"deep knowledge" or pool hall hokum?
shout to the kid tho..I enjoy his stroke and patter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGhWZAu31hk
shout to the kid tho..I enjoy his stroke and patter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGhWZAu31hk
"deep knowledge" or pool hall hokum?
shout to the kid tho..I enjoy his stroke and patter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGhWZAu31hk
I think you already know which it is."deep knowledge" or pool hall hokum? ...
I think you already know which it is.
The interesting part of this is that I think he really believes what he is saying.
It would be amusing to sneak in a weighted-ferrule shaft on him and see if he still hits that cut shot with outside spin too thin.
You don't "have to" snap your wrist, but if you can do it accurately enough it can add a little speed to the stroke.Uh......what?????
You have to "Snap Your Wrist" to get draw?
You have to "Aim 3-4 inches left of the pocket" to make this shot?
I am really curious what posters think about this type of instruction.
r/DCP
You don't "have to" snap your wrist, but if you can do it accurately enough it can add a little speed to the stroke.
Aiming a little to the side to compensate for spin-induced throw is legitimate, but Kid's shot doesn't really throw as far as he thinks (the high speed and back spin both reduce the throw).
pj
chgo
If you rest your lower arm against something, such as the edge of your dining table, to keep your lower arm from moving at all, and you use just your wrist to move a cue stick, I think you will find that you can get some forward motion into the cue stick. So the simple answer is as Pat said, yes, you can get a tiny little bit of extra speed on the cue ball if you snap your wrist at exactly the correct time.... not to say I'm not doubtful, but to be clear-
can wrist-snapping have an (extra) effect on what happens to the cb?
...
If you rest your lower arm against something, such as the edge of your dining table, to keep your lower arm from moving at all, and you use just your wrist to move a cue stick, I think you will find that you can get some forward motion into the cue stick. So the simple answer is as Pat said, yes, you can get a tiny little bit of extra speed on the cue ball if you snap your wrist at exactly the correct time.
As far as getting some "special wrist juice" on the cue ball, if that's what you mean by extra effect, then no.
There are some people who talk about the four, or the six or the 733 different special strokes. I think you will be better off not to listen to such people.
Kid's shot doesn't really throw as far as he thinks (the high speed and back spin both reduce the throw).
"deep knowledge" or pool hall hokum?
shout to the kid tho..I enjoy his stroke and patter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGhWZAu31hk
This Kid Delicious zinger shot reminds me of a TAR podcast with Fransisco
https://youtu.be/6Y2qoCtdiak
One of the interviewer was trying to tell Fransisco that he had to make allowance for deflection on the cue ball, in direct contradiction of Fransisco telling him he needs to adjust his aim in the opposite direction, to counter the cb spin. Now go back and listen carefully to Delcious’s description, his action and the description involves “snapping your wrist, a little bit, at the end of the stroke.....”. Think about that. He is describing a timed stroke, an accelerated delivery through the ball. Watch the shot. His cue ends up on an angled plane touching the table bed.
During the recent World Snooker Championship, Ronnie O’Sullivan, made repeated references to his cue action.
https://youtu.be/S6em4pblhcM
This link is an interview where he talks about timing being the key. I can’t find the clip where he is air stroking his cue action, in his chair, feeling the movement and you can see his hand snapping forward through the contact phase, similar to KD. Ronnie and Stephen Lee talk about feeling the tip bite into the ball. The downward plane contact creates resistance as the ball is driven into the bed. Mike Segal mentions about using a downward angle stroke. The extended contact created adds a feel element not there on horizontal delivery.
During a post final interview he mentions the feel of penetrating the ball.
[https://youtu.be/Tb8dql4PuXA
That feel is part of what is there when he is in stroke. Players who advocate a horizontal delivery are recommending a multi-plane approach to the game. Many positions, such as any time the rail is involved, must deal with a downward cue plane at the contact point. The impact of the rail is less on a bigger table because of a larger surface. Despite that, Del Hill, World Snooker’s Honorary Coach, and several of his World Snooker Champion students, simplify the game by adopting a downward angle approach as a central principle. For them a level stroke involves extending the cue travel on a straight line based on its plane at contact. A fixed elbow can’t deliver the cue through on plane. Ronnie became one of Del’s disciples at an early age. Then Ray Reardon even increased that down plane angle by convincing Ronnie to shorten his bridge.
A downward plane contact changes how the ball deflects. Longer tip contact keeps the cue ball on the original cue force line longer because of prolonged friction based directional momentum. The normal deflection angle of applied side is blunted by the fact the ball needs to overcome cloth/table resistance first. The cue ball travels on a more cue direction friction forced path. That said the english subsequently imparted on the ball is exaggerated. Massè is an extreme example. The resistance allows the gripping penetration of the tip to impart more spin. A drag shot works on the same principle, using a lesser angle. More force can and often must be used to overcome the increased resistance, and get the desired outcome.
Relating this back to the Kid Delicious and Fransisco B shots, the takeaway is that the extra resistance generated by the downward stroke increases the spin generated throw and minimizes the deflection comparatively. Ronnie talked about moving closer to the table helped him when he was off stroke. It improved his timing. It also increases his downward plane slightly on many shots adding to the resistance feel. Eventually he made a grip adjustment, during a one hour troubleshooting session, that brought back his timing.
A horizontal delivery through contact complicates things when timing and feel is needed. It requires different adjustments for spin and deflection. Since a horizontal delivery is not possible on all shots and a downward plane is, the practitioners of Del Hill’s methods seek a different kind of consistency, with fewer adjustments.
In a sense, yes. It’s because some of the sideways ball/ball friction that causes throw has been diverted to vertical friction. The same total amount of friction is now divided into two directions.hi pat
does the back spin reduce the throw because the cb back spin makes the ob roll forward?
That's correct but let me rephrase it a little.In a sense, yes. It’s because some of the sideways ball/ball friction that causes throw has been diverted to vertical friction. The same total amount of friction is now divided into two directions.
pj
chgo
You don't "have to" snap your wrist, but if you can do it accurately enough it can add a little speed to the stroke.
Aiming a little to the side to compensate for spin-induced throw is legitimate, but Kid's shot doesn't really throw as far as he thinks (the high speed and back spin both reduce the throw).
pj
chgo
"deep knowledge" or pool hall hokum?
shout to the kid tho..I enjoy his stroke and patter
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGhWZAu31hk
Now you tell me....you better not be thinking of the 0.0423 coefficient of friction reduced by the cosine of the rubbing angle to 0.0377 while you are playing a shot.
Better late than never.:thumbup:Now you tell me.
pj <- try not to think of an elephant
chgo
hey 'mac, thanks for the shout
not sure I get the "horizontal delivery" biz
is that aiming center axis, but shooting with english?
-back hand english?
I looked at kid's shot again, but in slo-mo
interestingly, he does seem to snap the wrist to the cb
and shortens his stroke on the way
of course just because he's doing it, doesn't mean it helps the shot
I still fail to see how it would, tho visually I admit the wrist-snap is attractive
With a pendulum stroke the elbow is fixed, so the grip hand (and therefore the tip) travels in an arc, not in a straight horizontal line. I think you’re right that perfectly straight tip movement would be ideal, but I doubt that anybody thinks that’s what they get with a pendulum stroke.Horizontal delivery relates to a mental construct that pendulum players imagine is theoretically ideal. The cue tip travels parallel to and above the horizontal table bed, through the contact point on the cb.
With a pendulum stroke the elbow is fixed, so the grip hand (and therefore the tip) travels in an arc, not in a straight horizontal line. I think you’re right that perfectly straight tip movement would be ideal, but I doubt that anybody thinks that’s what they get with a pendulum stroke.
pj
chgo