what? He's right. Even the great and powerful Brunswick corporation, who built the tables we have played on endless times, is guilty of blacklisting players, pulling the rug out from under their own family, and even the industry at large, to satisfy their own bottom lines. And did we turn a blind eye? Don't ask don't tell?

I don't know about you, but I can clearly see that something needs to be done, to bring things back into an orderly, respectable and reliable state, for the benefit of the entire industry, and it needs to start with the public figures of our game, the ambassadors, the heroes and would-be example setters - which is the top players themselves. So if a line needs to be drawn in the sand, if some heads have to be thumped, some toes need to be stepped on and some feelings have to be hurt, then so be it.

I'm not here to tell you that the " right" decisions were or are being made, but I am here to tell you that we need changes now more than ever.

Fast Lenny · Aug 13, 2015

BeiberLvr said:
If only we could convince Barry Hearn to come over to the States for a while.

If he did then he would end up being some sort of villain.

Joe_Jaguar · Aug 13, 2015

Celtic said:
Can you post examples of these "personal attacks" please?

I seem to have missed them all in the midst of everyone remaining focused on discussing and critiquing the actions and decisions of CSI and Ozzy in this event and previous ones.

Exactly.

The only thing that sucks is too bad they didn't have a feature on here where people on your ignore lists don't even show up when people quote them :rotflmao1:

robsnotes4u · Aug 13, 2015

Mr. Bond said:
Everyone involved in the recent CSI " incidents" had a choice. All players, and indeed everyone on earth has a choice. Sometimes you might hear the phrase " choose your battles"...

Rodney had a choice, Ralph had a choice, Oscar, Ray, Skylar, Ozzy....they made their choices and they will live with them. So let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That being said, if you look at the bigger picture, there is a pattern forming here. And this pattern is something that many of you may not have ever witnessed before in the pool world, which is accountability and consequences for your actions. Consequences that are sometimes good and sometimes bad, but they are consequences all the same.

An entire generation of pool players, and fans, have grown up in a chaotic world, without authority, where anything can and does happen. Players dump, make savers, sandbag, cheat and lie, quit during events, dis the promoter, dis the sponsors, dis the TD, dress like bums, show up late, show up drunk or high, miss matches altogether, throw their equipment and tantrums, backtalk and freely slander each other - including minorities, women and anyone else they hate, beg for free entries and better seeds, even the promoters have gotten in on the action with late and and skipped payouts, manipulating brackets and draws, even harrassing or leveraging players....and ALL THIS is done without anyone ever paying the price for their wrongdoings.

In a professional world, your ass would be on the street at the first sign of impropriety or damaging the company name, image, or pocketbook. In pro sports your ass would get heavily fined, you would miss games, and your wallet, stats, future eligibility and sponsorships would all be at stake.

Jay made mention of some of the hardcore shit that goes on the world of big business every single day, and you know what? He's right. Even the great and powerful Brunswick corporation, who built the tables we have played on endless times, is guilty of blacklisting players, pulling the rug out from under their own family, and even the industry at large, to satisfy their own bottom lines. And did we turn a blind eye? Don't ask don't tell?

I don't know about you, but I can clearly see that something needs to be done, to bring things back into an orderly, respectable and reliable state, for the benefit of the entire industry, and it needs to start with the public figures of our game, the ambassadors, the heroes and would-be example setters - which is the top players themselves. So if a line needs to be drawn in the sand, if some heads have to be thumped, some toes need to be stepped on and some feelings have to be hurt, then so be it.

I'm not here to tell you that the " right" decisions were or are being made, but I am here to tell you that we need changes now more than ever.

Post of the Year!!!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Cameron Smith · Aug 13, 2015

BeiberLvr said:
If only we could convince Barry Hearn to come over to the States for a while.

He won't because it's a bigger job than snooker was to rejuvenate pool. There is really no infrastructure to build upon. He would have to start from scratch or rely on everyone or most promoters to work together.

JCIN · Aug 13, 2015

Cameron Smith said:
He won't because it's a bigger job than snooker was to rejuvenate pool. There is really no infrastructure to build upon. He would have to start from scratch or rely on everyone or most promoters to work together.

In his HOF speech Barry said basically there is no TV to be had for pool in the U.S. and because of that no chance of doing anything. He intimated that he doesnt like ESPN for what they did to the pool product on TV here. It has no value now.

I always talk about pool being desperate for leaders...after watching one speech from Barry I was ready to run through a wall for the guy. If he or someone like him ever does come into pool it wont all be roses but there will be a plan and long term goals with a set way to get there. Hope I see it one day.

Green Hornet · Aug 13, 2015

Preach On, Brother Bond! ABR tonight.

Mr. Bond said:
Everyone involved in the recent CSI " incidents" had a choice. All players, and indeed everyone on earth has a choice. Sometimes you might hear the phrase " choose your battles"...

Rodney had a choice, Ralph had a choice, Oscar, Ray, Skylar, Ozzy....they made their choices and they will live with them. So let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That being said, if you look at the bigger picture, there is a pattern forming here. And this pattern is something that many of you may not have ever witnessed before in the pool world, which is accountability and consequences for your actions. Consequences that are sometimes good and sometimes bad, but they are consequences all the same.

An entire generation of pool players, and fans, have grown up in a chaotic world, without authority, where anything can and does happen. Players dump, make savers, sandbag, cheat and lie, quit during events, dis the promoter, dis the sponsors, dis the TD, dress like bums, show up late, show up drunk or high, miss matches altogether, throw their equipment and tantrums, backtalk and freely slander each other - including minorities, women and anyone else they hate, beg for free entries and better seeds, even the promoters have gotten in on the action with late and and skipped payouts, manipulating brackets and draws, even harrassing or leveraging players....and ALL THIS is done without anyone ever paying the price for their wrongdoings.

In a professional world, your ass would be on the street at the first sign of impropriety or damaging the company name, image, or pocketbook. In pro sports your ass would get heavily fined, you would miss games, and your wallet, stats, future eligibility and sponsorships would all be at stake.

Jay made mention of some of the hardcore shit that goes on the world of big business every single day, and you know what? He's right. Even the great and powerful Brunswick corporation, who built the tables we have played on endless times, is guilty of blacklisting players, pulling the rug out from under their own family, and even the industry at large, to satisfy their own bottom lines. And did we turn a blind eye? Don't ask don't tell?

I don't know about you, but I can clearly see that something needs to be done, to bring things back into an orderly, respectable and reliable state, for the benefit of the entire industry, and it needs to start with the public figures of our game, the ambassadors, the heroes and would-be example setters - which is the top players themselves. So if a line needs to be drawn in the sand, if some heads have to be thumped, some toes need to be stepped on and some feelings have to be hurt, then so be it.

I'm not here to tell you that the " right" decisions were or are being made, but I am here to tell you that we need changes now more than ever.

I couldn't agree more. I was already a fan from listening to you on ABR, but I enjoy even more your written opinions. That's certainly not a critique, as I got a C- in public speaking. It's much easier to be behind the camera for me. Look forward to the latest installment of ABR tonight. Rock on, Brother Bond.

Cameron Smith · Aug 13, 2015

JCIN said:
In his HOF speech Barry said basically there is no TV to be had for pool in the U.S. and because of that no chance of doing anything. He intimated that he doesnt like ESPN for what they did to the pool product on TV here. It has no value now.

I always talk about pool being desperate for leaders...after watching one speech from Barry I was ready to run through a wall for the guy. If he or someone like him ever does come into pool it wont all be roses but there will be a plan and long term goals with a set way to get there. Hope I see it one day.

I read a book a while ago that detailed the rise of snooker and focused very much on Barry Hearns efforts in the 80's. One of the stand out stories regarded Barry's efforts to bring on Rolex as a sponsor for his stable of players, if remember rightly. He convinced them by stating that the wrist is the most visible part of a snooker player and would be the perfect adverisement throughout the match by showing off the watch on every shot.

We need people like him for sure. Someone with a solid and measurable plan. If however he or someone else of his talent took the reigns, not everyone will like the direction and we would likely lose some players.

spartan · Aug 13, 2015

Mr. Bond said:
Everyone involved in the recent CSI " incidents" had a choice. All players, and indeed everyone on earth has a choice. Sometimes you might hear the phrase " choose your battles"...

Rodney had a choice, Ralph had a choice, Oscar, Ray, Skylar, Ozzy....they made their choices and they will live with them. So let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That being said, if you look at the bigger picture, there is a pattern forming here. And this pattern is something that many of you may not have ever witnessed before in the pool world, which is accountability and consequences for your actions. Consequences that are sometimes good and sometimes bad, but they are consequences all the same.

An entire generation of pool players, and fans, have grown up in a chaotic world, without authority, where anything can and does happen. Players dump, make savers, sandbag, cheat and lie, quit during events, dis the promoter, dis the sponsors, dis the TD, dress like bums, show up late, show up drunk or high, miss matches altogether, throw their equipment and tantrums, backtalk and freely slander each other - including minorities, women and anyone else they hate, beg for free entries and better seeds, even the promoters have gotten in on the action with late and and skipped payouts, manipulating brackets and draws, even harrassing or leveraging players....and ALL THIS is done without anyone ever paying the price for their wrongdoings.

In a professional world, your ass would be on the street at the first sign of impropriety or damaging the company name, image, or pocketbook. In pro sports your ass would get heavily fined, you would miss games, and your wallet, stats, future eligibility and sponsorships would all be at stake.

Jay made mention of some of the hardcore shit that goes on the world of big business every single day, and you know what? He's right. Even the great and powerful Brunswick corporation, who built the tables we have played on endless times, is guilty of blacklisting players, pulling the rug out from under their own family, and even the industry at large, to satisfy their own bottom lines. And did we turn a blind eye? Don't ask don't tell?

I don't know about you, but I can clearly see that something needs to be done, to bring things back into an orderly, respectable and reliable state, for the benefit of the entire industry, and it needs to start with the public figures of our game, the ambassadors, the heroes and would-be example setters - which is the top players themselves. So if a line needs to be drawn in the sand, if some heads have to be thumped, some toes need to be stepped on and some feelings have to be hurt, then so be it.

I'm not here to tell you that the " right" decisions were or are being made, but I am here to tell you that we need changes now more than ever.

Nice post
It is the new normal.
Some companies (like in tech industry) get it. Some don't
In pool economy, demand side /consumer base is weak so suppliers have bigger bargaining power ( leading to statements like "it is my event and my money, I can do what I want", "Don't like my rules go start your own event")
Hubris sets in. For as long as the consumer base and demand remain low, there will be few significant competitors / events, consumers will have limited choices and therefore have little bargaining power and a reluctance to speak truth to power.
It is like Ford a century ago - "You can have any color as long as it is black". Such statements are unheard off and passe nowadays in automobile , tech and almost all sectors except in pool industry :grin-square:
It will undergo major changes- all industries do. That is if the consumer base hits a critical mass . Which is unlikely to happen very soon. :grin-square:

Johnnyt · Aug 13, 2015

The one thing the IPT showed us is the players will behave, dress nice, and follow the rules IF the money is there for them. Johnnyt

(((Satori))) · Aug 13, 2015

Johnnyt said:
The one thing the IPT showed us is the players will behave, dress nice, and follow the rules IF the money is there for them. Johnnyt

Bonus ball had the players united and working with the promoter too.

MahnaMahna · Aug 13, 2015

(((Satori))) said:
Bonus ball had the players united and working with the promoter too.

Lol
............

devorator · Aug 13, 2015

My eyes are burning...You guys really wasted 2 dictionaries in this thread. Funny tho...
I can only say this: USOpen 10ball was one of the most unorganized tournaments I've played.
CSI did a great job keeping everyone away from any information about the rules, regulations, restriction, dress code, format and so on and so forth....
They actually managed to keep all these away from their own referees as well. Funny thing was that simple questions addressed to these guys, by myself and my opponent as well, quickly became huge dilemmas and were managed only through their communicators.
Total disappointment for me... I won 1 against the top rated pro player BYE and lost 2 after that...at least i send BYE on the loosers side...loooooooseer

)

Now regarding this whole storm....
I don't see how one can have the audacity to defend himself in a post claiming that the other part "intentionally" tried to rob CSI out of their viewers? Their money match was set and posted 2 weeks before CSI even think of having the whatever Challenges they had... Very ugly bullying.
I don't get Jay H's point in defending CSI and claim that tournaments should go first for any players?! Jay, not long ago you were bragging in a commentary about how good and productive for pool scene is to gamble on big money around tournaments. You also mentioned that gambling makes this game more competitive and grabs more viewers everyday..weird huh? Anyway, if Denis would....ah forget it...
I won't mention every1 here but for FWIW
Neil gets the Lost in the thread Award! (

️so lost, it's hilarious)
JAM gets the Grammar Daddy Trophy! (

)
Ozzy is awarded with "I won't lie this time...shit I should've..." medal

Celtic gets the "I am calm ...my gun is loaded" award

Love you guys
Chris@2015

Ps JAM i am not native in english so please close your eyes and pretend that everything is spelled correctly

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Hidy Ho · Aug 13, 2015

JCIN said:
Considering this happened I would say I was correct.

View attachment 393302

so much better than True Detective .....

Kris_b1104 · Aug 13, 2015

Put_upor_shutup · Aug 14, 2015

JCIN said:
In his HOF speech Barry said basically there is no TV to be had for pool in the U.S. and because of that no chance of doing anything. He intimated that he doesnt like ESPN for what they did to the pool product on TV here. It has no value now.

I always talk about pool being desperate for leaders...after watching one speech from Barry I was ready to run through a wall for the guy. If he or someone like him ever does come into pool it wont all be roses but there will be a plan and long term goals with a set way to get there. Hope I see it one day.

can we get u to do a damn pool match already..If me and cleary have to play and pay u to stream it..From the first time I ever met ur partner(rip..That guy was awesome) I knew I was watching two guys who really did enjoy pool and while maybe trying to make a few buck as well yall were actually friends with the players and considered their interests..I knew I was watching two guys that really wanted to do something cool for pool.My hats off either way..Until we talk u into it again I guess its shots and shit talking..im going fishing..

I will also say this..i know yall have interest in bashing the man because he used to work for CSi and now is speaking out on this particular issue but I personally have watched him go to bat for Mark Griffin like no other and u can bet ur bottom dollar if he felt the opposite about this he would be on their side again even not being on the payroll..oh yeah im going fishing now..

and Jay ..Dippy owes 135 not 90..ha ha dont want the numbers getting messed up..off to fish..pics later..

JAM · Aug 14, 2015

Mr. Bond said:
Everyone involved in the recent CSI " incidents" had a choice. All players, and indeed everyone on earth has a choice. Sometimes you might hear the phrase " choose your battles"...

Rodney had a choice, Ralph had a choice, Oscar, Ray, Skylar, Ozzy....they made their choices and they will live with them. So let he who is without sin, cast the first stone.

That being said, if you look at the bigger picture, there is a pattern forming here. And this pattern is something that many of you may not have ever witnessed before in the pool world, which is accountability and consequences for your actions. Consequences that are sometimes good and sometimes bad, but they are consequences all the same.

An entire generation of pool players, and fans, have grown up in a chaotic world, without authority, where anything can and does happen. Players dump, make savers, sandbag, cheat and lie, quit during events, dis the promoter, dis the sponsors, dis the TD, dress like bums, show up late, show up drunk or high, miss matches altogether, throw their equipment and tantrums, backtalk and freely slander each other - including minorities, women and anyone else they hate, beg for free entries and better seeds, even the promoters have gotten in on the action with late and and skipped payouts, manipulating brackets and draws, even harrassing or leveraging players....and ALL THIS is done without anyone ever paying the price for their wrongdoings.

In a professional world, your ass would be on the street at the first sign of impropriety or damaging the company name, image, or pocketbook. In pro sports your ass would get heavily fined, you would miss games, and your wallet, stats, future eligibility and sponsorships would all be at stake.

Jay made mention of some of the hardcore shit that goes on the world of big business every single day, and you know what? He's right. Even the great and powerful Brunswick corporation, who built the tables we have played on endless times, is guilty of blacklisting players, pulling the rug out from under their own family, and even the industry at large, to satisfy their own bottom lines. And did we turn a blind eye? Don't ask don't tell?

I don't know about you, but I can clearly see that something needs to be done, to bring things back into an orderly, respectable and reliable state, for the benefit of the entire industry, and it needs to start with the public figures of our game, the ambassadors, the heroes and would-be example setters - which is the top players themselves. So if a line needs to be drawn in the sand, if some heads have to be thumped, some toes need to be stepped on and some feelings have to be hurt, then so be it.

I'm not here to tell you that the " right" decisions were or are being made, but I am here to tell you that we need changes now more than ever.

Excellent read! You have shared some great ideas.

JAM · Aug 14, 2015

Hidy Ho said:
so much better than True Detective .....

Oh, man, that series really sucked this year. Big disappointment! I still don't know what happened and why.

A Huge Thank You from CueSports International (CSI)!

Faster Than You...

AzB Silver Member

Orbis Non Sufficit

Faster Than You...

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

is kind of hungry...

TheActionReport.com

Registered

is kind of hungry...

AzB Silver Member

Burn all jump cues

AzB Silver Member

Beefcake. BEEFCAKE!!

Ipoolmyheart@thetable

Missed 4 rail hanger!!!

House Pro in my own home.

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member