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JoeyInCali
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09-16-2019, 08:12 PM

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Originally Posted by Low500 View Post
Absolutely astounding that a mere amateur like you has the gall to post advice about stance or anything else pool related concerning a real professional big money hitter like Wu.
The size of your ego is something to behold.
How many money tournaments have you won lately?
Man oh man.......
Neils Feijen had a funky setup.
Bert Kinnister changed it and he won a world title.
Old dogs can learn new tricks .

That coming from you who thinks pros should learn aiming systems and claims pros use CTE but not know it ? Pfft!


  
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Patrick Johnson
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09-16-2019, 08:37 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Low500 View Post
Absolutely astounding that a mere amateur like you has the gall to post advice about stance or anything else pool related concerning a real professional big money hitter like Wu.
The size of your ego is something to behold.
How many money tournaments have you won lately?
Man oh man.......
lol

Maybe a little more fiber in your diet...

pj
chgo
  
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Ralph Kramden
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10-03-2019, 01:38 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
At CB address your stroking hand should be directly below your elbow - and both hand and elbow should be in the same vertical plane as your shoulder.

I think we probably mean the same thing.

pj
chgo
pj...
I think the stroking hand should be close to under your shoulder when the cue tip is near the CB.
Where your cue is before stroking at the CB is when (as you said) your hand is below the elbow.
.


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Recognize a 1/2 ball 30 degree cut, and the 1/8 ball angles.
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FrankieD
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10-03-2019, 02:09 PM

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Originally Posted by born2push View Post
What about it. Jus do it
Grip it and rip it.
  
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Brookeland Bill
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10-03-2019, 02:30 PM

Oh yes the pivot. That imaginary movement for those inclined to come up with a quick fix for their inability to see the contact point. Bahahahahahaha.
  
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Patrick Johnson
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10-03-2019, 06:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
At CB address your stroking hand should be directly below your elbow - and both hand and elbow should be in the same vertical plane as your shoulder.

I think we probably mean the same thing.

pj
chgo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Kramden View Post
pj...
I think the stroking hand should be close to under your shoulder when the cue tip is near the CB.
Where your cue is before stroking at the CB is when (as you said) your hand is below the elbow.
.
I'm a fixed elbow guy so my grip hand isn't under my shoulder until well into my follow through, after the CB is gone.

With my grip hand under my elbow (at CB address), my forearm is about perpendicular to the cue - that's where the arc of my grip hand's movement during the stroke is mostly "level" for the longest time, giving the most room for vertical tip placement error, so that's where I want to be hitting the CB.

I think that's pretty standard fixed elbow stroke rationale.

On the other hand, I think the stroke's natural peak power might come a little after that vertical-forearm point - maybe why we see players move their grip hands forward for breaking. That could make a difference in the feel of the stroke for some.

pj
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Ralph Kramden
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10-10-2019, 01:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
I'm a fixed elbow guy so my grip hand isn't under my shoulder until well into my follow through, after the CB is gone.

With my grip hand under my elbow (at CB address), my forearm is about perpendicular to the cue - that's where the arc of my grip hand's movement during the stroke is mostly "level" for the longest time, giving the most room for vertical tip placement error, so that's where I want to be hitting the CB.

pj
chgo
.
Perhaps. Look at where your hand position is when using a mirror.
I think it best if our viewing audience would decide for themselves.
.


GAMES... http://sites.google.com/site/poolandbilliard

Recognize a 1/2 ball 30 degree cut, and the 1/8 ball angles.
Paralysis by aiming analysis happens by thinking too much.

To play at top speed.. You must own the stop shot line.
  
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Patrick Johnson
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10-10-2019, 04:40 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Kramden View Post
.
Perhaps. Look at where your hand position is when using a mirror.
I think it best if our viewing audience would decide for themselves.
Here's what I mean about the stroke being straightest at the bottom of the pendulum motion with the forearm perpendicular to the cue.

The black lines are the arm and cue at CB address/contact (forearn vertucal, tip at CB); the blue ones are the backswing and followthrough.

Notice that the blue lines at the bottom of the stroke (before and after the vertical forearm) are almost horizontal too - that's where the least vertical tip movement is, minimizing tip placement errors. It's also where the stroke is "coasting" between shot acceleration and followthrough deceleration, where the speed is changing the least, minimizing speed errors.

pj
chgo

P.S. This also shows me that the grip hand can't be under the shoulder until the forearm is folded all the way up to it (or the elbow is dropped all the way down). Maybe I misunderstood you about that...?

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Last edited by Patrick Johnson; 10-11-2019 at 02:06 PM.
  
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Ralph Kramden
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10-11-2019, 08:11 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Johnson View Post
Here's what I mean about the stroke being straightest at the bottom of the pendulum motion with the forearm perpendicular to the cue.

The black lines are the arm and cue at CB address/contact (forearn vertucal, tip at CB); the blue ones are the backswing and followthrough.

Notice that the blue lines at the bottom of the stroke (before and after the vertical forearm) are almost horizontal too - that's where the least vertical tip movement is, minimizing tip placement errors. It's also where the stroke is "coasting" between shot acceleration and followthrough deceleration, so it's also where the speed is changing the least, minimizing speed errors.

pj
chgo

P.S. This also shows me that the grip hand can't be under the shoulder until the forearm is folded all the way up to it (or the elbow is dropped all the way down). Maybe I misunderstood you about that...?

Attachment 531722
Nice drawing pj... My upper arm is MUCH more parallel to the table surface than what you’re showing there.
With my hand more under my shoulder my cue remains somewhat level to the table during the entire stroke
and the butt could even drop somewhat lower during the backswing.

Of course no one is built the same, having longer or shorter bones. Your CB position will change things also.

.


GAMES... http://sites.google.com/site/poolandbilliard

Recognize a 1/2 ball 30 degree cut, and the 1/8 ball angles.
Paralysis by aiming analysis happens by thinking too much.

To play at top speed.. You must own the stop shot line.

Last edited by Ralph Kramden; 10-11-2019 at 08:21 AM.
  
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Patrick Johnson
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10-11-2019, 10:22 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Kramden View Post
Nice drawing pj...
Thanks, Ralph...

Quote:
My upper arm is MUCH more parallel to the table surface than what you’re showing there.
Yeah, the pic shows a stance with the chin close to the cue - I don't get that low either.

Quote:
no one is built the same, having longer or shorter bones. Your CB position will change things also.
True dat.

pj
chgo
  
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