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11-16-2019, 08:37 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by deanoc View Post
Everyone told me they were not the right thing
Dean it is no different than moving up a tee box.
Everyone will have to do it eventually. If they’re lucky.
There will always be people who criticize and down grade.
They’ve lost the plot; do whatever it takes to continue enjoying it


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11-16-2019, 08:45 AM

I see no problem with it in a 9’ table. On a bar box, 5” pockets is like playing basketball on a 9’ hoop...everybody is dunking all day long.


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11-16-2019, 08:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by trentfromtoledo View Post
To be clear, 4.5" sides at 141 degrees and 5" sides at 102 degrees is Pro cut.

Trent
Clear as mud.


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11-16-2019, 09:03 AM

I'm not sure I agree with the "should not go in" part. That assumes that the tighter pockets are what everyone "should be playing". If you are better than another player on a table with tighter pockets, you should be better than that same player on a table with wider pockets. I guess I don't see the possibility that the weaker player may make a "lucky" shot or two is really the reason for tighter pockets - same margin for error for the better player - that's just what the table allows.

If pro players and the average recreational player are really that much better than years gone by, by all means challenge them if that is what they are looking for.

I have an old Anniversary, I'm sure the pockets may be "easy" by what appear to be more modern standards, but I agree with deanoc (luckily I've just had the one table, lol) - I enjoy playing on it and apparently it allows some different options for shots that simply make it different, not better or worse.

Play on whatever you enjoy playing on and accept that the game on whatever table you are playing on is the game you adapt to, IMO.

Last edited by jeephawk; 11-16-2019 at 09:06 AM.
  
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11-16-2019, 09:10 AM

I have always advocated for the old ''standard' pocket sizes- if I recall I once had a BCA handbook in the 80s that stated corner pockets were to be 4 7/8 to 5 1/8. My first home table had 4 1/2 pockets and I never liked it! I was warned by a great player back then that small pockets will tighten up your stroke and can really damage your game as a beginner. MY last table was a GC4- I think the pockets were 4 3/4 to 4 7/8. I really enjoyed that table so much!
Has professional golf reduced the size of the golf hole? Not to my knowledge - even when Tiger was killing it on the tour! I love 14.1 and unless you are a top/ top pro- it is a useless game on 4 1/2 with long pocket shelves in my opinion- it just was not a game designed for that size pocket- unless you enjoy runs of teens to low twenties 90% of the time and five hour games to 150 points.
Nine ball on the larger pockets was not supposed to be a game of "ball in hand" - that was created for TV. So were break cues/ jump cues/ wild 9 ball wins etc. etc.. tighten up the rules/ not the pockets!
  
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  (#21)
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11-16-2019, 09:13 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by trentfromtoledo View Post
To be clear, 4.5" sides at 141 degrees and 5" sides at 102 degrees is Pro cut.



Trent
That's could not be less clear...unless of course you actually mean 4.5" corners.

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11-16-2019, 09:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeephawk View Post
I'm not sure I agree with the "should not go in" part. That assumes that the tighter pockets are what everyone "should be playing". If you are better than another player on a table with tighter pockets, you should be better than that same player on a table with wider pockets. I guess I don't see the possibility that the weaker player may make a "lucky" shot or two is really the reason for tighter pockets - same margin for error for the better player - that's just what the table allows.

If pro players and the average recreational player are really that much better than years gone by, by all means challenge them if that is what they are looking for.

I have an old Anniversary, I'm sure the pockets may be "easy" by what appear to be more modern standards, but I agree with deanoc (luckily I've just had the one table, lol) - I enjoy playing on it and apparently it allows some different options for shots that simply make it different, not better or worse.

Play on whatever you enjoy playing on and accept that the game on whatever table you are playing on is the game you adapt to, IMO.
I entirely agree with this post- and I second his reference to calling out people who say that any ball pocketed on a 5 inch corner pocket table "should not go in" - who are they- self appointed rulers of the pocket billiard world? I could say the same when I miss on a pro cut Diamond- " that shot should go in!" Even at age 66 I would love to compete on 5 inch pockets with 90% of those on this site who "adore" the 4 1/2s and see how much better they can play than me.
  
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trentfromtoledo
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11-16-2019, 09:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by garczar View Post
I understand. My point is that in most commercial settings tables 4.5" and smaller are too tough for your regular recreational crowd. They want to have fun and see balls go in. That's what brings them back. Have a couple snug ones for the better players and have the rest a tad more generous. Pool business is tough enough as it is.
True! Having both kinds of tables works for everyone!
  
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trentfromtoledo
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11-16-2019, 09:21 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyco View Post
Clear as mud.
I edited it! You all knew what I meant. It definitely was a foot in mouth error, especially that I started out with "to be clear" LOL. I get it
  
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11-16-2019, 09:32 AM

It just seems like a really dumb thing to get so argumentative and preachy about. 5" was a normal corner pocket until fairly recently. It's not as if they are oversized, they just aren't tight.

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  (#26)
BC21
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11-16-2019, 09:38 AM

Some people play because they love the game, the clicking of the balls, the feel of the cue as soon as the tip contacts the cue ball, the satisfaction of making a great shot and putting whitey exactly where you intend for the next shot. It's like nothing else in the world exists except you, your cue, and the pool table. And you don't have to be a world beater to experience and appreciate such a love for the game.

If 5" pockets and shallow pocket shelves bring out a player's love for playing pool, then I encourage it. You only live once, and though you can't always enjoy every moment of your life, you should at least find enjoyment in the things you love doing.

For 20 years I had a super tough table with 4 3/8" corner pockets, deep shelves, and about 145° facings. I once ran 78 balls on that baby playing straights. But over the years I probably rattled thousands of balls, which wasn't fun. It was a great table for gambling, but a lousy table to bring out one's love for the game.

For some of us, the tighter the better. We love the game, but we also love a tough challenge, especially when money is involved and your opponent is forced to deal with the same tough challenge. It makes winning more enjoyable, more meaningful. There is a fine line between playing for the love of playing and playing for the love of winning. And when you cross this line, pool becomes something that is only enjoyable when you are gambling, when you're winning, when money has lost its value. A 20 or 100 dollar bill is no longer grocery money or dance lessons for daughters or dinner with the wife. Instead, it's a reason to play pool.


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Simple solution
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Simple solution - 11-16-2019, 09:45 AM

Some company needs to make pool balls in different sizes. Starting marble, to grape fruit, just need one table. Easy to handicap 8 ball, but not sure what the rack would look like using two different size balls at the same time. Maybe john Hager could make one.
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11-16-2019, 09:54 AM

How about looking at it like this...

To win a game on tight pockets, one must play at level 48.

To win a game on loose pockets, one must play level 41.

Say one player plays level 48 and the other, level 43.

There is no difference on 2nd table.

Drastic oversimplification, but that's the reason a hack can beat a few bullies in a 2014 bar box tourney.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeephawk View Post
I'm not sure I agree with the "should not go in" part. That assumes that the tighter pockets are what everyone "should be playing". If you are better than another player on a table with tighter pockets, you should be better than that same player on a table with wider pockets. I guess I don't see the possibility that the weaker player may make a "lucky" shot or two is really the reason for tighter pockets - same margin for error for the better player - that's just what the table allows.

If pro players and the average recreational player are really that much better than years gone by, by all means challenge them if that is what they are looking for.

I have an old Anniversary, I'm sure the pockets may be "easy" by what appear to be more modern standards, but I agree with deanoc (luckily I've just had the one table, lol) - I enjoy playing on it and apparently it allows some different options for shots that simply make it different, not better or worse.

Play on whatever you enjoy playing on and accept that the game on whatever table you are playing on is the game you adapt to, IMO.
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11-16-2019, 10:00 AM

Mostly all 9ft tables around here. There is one pool hall with a few Valley Bar boxes, I enjoy playing on them. What I started to notice is that my stroke would be really on point moving over to a 9ft table after hitting some on a barbox table. I found the barbox gave me so much confidence without even knowing it in my stroke. Everything gets smooth and straight.

I don’t really get it, but anytime i see a barbox available, i hit some balls on it before hand for a bit. There really is something to say about being confident in your ability to do something and a big bucket barbox gives you lots of confidence.


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11-16-2019, 10:06 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by trentfromtoledo View Post
Its just my opinion. No need to argue

Trent
No need to argue.
Discuss, Debate. Communicate.

Argue: Exchange or express diverging or opposite views, typically in a heated or angry way.

Discuss: Talk about (something) with another person or group of people.

Debate: A formal discussion on a particular topic in a public meeting or legislative assembly, in which opposing viewpoints are put forward.


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