One Pocket break secrets

BmoreMoney · Apr 19, 2016

The wing ball thread got me to thinking about this. I've never seen or heard any " secrets " or methods to increase odds on making a ball on a one pocket break. Now I'm not talking about doing ANYTHING to the rack I'm strictly talking about a completely tight, correctly placed, not tilted rack. I'd say I probably average making a ball about 1 in 10 racks. Unlike 9 ball I actually used to spend some time practicing my one pocket break and have experimented every way I could think of. End result was when I make a ball I am just hitting it with my regular old go to break and sometimes it goes, most of the time it doesnt. One other thing I've noticed is aside from actually making the ball, the break never seems to be anywhere near as good as I get most of the rest of the time. Any thoughts on what I'm talking about. Any proven go to methods for increasing % of making a ball on the break. While obviously this is not that often but there's no better feeling than a break and run in one hole - and that can really deflate your oponent.

djkx1 · Apr 19, 2016

I don't play much 1P but I have also noticed that when I make a ball on the break it usually isn't a great break aside from making a ball.
I'm guessing if there was a secret to making the ball without selling out at a high percentage then Corey would have been doing it already. Not to mention Efren or any of the all time greats.
I think the break, like most of one pocket, is all about risk/reward.

Get_A_Grip · Apr 19, 2016

I don't really play 1 pocket, but when I practice playing against myself, I've noticed that a ball will go in more often if I hit too much of the second ball. Hitting too much of the second ball seems to also allow for a ball to leak out more towards the opponent's pocket....so take it for what it's worth....which is probably not much...

bbb · Apr 19, 2016

usually to increase your chances of making a ball on the onepocket break you have to hit the second ball fat and not clip the head ball
if you dont make a ball you dont get the desired spread when you clip the head ball
its a low percentage shot
and not one to kill yourself trying to perfect
jmho
icbw

lfigueroa · Apr 19, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
The wing ball thread got me to thinking about this. I've never seen or heard any " secrets " or methods to increase odds on making a ball on a one pocket break. Now I'm not talking about doing ANYTHING to the rack I'm strictly talking about a completely tight, correctly placed, not tilted rack. I'd say I probably average making a ball about 1 in 10 racks. Unlike 9 ball I actually used to spend some time practicing my one pocket break and have experimented every way I could think of. End result was when I make a ball I am just hitting it with my regular old go to break and sometimes it goes, most of the time it doesnt. One other thing I've noticed is aside from actually making the ball, the break never seems to be anywhere near as good as I get most of the rest of the time. Any thoughts on what I'm talking about. Any proven go to methods for increasing % of making a ball on the break. While obviously this is not that often but there's no better feeling than a break and run in one hole - and that can really deflate your oponent.

My personal experience is that -- if the rack is legit-- there is no predictable way to go for the ball on the break. I believe that what happens, sometimes, is that the balls fall into a certain set of divots in the cloth and good, sometimes bad, things happen more often than they normally would.

I have also learned, over time, that some guys, without malice or forethought, rack the balls in a way that increases the odds of a ball coming out. When I see a guy racking that way, I will not let them rack for me. But that's another story.

Lou Figueroa
gonna write
a book someday

ENGLISH! · Apr 19, 2016

I've not been playing 1pocket long but I think the hit that pockets a ball is to hit the apex & 2nd ball simultaneously & with a bit of inside spin & coming from right off the rail behind the string.

Like bbb/Larry said it is a bit of a risky shot & speed & hit can be vital to not actually sell out so one usually favors hitting more of the apex ball.

Naturally there is no guarantee even if hit right depending on the rack.

BmoreMoney · Apr 19, 2016

lfigueroa said:
My personal experience is that -- if the rack is legit-- there is no predictable way to go for the ball on the break. I believe that what happens, sometimes, is that the balls fall into a certain set of divots in the cloth and good, sometimes bad, things happen more often than they normally would.

I have also learned, over time, that some guys, without malice or forethought, rack the balls in a way that increases the odds of a ball coming out. When I see a guy racking that way, I will not let them rack for me. But that's another story.

Lou Figueroa
gonna write
a book someday

Lou, what are the advantages / disadvantages of a tilted rack? And which way is it tilted? I ask because I always give a good rack but there's always someone that says " that racks tilted! " I can honestly say 99 out of a 100 times I can't see any tilt whatsoever but I'll rerack just to make them happy. I wasn't even aware a tilted rack would be a benefit to anyone but for the sake of conversation what do you think they think will happen???

Get_A_Grip said:
I don't really play 1 pocket, but when I practice playing against myself, I've noticed that a ball will go in more often if I hit too much of the second ball. Hitting too much of the second ball seems to also allow for a ball to leak out more towards the opponent's pocket....so take it for what it's worth....which is probably not much...

Yeah now that you mention that's true. I think just about every time I've made a ball on my break there is always a ball that pops out close to their hole too. Not that this is a huge secret and I'd guess this is how most people break anyway, I shoot for roughly one third of head ball - two thirds second ball and use as much high right as I can reliably use. Also as mentioned when making a ball for the most part the rack stays very tight - a ball goes in your hole, a ball pops out relatively close to their hole, and maybe one or two balls to the bottom rail but usually not much to the long rail on my side. I think just about every time I've had a break and run I've had to do a straight pool type breakout on my second or third shot.

AtLarge · Apr 19, 2016

In a streamed match at the US Open yesterday, SVB broke with a one-rail kick into the long rail. Nope, he didn't make a ball. :smile:

BmoreMoney · Apr 19, 2016

AtLarge said:
In a streamed match at the US Open yesterday, SVB broke with a one-rail kick into the long rail. Nope, he didn't make a ball. :smile:

I remember back in the 90's a couple people at my pool room started breaking like that and pissued everyone off to no end lol because none of us had ever seen that break and no one knew how to reliably get out of it. It was just a trend and didn't last too long once everyone started getting out of it and it doesn't give you as nice a spread as a traditional style break. It was really really funny at first though watching people flip out, " THATS ILLEGAL!!!!, THATS A FOUL!!!, YOU OWE A BALL!!! " LOL. People were breaking the rule books right and left. Of course it's not a foul as long as the same number of balls git a rail, just an extra object ball in place of the cue ball hitiing.

AtLarge · Apr 19, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
I remember back in the 90's a couple people at my pool room started breaking like that and pissued everyone off to no end lol because none of us had ever seen that break and no one knew how to reliably get out of it. It was just a trend and didn't last too long once everyone started getting out of it and it doesn't give you as nice a spread as a traditional style break. It was really really funny at first though watching people flip out, " THATS ILLEGAL!!!!, THATS A FOUL!!!, YOU OWE A BALL!!! " LOL. People were breaking the rule books right and left. Of course it's not a foul as long as the same number of balls git a rail, just an extra object ball in place of the cue ball hitiing.

According to today's "Official One Pocket Rules" on OnePocket.org, after the CB contacts a ball on the opening break, just one ball has to hit a rail, and it can be an OB or the CB:

"2.2 The opening break begins with ball in hand behind the head string. On the break, the cue ball may contact either a cushion or any ball in the rack first, but in either case, after contacting at least one ball, an object ball must be pocketed, or the cue ball or at least one object ball must contact a rail, otherwise it is a one foul penalty. As long as a legal stroke is employed from behind the head string on the break, the incoming player must play the balls where they lie – there are no re-racks for a pocket scratch or failure to contact a cushion or pocket a ball on the break."

BmoreMoney · Apr 19, 2016

AtLarge said:
According to today's "Official One Pocket Rules" on OnePocket.org, after the CB contacts a ball on the opening break, just one ball has to hit a rail, and it can be an OB or the CB:

"2.2 The opening break begins with ball in hand behind the head string. On the break, the cue ball may contact either a cushion or any ball in the rack first, but in either case, after contacting at least one ball, an object ball must be pocketed, or the cue ball or at least one object ball must contact a rail, otherwise it is a one foul penalty. As long as a legal stroke is employed from behind the head string on the break, the incoming player must play the balls where they lie – there are no re-racks for a pocket scratch or failure to contact a cushion or pocket a ball on the break."

Cool, I'll take your word on it - I haven't looked at a rule book in probably 20 years lol. I definitely could be wrong but I had it in my head for some reason it used to be 2 balls - OB and either a CB or a second OB. I never really cared too much for the rail first break. I always got better results from the regular break.

mattb · Apr 19, 2016

I can increase my chances significantly by catching more of the second ball, a touch more right hand English on the cue ball and a bit more power in the break. The problem is I risk selling out a ball or more towards my opponents hole if I do not make it.

It's a slippery slope.

Buckzapper · Apr 20, 2016

Perhaps one of the rack manipulation experts, Mike Dechaine or Dennis Orcollo, will offer some advice. From what I've seen of their 9 ball racking, touching balls with your fingers after the rack has been removed is key to creating spaces between balls and deadening up wing balls. When you do this, nobody will notice you're placing the balls in the same numerical sequence every rack.

bbb · Apr 20, 2016

ENGLISH! said:
I've not been playing 1pocket long but I think the hit that pockets a ball is to hit the apex & 2nd ball simultaneously & with a bit of inside spin & coming from right off the rail behind the string.

Like bbb/Larry said it is a bit of a risky shot & speed & hit can be vital to not actually sell out so one usually favors hitting more of the apex ball.

Naturally there is no guarantee even if hit right depending on the rack.

mattb;5527219[SIZE="2" said:
]I can increase my chances significantly by catching more of the second ball[/SIZE], a touch more right hand English on the cue ball and a bit more power in the break. The problem is I risk selling out a ball or more towards my opponents hole if I do not make it.

It's a slippery slope.

rick
thats the best way to break in 1p.(normal/standard break)
as mattb said
hitting the 2nd ball fat is the way to increase your odds of making a ball

lfigueroa · Apr 20, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
Lou, what are the advantages / disadvantages of a tilted rack? And which way is it tilted? I ask because I always give a good rack but there's always someone that says " that racks tilted! " I can honestly say 99 out of a 100 times I can't see any tilt whatsoever but I'll rerack just to make them happy. I wasn't even aware a tilted rack would be a benefit to anyone but for the sake of conversation what do you think they think will happen???

I believe that if a rack is tilted towards the breaker there is an increased chance of catching the corner ball and scratching or at least not having the CB travel down the long rail, as we all aspire.

Some guys just don't see the spot, rack, balls, whatever, right and will always, just slightly tilt the rack one way or the other. Sometimes the spot has not been placed properly on the table and it favors one side or the other.

You can neutralize some of this by changing sides (sometimes after waiting at the other side of the table while the balls are being racked and switching at the last moment

, or by using different break shots or hits on the CB.

Lou Figueroa

bbb · Apr 20, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
Lou, what are the advantages / disadvantages of a tilted rack? And which way is it tilted? I ask because I always give a good rack but there's always someone that says " that racks tilted! " I can honestly say 99 out of a 100 times I can't see any tilt whatsoever but I'll rerack just to make them happy. I wasn't even aware a tilted rack would be a benefit to anyone but for the sake of conversation what do you think they think will happen???
.

think about what happens on the break
you hit the side of the rack
the cue ball slides down the rack and hits the short rail near your opponent pocket
if the rack was tilted out towards your opponents pocket
it would help steer the cue ball into the opponents pocket ie SCRATCH instead of the cue ball hitting the short rail
the opposite if the rack is tilted to the breakers pocket would make it much less likely to scratch

lfigueroa · Apr 20, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
I remember back in the 90's a couple people at my pool room started breaking like that and pissued everyone off to no end lol because none of us had ever seen that break and no one knew how to reliably get out of it. It was just a trend and didn't last too long once everyone started getting out of it and it doesn't give you as nice a spread as a traditional style break. It was really really funny at first though watching people flip out, " THATS ILLEGAL!!!!, THATS A FOUL!!!, YOU OWE A BALL!!! " LOL. People were breaking the rule books right and left. Of course it's not a foul as long as the same number of balls git a rail, just an extra object ball in place of the cue ball hitiing.

It's legal. There's also the break shot where you just gently shoot slightly to one side of the head ball and freeze the CB to it.

Lou Figueroa

lfigueroa · Apr 20, 2016

Buckzapper said:
Perhaps one of the rack manipulation experts, Mike Dechaine or Dennis Orcollo, will offer some advice. From what I've seen of their 9 ball racking, touching balls with your fingers after the rack has been removed is key to creating spaces between balls and deadening up wing balls. When you do this, nobody will notice you're placing the balls in the same numerical sequence every rack.

There can be some subtle things done on the break. Ferinstance, some guys racking their own will be sure to use higher number balls in front because those don't get used as much (vs 9ball/10ball) and have fewer miles on them, the theory being they will provide a more consistent break. Others will be sure to place contrasting colors up front for a better target.

Lou Figueroa

ChopStick · Apr 20, 2016

BmoreMoney said:
The wing ball thread got me to thinking about this. I've never seen or heard any " secrets " or methods to increase odds on making a ball on a one pocket break. Now I'm not talking about doing ANYTHING to the rack I'm strictly talking about a completely tight, correctly placed, not tilted rack. I'd say I probably average making a ball about 1 in 10 racks. Unlike 9 ball I actually used to spend some time practicing my one pocket break and have experimented every way I could think of. End result was when I make a ball I am just hitting it with my regular old go to break and sometimes it goes, most of the time it doesnt. One other thing I've noticed is aside from actually making the ball, the break never seems to be anywhere near as good as I get most of the rest of the time. Any thoughts on what I'm talking about. Any proven go to methods for increasing % of making a ball on the break. While obviously this is not that often but there's no better feeling than a break and run in one hole - and that can really deflate your oponent.

I posted the method for making a ball on a one pocket break years ago, here and on one pocket.org. It was in Wei table format so my diagrams which were detailed are gone. There is a spot near the side pocket where you can place the cueball and make the corner ball almost every time. It worked reliably on Diamond tables. I have run out from the break many times using it.

Fenwick · Apr 20, 2016

lfigueroa said:
It's legal. There's also the break shot where you just gently shoot slightly to one side of the head ball and freeze the CB to it.

Lou Figueroa

I don't play much one pocket but I watch. Saw the break you described this past Monday. First time I ever saw it. I was impressed.

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