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Rickw
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04-23-2003, 10:21 AM

You are absolutely right Big Dave. After I posted this, I started thinking about it and came to the same conclusion. I posted it while I was still in that, "What the Hell is going on here?" mood. You know how it is don't you? This game can put you in a real state of flux sometimes!! I'm over it now and I definitely agree with you. I just hope the next time it happens, I'll be able to focus more, make the appropriate kick shot and keep the opponent off the table. If not, I'll focus more on my brew and less on my miserable situation.


Rick W.
  
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Pop And Slop
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04-23-2003, 02:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by weelie
I have made the decision long time ago: there are no good rolls or bad rolls. When I play badly, I lose.. and I have to do something to improve. Rolls have nothing to do with it.

I have never lost because of luck. That's just how I see it. 100%.
I guess you have never had your opponant go to shoot the 9 in the side and have is hit the nipple and shoot down the rail into the corner. I would call that losing by the other player being lucky.

Jay
  
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jjinfla
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04-23-2003, 03:04 PM

I think Weelie's point being that he maintains a positive attitude and does not dwell on unforseen circumstances to salve his ego. And besides, if you break and run out then your opponent can't get lucky. If you hook yourself then it is because you didn't execute the shot properly. Jake
  
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Pop And Slop
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04-23-2003, 03:12 PM

noone is perfect
  
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Chucklez65
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04-24-2003, 06:10 AM

Ya, what HE said!!!

:-)

Chuck


Chuck
  
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Bluewolf
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04-24-2003, 09:55 AM

I am so inexpereinced in 9 ball, I count on screwing up the other player SO bad that I can get lucky on the 9. That is the only way I can win.

I think 8ball is harder because you have to sink more balls to win.

Laura


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Chucklez65
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04-24-2003, 11:38 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bluewolf
I am so inexpereinced in 9 ball, I count on screwing up the other player SO bad that I can get lucky on the 9. That is the only way I can win.

I think 8ball is harder because you have to sink more balls to win.

Laura
There are really two schools of thought on this:

1) 9ball is easier to win because you only have to shoot one ball, the 9ball in the pocket to win. It can be lucked in or you can let the other person run out and miss on the last couple of balls and win.

2) 8ball is easier to win because there are so many more balls on the table to shoot at if you make a mistake in shape...or if you miss, your opponent has more balls to have to shoot at.

IMHO

I think that 8ball is the easier game for a players that are learning to play pool, because there are more balls to shoot at and when you mess up shape on a shot, you can make other choices.

That being said -

As a player gets better and learns how to control the table more and can judge shape better, then 9ball becomes the easier of the two games to play. 8ball, when played well, has a lot more strategy in it. You have to know when to 'go for the run' and when not to. This is true in 9ball too, but because both players are shooting at the same balls, it is easier to leave the other player poorly when you get out of shape. If you go for a runout in 8 ball, you have to know when to break out balls that can become trouble balls or when to leave them....and whether to make what looks to be an easily made ball or not. If you shoot all your balls off of the table and then have a trouble ball then all you have done is open the table up for your opponent to run out. Ill play almost anyone on the planet if after the break they take all of their balls off of the table and let me run out - so there is a strategy in 'when' to make a move and when 'not' to.

This is true of 9ball also..but in 9ball, when in doubt...you can just hit the balls at 35 mph and hope something goes in. Not true of 8ball.

Anywayz....thats MHO

Chuck
  
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04-24-2003, 12:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Chucklez65
That being said -

As a player gets better and learns how to control the table more and can judge shape better, then 9ball becomes the easier of the two games to play. 8ball, when played well, has a lot more strategy in it. You have to know when to 'go for the run' and when not to. This is true in 9ball too, but because both players are shooting at the same balls, it is easier to leave the other player poorly when you get out of shape. If you go for a runout in 8 ball, you have to know when to break out balls that can become trouble balls or when to leave them....and whether to make what looks to be an easily made ball or not.
Chuck [/B]
I think 8 ball is fun because I do like the strategy part. I intentionally safed an easily made ball because of shape on the next one. I would have shape on the next but to get a legal hit, I would have had to also break up their cluster and leave them good. So I chose to not take the shot and play safe.

Laura
  
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weelie
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04-25-2003, 02:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Pop And Slop
I guess you have never had your opponant go to shoot the 9 in the side and have is hit the nipple and shoot down the rail into the corner. I would call that losing by the other player being lucky.

Jay
Oh, many times. Mostly I remember this kind of shots happening when playing snooker though...

If I had played well, he would not be shooting the nine. And if I shoot well, I'll get another chance to win.

And I think luck is a factor in 9ball, to me it's part of the rules. The rules are made for luck to be a factor. So I never lost because of luck, because luck is part of the game. It's like if you say you lost because of luck in Backgammon or some dice game... I don't think so. Luck is there and it's your task to minimize it's value to the opponent.

I have won because of luck, as I know what I tried, and what happened was not it. But I have not lost because of luck, as what the opponent does is his task, and I don't know if he played this or that on purpose, it was his turn, he played to best of his ability... and so do I, and I play only my turn, not his.

I do watch the opponent play, but what I am thinking what I would do if I was him, and if he does something else, I think why he did it and is there something for me to learn there. When he plays, I'm not looking to beat him, I'm looking to beat him when I play! When I watch the opponent play, I exclude myself and my out of the game, trying to visualize whta I would do if I faced what the opponent is facing.

And, for example, when I scratched, it was not because of luck it was because I played carelessly, cannoning on to another ball, not taking care of the cue ball path as well I should have. Or then I took a deliberate risk. A risk will have it's downside, but you need to take some risk almost every time... you just try to maximize the payoff (net of risk).

Even if I lost due to coin toss and the other guy running out all to 9-0, I still don't think I lost due to luck. I lost because the guy played well, and the rules were set and agreed upon. The coin toss was a risk that I knew.

That's how I see it. It may seem like stubborness or something. But I see it like that. In competitive games that is.
  
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weelie
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04-25-2003, 02:19 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Chucklez65

As a player gets better and learns how to control the table more and can judge shape better, then 9ball becomes the easier of the two games to play. 8ball, when played well, has a lot more strategy in it.
I agree. Running several racks is a lot easier in 8ball, if the break is working. But 8 ball strategy is something I find difficult: intentional fouls, moving balls to better position while other balls to worse positions, playing position on two or more balls at the same time... you really have to think. Do I take the high or the low, do I run out, Do I change the run out order half way through...

In nine ball, pocket all in the predetermined order, or if it fails, snooker the opponent sometime during the runout. That's basically it.

I do love eightball, when it does not go all-defensive. But nobody here plays it. If you know how to play, you play nineball. blaah. It's a boring game.
  
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