Tip shaping

If you keep having to shape your tip, have a review of your chalking habits. That accounts for the vast majority of your tips shape, assuming it was competently installed and you're past the initial break in period. Don rub across the tip, and don't screw. Just paint the edges of the tip. It will keep the rounder shape much longer this way.

KMRUNOUT


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tip eaters

hasu said:

I use a Willard dime radius shaper to scuff and shape my tip. When I use it, I can tell how close it is to the dime shape by how much of the tip is still blue. The longer I shape it the less blue there is left. See image:

https://imgur.com/CTzyIG3

If I continue to shape it until the blue is all gone, then it will have the ideal dime shape. But to do so, I always have to shape it for quite a while, and I end up losing a fair amount of the tip. If I always re-shaped it back to the ideal dime shape, I feel like I would go through tips really fast.

How does everyone else deal with this?

And, on a related note, how do people judge when a layered tip is ready to be replaced? For example, the victory tip I have on this shaft arrived with 5 visible layers. After enough use and shaping, there will eventually be fewer visible layers. How many visible layers do people consider to be too few?

Click to expand...

When you have a tip put on your shaft tell the installer what you want. He should cut that radius on the stick and burnish the sides of the tip. It may mushroom a time or two, if it mushrooms badly it will need refacing too but you are probably best off trashing that tip.

Look at the actual difference in radius between a nickle and dime radius in the distance out you can hit the cue ball. Is a nickle or dime difference going to matter anywhere but in your head? Your playing style will largely shape the tip to how you play. Let it and don't worry much about the tip. When you are unhappy with how it plays, replace it. Two full layers might be a general rule of thumb but that is all it is, a general rule of thumb.

You can grind away a layered tip in a session or two with a Willard tool, about the same mileage with a single layer. They are great tip eaters. Or, you can get a tool like my old BRAD tool and roll dents in your tip now and then, I use a tip for years.

Hu

hasu said:

I use a Willard dime radius shaper to scuff and shape my tip. When I use it, I can tell how close it is to the dime shape by how much of the tip is still blue. The longer I shape it the less blue there is left. See image:

https://imgur.com/CTzyIG3

If I continue to shape it until the blue is all gone, then it will have the ideal dime shape. But to do so, I always have to shape it for quite a while, and I end up losing a fair amount of the tip. If I always re-shaped it back to the ideal dime shape, I feel like I would go through tips really fast.

How does everyone else deal with this?

And, on a related note, how do people judge when a layered tip is ready to be replaced? For example, the victory tip I have on this shaft arrived with 5 visible layers. After enough use and shaping, there will eventually be fewer visible layers. How many visible layers do people consider to be too few?

Click to expand...

If you want tips to last longer, go with harder tips or a nickel shape instead of dime.

I use a dime and tips last me months on end and I play roughly 25 to 30 hours a week.

The tip with the blue on it in the photo is just fine as shown. There is no reason the center of your tip needs to be anything but flat. Center ball doesn't need a radius. Think about it.


JC

ShootingArts said:

When you have a tip put on your shaft tell the installer what you want. He should cut that radius on the stick and burnish the sides of the tip. It may mushroom a time or two, if it mushrooms badly it will need refacing too but you are probably best off trashing that tip.

Look at the actual difference in radius between a nickle and dime radius in the distance out you can hit the cue ball. Is a nickle or dime difference going to matter anywhere but in your head? Your playing style will largely shape the tip to how you play. Let it and don't worry much about the tip. When you are unhappy with how it plays, replace it. Two full layers might be a general rule of thumb but that is all it is, a general rule of thumb.

You can grind away a layered tip in a session or two with a Willard tool, about the same mileage with a single layer. They are great tip eaters. Or, you can get a tool like my old BRAD tool and roll dents in your tip now and then, I use a tip for years.

Hu

Click to expand...

Do you use steel tips or just never play?

JC said:

The tip with the blue on it in the photo is just fine as shown. There is no reason the center of your tip needs to be anything but flat. Center ball doesn't need a radius. Think about it.


JC

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I just took time to look at it and I agree, there is absolutely nothing wrong with his tip. And yes, the center of tip can be completely flat but in general, most all players RARELY use the center of their tip..... very rarely.

dragon foreskin

jrctherake said:

Do you use steel tips or just never play?

Click to expand...

I am the exclusive northern hemisphere distributor for some little known tips made from dragon foreskin. Being a limited availability item they aren't too well known and are quite pricey.

Hu

ShootingArts said:

When you have a tip put on your shaft tell the installer what you want. He should cut that radius on the stick and burnish the sides of the tip. It may mushroom a time or two, if it mushrooms badly it will need refacing too but you are probably best off trashing that tip.

Look at the actual difference in radius between a nickle and dime radius in the distance out you can hit the cue ball. Is a nickle or dime difference going to matter anywhere but in your head? Your playing style will largely shape the tip to how you play. Let it and don't worry much about the tip. When you are unhappy with how it plays, replace it. Two full layers might be a general rule of thumb but that is all it is, a general rule of thumb.

You can grind away a layered tip in a session or two with a Willard tool, about the same mileage with a single layer. They are great tip eaters. Or, you can get a tool like my old BRAD tool and roll dents in your tip now and then, I use a tip for years.

Hu

Click to expand...

This^^^^^ And I didn't even read the question.

Roll the tip across the tool, Never move the tool.

Of course this advise is after a completed install. Installing stuff is in another thread.

hasu said:

I end up losing a fair amount of the tip. If I always re-shaped it back to the ideal dime shape, I feel like I would go through tips really fast.

How does everyone else deal with this?

Click to expand...

You're not the only one. I did it this way when I was young. Wore out tips quickly by constantly scuffing and shaping them.

You don't have to. On a new tip, shape it however you like, then leave it. It will very likely shape to about a nickel shape, which is fine. You don't have to obsess over it, and constantly scuff it. Just chalk it by brushing it, and it'll be fine. And, your tips will last longer.

Cue tips are like guns. You can kill them with kindness.

All the best,
WW

ShootingArts said:

I am the exclusive northern hemisphere distributor for some little known tips made from dragon foreskin. Being a limited availability item they aren't too well known and are quite pricey.

Hu

Click to expand...

How do you get the dragon foreskin and about how many tips can be made from "one" foreskin?

JC said:

The tip with the blue on it in the photo is just fine as shown. There is no reason the center of your tip needs to be anything but flat. Center ball doesn't need a radius. Think about it.





JC

Click to expand...

Agree with JC. You may want to “roll” the Willard shaper over the crown just to give a rough surface to accept chalk for aesthetics but the shape is fine and true.

I have ground many tips down, with a Willard shaper, looking for that perfect shape. Rolling the shaft over my thighs until the last of the blue is gone. Wasted my tips. IMO, not necessary.


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hasu said:

I use a Willard dime radius shaper to scuff and shape my tip. When I use it, I can tell how close it is to the dime shape by how much of the tip is still blue. The longer I shape it the less blue there is left. See image:

https://imgur.com/CTzyIG3

If I continue to shape it until the blue is all gone, then it will have the ideal dime shape. But to do so, I always have to shape it for quite a while, and I end up losing a fair amount of the tip. If I always re-shaped it back to the ideal dime shape, I feel like I would go through tips really fast.

How does everyone else deal with this?

And, on a related note, how do people judge when a layered tip is ready to be replaced? For example, the victory tip I have on this shaft arrived with 5 visible layers. After enough use and shaping, there will eventually be fewer visible layers. How many visible layers do people consider to be too few?

Click to expand...

Good question. I have a tip shaper that does the same thing. If you want the center to be round you have to grind off about half of the tip which isn't worth it. I always just shape the edges and leave the top flat as shown in your picture. The tip plays fine that way. The only maintenance you'll need is to shave off the mushroomed edges every once in a while. Otherwise it usually keeps its shape.

Regarding when to change the tip, it's all preference. The tip gets harder as it gets older. Many people like the feel of an older, broken in tip, so they won't change their tip until it's almost down to the ferrule.

try scuffing the blue part that remains after you are satisfied with the general shape

JC said:

The tip with the blue on it in the photo is just fine as shown. There is no reason the center of your tip needs to be anything but flat. Center ball doesn't need a radius. Think about it.


JC

Click to expand...

I agree with this and I play with less than a nickle radius. I would never play with a dime. The cue ball is easier to control without all the curvature.

hasu said:

I use a Willard dime radius shaper <snip> But to do so, I always have to shape it for quite a while, and I end up losing a fair amount of the tip. If I always re-shaped it back to the ideal dime shape, I feel like I would go through tips really fast.

How does everyone else deal with this?

And, on a related note, how do people judge when a layered tip is ready to be replaced?

Click to expand...

Use a harer tip. I use a hard tip on my play cue and XX hard on my break cue. I play about 8 hours a week, and replace my tip about once every other year. I only do tip maintenance about 4 times a year.

A tip is ready to be replaced when there is less than 1mm of thickness at the edge of
the hitting surface to the edge of the ferrule.

I get them from my supplier

jrctherake said:

How do you get the dragon foreskin and about how many tips can be made from "one" foreskin?

Click to expand...

Nice thing about being the distributor, I don't have to harvest them or process the leather! Rumor has it that the dragons are extremely rare and only found in a "no contact" area of a rain forest. Could be true, could be the supplier protecting his sources. These tips were first called "french elk" back in the mid-eighties. They were perhaps invented by a cajun who lived deep in a swamp near Prairieville LA. Suppliers aren't always the most honest!

By using single layer tips and rolling dents into the tip to hold chalk instead of chewing through layers of a tip with a tool that damages the leather tips last far longer. Add a playing style that very rarely uses extreme spin and I don't put much wear and tear on a tip. Don't play much these days but the tips lasted for years when I played over fifty hours a week too.

Back then ask a top player what tip he used and the most common answer was "I don't know, it was on the shaft when I bought the stick" occasionally "I had Joe put a tip on for me, don't know what it is."

A freshly chalked piece of pretty much any leather with a little curvature on it will work just fine but that would hardly justify today's tip prices, would it? I use my own duds pressed back down to about the height they were before soaking.

Hu

ShootingArts said:

Nice thing about being the distributor, I don't have to harvest them or process the leather! Rumor has it that the dragons are extremely rare and only found in a "no contact" area of a rain forest. Could be true, could be the supplier protecting his sources. These tips were first called "french elk" back in the mid-eighties. They were perhaps invented by a cajun who lived deep in a swamp near Prairieville LA. Suppliers aren't always the most honest!

By using single layer tips and rolling dents into the tip to hold chalk instead of chewing through layers of a tip with a tool that damages the leather tips last far longer. Add a playing style that very rarely uses extreme spin and I don't put much wear and tear on a tip. Don't play much these days but the tips lasted for years when I played over fifty hours a week too.

Back then ask a top player what tip he used and the most common answer was "I don't know, it was on the shaft when I bought the stick" occasionally "I had Joe put a tip on for me, don't know what it is."

A freshly chalked piece of pretty much any leather with a little curvature on it will work just fine but that would hardly justify today's tip prices, would it? I use my own duds pressed back down to about the height they were before soaking.

Hu

Click to expand...

I understand and agree but I dont think I could ever get more than 10 to 12 months out of the tips I'm using.

They seem to melt away just from being chalked.

jrctherake said:

I understand and agree but I dont think I could ever get more than 10 to 12 months out of the tips I'm using.

They seem to melt away just from being chalked.

Click to expand...

On second thought, it could be the "chalk" combined with "how" and "how often" I chalk that is eating my tips up.

Of course, my playing style is a contributor too.

Tip Pictures

jrctherake said:

On second thought, it could be the "chalk" combined with "how" and "how often" I chalk that is eating my tips up.

Of course, my playing style is a contributor too.

Click to expand...

Both OB and Predator have close up pictures of their shafts including layered tips. One shows very clearly a few crumbs at the top of the tip, all that is left of the top layer after an install. If those layers are going to have much chance of lasting a chalking stroke that doesn't come from the outside inwards like you are trying to peel layers off is better. If you were trying to separate layers or damage the tip with the chalk, how would you do it? When you think about it that is exactly how many people chalk!

Without using a lot of spin, I generally chalk once between games and another time when I do need more than a tip or tip and a half of spin. That is once between games and once or twice in a game at most usually. If I just chalked recently I won't chalk between games. Bought a gross of Master blue for seventeen cents a cube years ago, that is gonna outlast me. I had collected a few pieces of flavor of the week chalk over a couple of years but I couldn't see trying to fix something that wasn't broken so I gave them to a friend.

As a serious competitor or gambler it is worth trying things that might give an edge but if there is no edge no sense putting the latest golden eagle on your cue. I have raced my own circle track cars, competed with fully custom rifles and handbuilt pistols, I'm not scared of spending money to be better but I can't remember the last time I miscued.

Hu