2015 AZB Ghost Challenge - Official Thread

dr_dave

dr_dave

Instructional Author
Gold Member
Silver Member
flash5153 said:
I think it's easier on a 9 fter.

Sure ,,the shot making is more difficult on a big table.But the separation of the balls is a huge advantage .

This can be debated til the cows come home,,,but I haven't seen 1 video yet of anyone running sets on on a small table. If it was easier,,wouldn't there be a few videos showing it.

Just wanted to say,,,don't be ashamed to use a small table . I don't think its much of a advantage.
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It is much easier on a smaller table with easier pockets, as compared to a 9-footer with tight pockets. Personally, I am sure (from past experience) that I can do much better on my 8' home table as compared to what I could do on a 9-footer with tight pockets. When I can find some time, I'll try to record and post a session on my 8-footer.

Also, FYI, pocket "tighness" is not just a function of the pocket point-to-point "size." For more info, see the table difficulty factor (TDF) thread.

Regards,
Dave
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
flash5153 said:
I think it's easier on a 9 fter.

Sure ,,the shot making is more difficult on a big table.But the separation of the balls is a huge advantage .

This can be debated til the cows come home,,,but I haven't seen 1 video yet of anyone running sets on on a small table. If it was easier,,wouldn't there be a few videos showing it.

Just wanted to say,,,don't be ashamed to use a small table . I don't think its much of a advantage.
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I have done this. It is by FAR easier to play pool on a 7' Diamond with 5" pockets and Simonis 860 compared to a 9' GC with 5" pockets and Simonis 860.

Read my results in THIS LINK thread if you choose. I haven't seen any other "actual data" from people. Just arguments, but no one actually did any data collection that I know of.

Edit: I believe Dr Dave also has comparisons from his BU thread. Sorry, I forgot about that. I don't know if he has tallied the scores to try to determine statistically if play on a certain size table is easier/harder. And if it statistically significant with the sample size in that thread. My data is statistically significant, with 69 innings played. Now, to really prove this out, 30 people should do what I did:)
 
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BasementDweller

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There may be point in a players development where it becomes easier for them to play the 9 ball ghost on a big table. I think that would only be for the really top tier players that can pocket balls on a big table almost like they are playing on a bar table. The only thing stopping these guys from demolishing the ghost is clusters and that's more likely to happen on a bar table. So that wouldn't apply to a lot of people but there may be some.

For the rest of us mortals it's more difficult on a big table for sure.
 
G

Gerry Williams

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Clusters are not a problem playing 9 ball on a 7 foot table - the game is much easier IMO.

I have argued for years that 8 ball is tougher on the 7 footer though.

Happy Holidays!

Gerry
BasementDweller said:
There may be point in a players development where it becomes easier for them to play the 9 ball ghost on a big table. I think that would only be for the really top tier players that can pocket balls on a big table almost like they are playing on a bar table. The only thing stopping these guys from demolishing the ghost is clusters and that's more likely to happen on a bar table. So that wouldn't apply to a lot of people but there may be some.

For the rest of us mortals it's more difficult on a big table for sure.
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dr_dave

dr_dave

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Gerry Williams said:
Clusters are not a problem playing 9 ball on a 7 foot table - the game is much easier IMO.
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I agree ... especially on a stock Valley table, where the corners play like huge buckets.

Gerry Williams said:
I have argued for years that 8 ball is tougher on the 7 footer though.
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This might be true for awesome shooters like you; but for mere mortals, I think 8-ball is also easier on a 7-footer.

Regards,
Dave
 
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flash5153

none
Silver Member
I didnt mean to get anyone riled up.lol

And I might feel differently, next week, about this. Who knows?
I play on both size tables often!!
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
FYI, before starting this thread, I considered using the table difficulty factor but it's a bit of a hassle and since this is just for fun, we wanted to try to steer clear of all the talk about "my run is better because my table/pocket width is tougher" and just enjoy the videos.

Just my opinion, but I think that rotation games are generally tougher on bigger tables, while games like straight pool and 8-ball can be tougher on smaller tables, but it can be the other way around depending on what you're used to playing on.

Anyway, beating the ghost is quite a feat on any table, and not everyone has access to a tight 9 footer, so post up and let's keep things positive!
 
Wedge

Wedge

WO Wedge Lock
Silver Member
Yep

victorl said:
FYI, before starting this thread, I considered using the table difficulty factor but it's a bit of a hassle and since this is just for fun, we wanted to try to steer clear of all the talk about "my run is better because my table/pocket width is tougher" and just enjoy the videos.

Just my opinion, but I think that rotation games are generally tougher on bigger tables, while games like straight pool and 8-ball can be tougher on smaller tables, but it can be the other way around depending on what you're used to playing on.

Anyway, beating the ghost is quite a feat on any table, and not everyone has access to a tight 9 footer, so post up and let's keep things positive!
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I am really enjoying this thread and watching the videos's> Please keep it positive!!! And remember no matter what size the pocket the center 2 1/4" is always the same!
Wedge
 
W

westcoast

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
How do you guys break for the 9 ball ghost? The main problem I have when I play the ghost is that too often too many balls are tied up to run them out. Do you guys soft break them basically to make sure there is some separation but not so much that they re-join and pack up?

I have a 7 foot Valley in my garage that was custom made to play like a Diamond- pockets that don't fit two balls and deeper "pocket shelf".

It is quite difficult for a player of my ability to beat the ghost on a table like that- one because of the tightness of the pockets and second because of the aforementioned ties ups after the break.

When I play the ghost I count up how many balls I make for ten racks. I average around a 30- so I'm not a great player by any means, but the table is no piece of cake.
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
westcoast said:
How do you guys break for the 9 ball ghost? The main problem I have when I play the ghost is that too often too many balls are tied up to run them out. Do you guys soft break them basically to make sure there is some separation but not so much that they re-join and pack up?
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I think that's one of the difficulties when playing on smaller tables. Combine that with tough pockets and I think it would be a challenge even for a strong player.
In my experience, every table breaks differently so it takes some trial and error to find the right speed and angle to break from to get the best results on your table. If you can find a way to consistently make 2-3 balls on the break it will make life much easier as well.

If you're struggling with the 9-ball ghost, post a video anyway and you have an entire year to improve on your score. Or you can do the 6 ball-ghost or any other ghost that you feel would be a challenge for yourself. We want to make this a place where anyone can participate regardless of skill level, since in the end, we're all after the exact same thing and that's to improve our game.
 
RobMan

RobMan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Ok, there have been a lot of posts from folks trouncing the ghost, so how about the opposite?

9' Olhausen - 5" pockets infamous for the "corner rattle".

9-ball ghost: Was up 4-2 in first set and then ..... Lost five straight. 7-4 loss. Gave two easy ones away.
Lost 7-2 second set.
Switched to 6-ball ghost. Won 7-6 and then 7-3.
 
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flash5153

none
Silver Member
I gave it another try. Video is uploading now. I lost again 7-5. Missed 1 straight in 9 ball from getting a bit lazy.
My camera divided the video again,this time 20 minuted in. I didnt upload the 2nd part.It was just a few games.
It's not pretty,,but ill post it when uploaded.
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
RobMan said:
Ok, there have been a lot of posts from folks trouncing the ghost, so how about the opposite?

9' Olhausen - 5" pockets infamous for the "corner rattle".

9-ball ghost: Was up 4-2 in first set and then ..... Lost five straight. 7-4 loss. Gave two easy ones away.
Lost 7-2 second set.
Switched to 6-ball ghost. Won 7-6 and then 7-3.
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OP updated, and 6-ball section added!
Thanks for participating and have a great 2015!
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've been out of town for the past couple of weeks... hope to get in a few sets on a Diamond barbox that is local to me now before I head back home to my GC:)
 
dr_dave

dr_dave

Instructional Author
Gold Member
Silver Member
Here's the best I could do over about 6 hours today:

7-2 W (78%), dr_dave, 1/3/15, 8' Connelly, 4.75", video

I had a rocky start (2-2), then I found a gear and ran 5 straight. I think 7-0 should be doable on my table. I'll keep trying. It's great practice.

FYI, I edited out the dead time and sped up the rack transitions to make viewing more enjoyable (and to make the upload much faster). The video is only 8 minutes long.

Regards,
Dave
 
BeiberLvr

BeiberLvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
dr_dave said:
Here's the best I could do over about 6 hours today:

7-2 W (78%), dr_dave, 1/3/15, 8' Connelly, 4.75", video

I had a rocky start (2-2), then I found a gear and ran 5 straight. I think 7-0 should be doable on my table. I'll keep trying. It's great practice.

FYI, I edited out the dead time and sped up the rack transitions to make viewing more enjoyable (and to make the upload much faster). The video is only 8 minutes long.

Regards,
Dave
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Nice, Dave.

I'm curious as to what everyone's thoughts are on edited videos. Seeing as how videos themselves aren't a requirement, I can see it being okay. However, personally, I'm against them.

It's not even so much the notion that trickery can be done, which I am in no way implying was done in Dave's video. I just like to see how everyone paces themselves. When do they walk around to check the angles? Pre shot routines. Stuff like that gets missed on edited videos.
 
victorl

victorl

Where'd my stroke go?
Silver Member
dr_dave said:
Here's the best I could do over about 6 hours today:

7-2 W (78%), dr_dave, 1/3/15, 8' Connelly, 4.75", video

I had a rocky start (2-2), then I found a gear and ran 5 straight. I think 7-0 should be doable on my table. I'll keep trying. It's great practice.

FYI, I edited out the dead time and sped up the rack transitions to make viewing more enjoyable (and to make the upload much faster). The video is only 8 minutes long.

Regards,
Dave
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OP updated! Thanks for the contribution!
I know it's a lot of work editing out dead time between shots, so thanks for that.
 
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