TOI CJ Wiley

hlymnstr14

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm looking forward to using TOI on a bar box. I think it would be the stone cold............... :wink:

John

on a bar table with regular bar cloth (not simonis) TOI is more effective. you can really let your stroke out and that furry cloth just grabs it and the CB just floats into position.

i shot TOI and the cue ball took what seemed to everyone else to be an un-natural path from the 8 to the 9. i pounded the CB with TOI and a little draw. the draw took off, hit the side rail, the TOI killed it and the CB floated off the side rail. the guy was amazed and said he needed to learn that little trick.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
the cue ball won't get away from you with the "heavy ball" of the TOI.

on a bar table with regular bar cloth (not simonis) TOI is more effective. you can really let your stroke out and that furry cloth just grabs it and the CB just floats into position.

i shot TOI and the cue ball took what seemed to everyone else to be an un-natural path from the 8 to the 9. i pounded the CB with TOI and a little draw. the draw took off, hit the side rail, the TOI killed it and the CB floated off the side rail. the guy was amazed and said he needed to learn that little trick.

Yes, it's really brutal on the bar table because the cue ball won't get away from you with the "heavy ball" of the TOI.

I played David Matlock in Alabama one time and we both had the same style.....he ran an 8 on me at one point.....this wasn't enough. ;)

I'll tell that whole story one of these days, Matlock was certainly one of the most feared Bar Box players in history. He also had a "heavy ball" style and was awesome with the Big Cue Ball, where I first saw the TOI Technique displayed by Omaha John.
 

Six Shooter

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Chiming in here. Yeah. This is long. Sorry.

First and foremost thanks to my buddy Mr. Coolata2ude for talking me in to trying TOI out.

A hearty thanks to CJ as well for putting it out there for all of us to take a look at it and give it a trial.

My DVD should be in my hands within a few days so I can view this technique in full.

Over the past few weeks, I have been tinkering with the gist of this.

I'll state that I'm not easily impressed with a lot of things but this does impress me.

I'm constantly looking for ways to just keep things simple on the table.

What I have discovered is that I'm finding it easier to avoid object balls that can cause complications unless that is part of my goal to just merely bump something apart.

Position seems to be very natural as long as I don't get too aggressive or too tentative.

I don't have the luxury of owning my own table so I have to apply this at my local pool room where I do league one night a week and one multi hour day where I try to work on things but often get interrupted to play. However; I tried implementing it during my league matches and during the multi hour day.

Granted, it has had an effect on my league average causing a downturn but this is only due to my own self not having enough confidence in myself while implementing it.

Occasionally, I do come across a shot or two that may need some running English but far less than I had initially imagined.

Sure. It's pretty to watch a CB run all over the table or getting Efren like spin but to me that is just aesthetics if indeed the game can be simpler without having to be fancy.

I'll discover more once I have the DVD in hand and break it down part by part a little at a time with the possibility to go back and review as necessary.

In time, my confidence will grow more as I get more comfortable with it.
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
more flexibility with the cue ball

Chiming in here. Yeah. This is long. Sorry.

First and foremost thanks to my buddy Mr. Coolata2ude for talking me in to trying TOI out.

A hearty thanks to CJ as well for putting it out there for all of us to take a look at it and give it a trial.

My DVD should be in my hands within a few days so I can view this technique in full.

Over the past few weeks, I have been tinkering with the gist of this.

I'll state that I'm not easily impressed with a lot of things but this does impress me.

I'm constantly looking for ways to just keep things simple on the table.

What I have discovered is that I'm finding it easier to avoid object balls that can cause complications unless that is part of my goal to just merely bump something apart.

Position seems to be very natural as long as I don't get too aggressive or too tentative.

I don't have the luxury of owning my own table so I have to apply this at my local pool room where I do league one night a week and one multi hour day where I try to work on things but often get interrupted to play. However; I tried implementing it during my league matches and during the multi hour day.

Granted, it has had an effect on my league average causing a downturn but this is only due to my own self not having enough confidence in myself while implementing it.

Occasionally, I do come across a shot or two that may need some running English but far less than I had initially imagined.

Sure. It's pretty to watch a CB run all over the table or getting Efren like spin but to me that is just aesthetics if indeed the game can be simpler without having to be fancy.

I'll discover more once I have the DVD in hand and break it down part by part a little at a time with the possibility to go back and review as necessary.

In time, my confidence will grow more as I get more comfortable with it.


I applaud your desire to improve. This method is very effective, and although it appears simple, it took me thousands of hours to perfect and teach.

The Touch of Inside technique is the only one where you can basically master one shot and use it for most of your game. With TOI you can get to a lot more places on the table and have more flexibility with the cue ball than anyone would believe (before they actually try it).

Let me know after you watch the DVD and apply the methods to your practice/play and I'm curious what questions or comments you may have.

Enjoy, and Play Well. 'The Game is the Teacher'
 

hlymnstr14

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
CJ, what tip do you use and what hardness? I know you can adjust the TOI to any shaft or tip but do you think a particular hardness is better?
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
I'm pretty happy with any of them that are high quality leather.

CJ, what tip do you use and what hardness? I know you can adjust the TOI to any shaft or tip but do you think a particular hardness is better?

I like a harder tip because I want the sensation of feeling the cue ball (which is pretty hard in case you've ever been hit with one;)).

I just had a Morrey put on one of my cues and I like the Kamui as well...the medium black ones are what I've used in the past.

I grew up using Le Pro's and have used the "Milk Dud" tips soaked in milk a few times as well. As long as they hold chalk well and give me that "hard hit" I'm pretty happy with any of them that are high quality leather.
 

danny turner

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
toi

just got video and watched it,went straight to my table and started using toi,and i can see cj that this toi is the real deal,i have allways had trouble adjusting to fast equipment at different pool rooms,but with toi i can slow the cue ball travel way down and stay in line,for most of my pool playing life i have allways played with a touch of outside, which makes my cue ball travel more,and makes it difficult to stay in line,i can see with toi i can make the table do what i want it to do,i can see why you were a great money player,with toi you could adjust to different tables quicker than your appontent.i really liked ultra thin cuts with toi and how to kill the cue ball,just wanted to say thanks for the video,i know im gonna make some more cash useing toi.
 

Drawback

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I won 40 games in a row the other night at the Moose Lodge and finally it was time to close. I couldn't believe the difference in my playing.

4 different guys kept lining up trying to beat me and not a one of them did. I just kept playing the table and whatever was presented. I got great "shapes" and just played the game.

I've slowed the ball down and used the nearest corner with a TOI and viola! Results! :)
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
Once in a while something comes along that really makes a difference

just got video and watched it,went straight to my table and started using toi,and i can see cj that this toi is the real deal,i have allways had trouble adjusting to fast equipment at different pool rooms,but with toi i can slow the cue ball travel way down and stay in line,for most of my pool playing life i have allways played with a touch of outside, which makes my cue ball travel more,and makes it difficult to stay in line,i can see with toi i can make the table do what i want it to do,i can see why you were a great money player,with toi you could adjust to different tables quicker than your appontent.i really liked ultra thin cuts with toi and how to kill the cue ball,just wanted to say thanks for the video,i know im gonna make some more cash useing toi.

I'm glad you are "real eyesing" the TOI difference.

Once in a while something comes along {in life} that really makes a difference and that is refreshing. I'm sharing the TOI Technique because it was one of those things for me and it is for you too. You're experiencing the foundation of TOI and now you can build a very effective game.

There's something about learning to "move" the cue ball slighly that opens up a whole new dimension of shots and cue ball positions using the TOI Stun and the NO SPIN approach creates pure angles that are easier to control.

Keep up the good play and I really like hearing about your progress.

Aloha, and Play Well.

CJ Wiley
 

dirtychapurado2

dirtychampurado
Hi, I'm a new poster but a long time following azbilliards...I've been going through some aiming systems. I tried ghost ball (but I cant see the damn thing lol), worked with PRO ONE and have the dvd (I get confused on the pivoting stuff....but when I get it right it does work), and now I'm on SEE system (it works good for me as my pocketing balls went up pretty good but position play and applying english doesnt come with it, maybe looking for an upgrade). So now here comes TOI, I've read all about it and and Mr. CJ Wiley is here most of the time to answer question about it just by going through this aiming section, so I'll give it a try. maybe this upcoming pay day lol

One thing I wanna clear is, Im not saying PRO One, see, by feel, or ghost ball doesnt work...to me they all work but its a matter of preference that can be easily apply to where im standing, or by looking at a shot and most of all consistency. Maybe to me is not consistent but yours does let say using pro one or Ghost ball. They all helped my game one way or another.

Lastly, to Mr. Wiley it may be a noob question but...the PPV version I can only watch it one time right? or i am better off getting the DVD... Thanks everyone..
 

One Pocket John

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hi, I'm a new poster but a long time following azbilliards...I've been going through some aiming systems. I tried ghost ball (but I cant see the damn thing lol), worked with PRO ONE and have the dvd (I get confused on the pivoting stuff....but when I get it right it does work), and now I'm on SEE system (it works good for me as my pocketing balls went up pretty good but position play and applying english doesnt come with it, maybe looking for an upgrade). So now here comes TOI, I've read all about it and and Mr. CJ Wiley is here most of the time to answer question about it just by going through this aiming section, so I'll give it a try. maybe this upcoming pay day lol

One thing I wanna clear is, Im not saying PRO One, see, by feel, or ghost ball doesnt work...to me they all work but its a matter of preference that can be easily apply to where im standing, or by looking at a shot and most of all consistency. Maybe to me is not consistent but yours does let say using pro one or Ghost ball. They all helped my game one way or another.

Lastly, to Mr. Wiley it may be a noob question but...the PPV version I can only watch it one time right? or i am better off getting the DVD... Thanks everyone..

When you buy the PPV you get it for 30 days.

Mines going to be up on the 27th. Watched it about 6 times and will watch it again and again.

Have fun :smile:

John
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
just purchased the ppv toi and its not working? wont allow me to press play. just a black screen.

We just located the problem, we were out of viewing minutes. That's over 12k in less than a month. Anyway, it's ok to use now. . . CJ

I just checked it and it looks like you've seen the first 3 chapters. I sent you the password again, maybe you can reboot your computer and try again.

Let me know if it still won't work, you're the first one to have trouble in awhile....CJ

20/02/2013 17:01:38 1.Intro, 2.The Grip, 3.Hand Position UNITED STATES PENNSYLVANIA PITTSBURGH
20/02/2013 16:55:37 1.Touch Of Inside Introduction
 
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West Point 1987

On the Hill, Out of Gas
Silver Member
Finally got this wired for competition!

Well, after working with TOI for the past 4 months, I finally got this wired as my default playing technique. I played 2 sets race to 11 in 10 Ball last night on a double shimmed GCV with a AA player (one of the top 5 players in Cyprus). He got me first set 11-6, then I took him to the hill and lost 11-10. I was actually on the hill for 4 games, but we got into some vicious safety battles that he won (he's the better player, he should have). Even though it was a loss, it's far and away the finest pool I've played against a player of that caliber in almost 30 years. No way I'd have gotten more than 2 games off that guy 4 months ago. I haven't been this confident (and cocky) since I was in my 20s. Wife's out of town tonight and tomorrow night...guess where I'll be? ;)
 
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CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
You can also use it for two and three railers

Well, after working with TOI for the past 4 months, I finally got this wired as my default playing technique. I played 2 sets race to 11 in 10 Ball last night on a double shimmed GCV with a AA player (one of the top 5 players in Cyprus). He got me first set 11-6, then I took him to the hill and lost 11-10. I was actually on the hill for 4 games, but we got into some vicious safety battles that he won (he's the better player, he should have). Even though it was a loss, it's far and away the finest pool I've played against a player of that caliber in almost 30 years. No way I'd have gotten more than 2 games off that guy 4 months ago. I haven't been this confident (and cocky) since I was in my 20s. Wife's out of town tonight and tomorrow night...guess where I'll be? ;)

That's great news, you've been in this with me from the very beginning, I'm glad it's paying off. I'm having more fun with my game as well. I played one pocket with a pretty good player tonight and played superb with the TOI on every shot that was available. I also gave a TOI Bank Lesson earlier that amazed an old friend that was curious how it worked with banking.

I've found it's easiest to show someone how the TOI works with banks right away because they see immediate results.....one tip of TOI equates to one diamond of angle on a bank on cross sides, and it's a half tip on straight backs. You can also use it for two and three railers like it's magic.

Keep up the good play, if it isn't fun it's not worth doing. :thumbup: 'The Game is the Teacher' ;)
 

Pjaze

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Before I buy the TOI vid, can someone give me a brief explanation of what it is. I have read alot about it but I don't think I fully get what it is.

My understanding is ... You line up your shot, aiming for the outside edge of the pocket (Slight undercut), then you move your cue parallel to that line, to put a small amount of inside english on the cue ball?

This makes the cue ball slightly deflect to the overcut side of the OB, and assuming you have done everything right - the OB goes in centre pocket, if you got no deflection it should still go in to the outside edge of the pocket (Undercut), and if you got too much deflection it goes into the inside edge of the pocket (Overcut).


The benefit of this system is that you don't need to be dead on centre ball every shot? But this system is not an aiming system, as you still need to use whatever aiming system you currently use to set up for the shot?

If the above is basically correct, I guess you would need to vary the amount of inside english you use depending on the distance between cue ball and object ball, and the speed at which you are playing the shot. Am I anywhere close?
 

CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
control the deflection it changes the perception of the game.

Before I buy the TOI vid, can someone give me a brief explanation of what it is. I have read alot about it but I don't think I fully get what it is.

My understanding is ... You line up your shot, aiming for the outside edge of the pocket (Slight undercut), then you move your cue parallel to that line, to put a small amount of inside english on the cue ball?

This makes the cue ball slightly deflect to the overcut side of the OB, and assuming you have done everything right - the OB goes in centre pocket, if you got no deflection it should still go in to the outside edge of the pocket (Undercut), and if you got too much deflection it goes into the inside edge of the pocket (Overcut).


The benefit of this system is that you don't need to be dead on centre ball every shot? But this system is not an aiming system, as you still need to use whatever aiming system you currently use to set up for the shot?

If the above is basically correct, I guess you would need to vary the amount of inside english you use depending on the distance between cue ball and object ball, and the speed at which you are playing the shot. Am I anywhere close?

You're on the right track and there's thousands of threads in the Aiming Forums on this subject.

It has a built in aiming system as well, and really blends your shot speed, shot angle, and cue ball target into one system of play. I've been giving lessons and seminars for the last week on the TOI and it's been effective with everyone so far. The one thing that it will bring to the surface in your own game is how accurately you're really hitting the cue ball.

When you start to control the deflection it changes the perception of the game. Most players never realized how accurate deflection is when you control it with your tip. This takes a whole video to explain, so I won't go into it now. If you're not at least an intermediate player I wouldn't advice it before studying my first 4 videos. 'The Game is the Teacher'
 
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