One of the best players I've ever seen, bar none but I only saw him play 9 ball ( but a LOT of it ). But I know he plays / ed ALL games world champion speed.
Best 5 one hole player *ever*
- Thread starter Michael Andros
- Start date
One of the best players I've ever seen, bar none but I only saw him play 9 ball ( but a LOT of it ). But I know he plays / ed ALL games world champion speed.
Michael: If you didn't know about these DVDs, here are 10 hours of Ronnie Allen video. Video captured as he's playing one-pocket in a high-stakes challenge match against Danny Diliberto. It's available for purchase here:
https://www.jayhelfert.com/dvds.html
1988 World One Pocket Challenge Match
RONNIE ALLEN vs. DANNY DILIBERTO
This is the edited version, Two hours and forty minutes.
Featuring all the best shots, plus interviews
and instruction by RONNIE and DANNY
. . . and this unedited version contains all 10 hours of play:
1988 World One Pocket Challenge Match
RONNIE ALLEN vs. DANNY DILIBERTO
This is an unedited full length version.
Five (5) DVDs, almost 10 hours of video
Arnaldo (Not at all shilling for Jay -- I just admire everything he's done for the game for more than four decades . . . his work done at many pro tournaments, and via his books & DVDs, various event promotions, and not least -- info he's contributed here on AZB.)
I know little maybe close to nothing but I've been told that today's guys shoot balls down the table to make it a different game , where the old guys played it mostly at one end of the table , so the great movers of the game have less advantages,, is that true
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In these videos, they play pretty good...but you are not seeing them in their prime....
....Danny is 53...Ronnie is 50
And Ronnie didn’t age well...he was paying for his atrocious life style.
..I first saw Ronnie in his prime..even with one hand, he could beat a short stop...
....playing with two.
Amaldo - Thanks much for the info and links. I've seen part of that match on Youtube. Danny actually took one of the three sets but Ronnie snapped it off in the end. It's actually my favorite R.A. video I've seen, so, much appreciated.
I don't feel you're shilling for Jay at all. Even though I've been to his site multiple times, I wasn't aware of that DVD. Jay's a friend of mine and we speak every once in a while so I'll have to see if he'll knock dollar or so off the price for me. Just like almost every other old pool player, I'm a permanent resident of the poor house. :grin:
Thanks again, Amoldo.
You're very welcome, Michael. Glad to bring these truly rare DVDs of Jay's to your attention, as well as for any other 1P devotees who were unfamiliar with them.
Arnaldo
I watched Tony Chohan make some shots that were astonishing. He has to be up there.
Its my contention that the players of old would need weight to even play with the top tier players of today, I know its great and all to remember these titans of pool as the best, but Efren and Parica are the only 2 to make that list to me.
1. Alex ( in his prime now )
2. Efren
3. Parica
4. Scott Frost ( people will scoff at this one but in his prime he changed the game )
5. Dennis Orcollo
Cliff - Ronnie Allen - Shannon Daulton
I intentionally left off players from very long ago because no one's alive that truly knows there speed and the equipment they played on was so subject.
1. Alex ( in his prime now )
2. Efren
3. Parica
4. Scott Frost ( people will scoff at this one but in his prime he changed the game )
5. Dennis Orcollo
Cliff - Ronnie Allen - Shannon Daulton
I intentionally left off players from very long ago because no one's alive that truly knows there speed and the equipment they played on was so subject.
I have come to the conclusion that one pocket today is an entirely different game from one pocket
of 20 years ago
the strategy has improved greatly,competition is tougher
When Ronnie played there were only a few great players and they seldom played each other
Watchig Tony play was shocking at first ,until i began to realize that he actually knew where the balls were going on those far out shots
He might not have the same judgement of Efren,but this new style
amazes me
In Ronnie's day not many people really understood the game and Ronnie ran over them
Today it is scary
I would probably bet on Ronnie vs Tony,but not without fear
BE Before Efren was a different game is all I am saying
Tighter equipment,endless banks,never missing balls
I am afraid to match up with these guys
of 20 years ago
the strategy has improved greatly,competition is tougher
When Ronnie played there were only a few great players and they seldom played each other
Watchig Tony play was shocking at first ,until i began to realize that he actually knew where the balls were going on those far out shots
He might not have the same judgement of Efren,but this new style
amazes me
In Ronnie's day not many people really understood the game and Ronnie ran over them
Today it is scary
I would probably bet on Ronnie vs Tony,but not without fear
BE Before Efren was a different game is all I am saying
Tighter equipment,endless banks,never missing balls
I am afraid to match up with these guys
Agreed.
First off, the game is (was) such a specialized set of knowledge, pool players have got to be the biggest suckers in sport to have ever let that game get a foothold.
B- you are absolutely right.
First off, the game is (was) such a specialized set of knowledge, pool players have got to be the biggest suckers in sport to have ever let that game get a foothold.
B- you are absolutely right.
I like this post.
The type of one pocket played by the likes of Rags Fitzpatrick, Eddie Taylor, Clem Metz and Hayden Lingo was a different type of one pocket. On onepocket.org, both Eddie Taylor and, yes, our very own Marshall "Squirrel" Carpenter bore witness to the fact that Fitzpatrick was the best of the first era of one pocket (1940's and 1950's). Another thing I read that I found a bit sad is that Rags died the night before the first Johnston City event. How to rank these guys isn't clear, and I did it based on discussions, primarily with Eddie Taylor and John Ervolino, but here goes:
Rags Fitzpatrick
Clem Metz
Eddie Taylor
Hayden Lingo
Marshall Carpenter
Then, there was something of a transition in which players became more offense oriented and the game began to evolve. No doubt, the king of the players of this period, lasting perhaps from 1970-90, was Ronnie Allen, but guys like Jack "Jersey Red" Breit, John Ervolino, Jim Fusco, and Nick Varner fit right into this discussion. If I had to rank them, I'd go as follows:
Ronnie Allen
Nick Varner
Jersey Red
John Ervolino
Jim Fusco
Since 1990 or so, though, one pocket has become a new game, demanding a more daring approach, and since then a few have outshone the others. The king of these is Efren Reyes, but guys like Alex Pagulayan, Scott Frost, Tony Chohan and Francisco Bustamante are all in the discussinon. If I had to rank them, I'd go as follows:
Efren Reyes
Alex Pagulayan
Scott Frost
Francisco Bustamante
Tony Chohan
Seems 100% that I've omitted some all-time greats from the discussion, but this is one tough topic.
Comparing Fitzpatrick to Allen to Reyes is, in truth, near impossible. Each was the king in their own era, but they played three different types of one pocket.
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Having seen Ronnie Allen play a number of times, I think he
was the beginning of the more 'aggressive' style of One Pocket...
but you did have guys like Jersey Red and Bugs who could bank
from anywhere!
Then Efren just brought his insane cue ball control and shot-
making to the game. My dream 1P match would be Ronnie and
Efren both in their prime.
was the beginning of the more 'aggressive' style of One Pocket...
but you did have guys like Jersey Red and Bugs who could bank
from anywhere!
Then Efren just brought his insane cue ball control and shot-
making to the game. My dream 1P match would be Ronnie and
Efren both in their prime.
I place Nick Varner in with the newer great shot makers
I doubt he would give many games away,shoot many wrong shots,
fail to get out when opportunity arose
My guess is that he might be the best ever
If not he would be my sentimental favorite and i would bet on him
I just don't have the heart to bet on people that shoot too many
high risk shots
I am not saying he can beat Efren today,I just wish they played in their primes
And i do put Efren at the top of the modern players in his prime
It seemed to me that he had great judgement,banking abilities,
cue ball control,knowledge of the rails and if any weakness it was not moving the balls uptable in the end game when he needed 1 or 2 balls (playing the count)
I would like to hear his defense of my critique
I doubt he would give many games away,shoot many wrong shots,
fail to get out when opportunity arose
My guess is that he might be the best ever
If not he would be my sentimental favorite and i would bet on him
I just don't have the heart to bet on people that shoot too many
high risk shots
I am not saying he can beat Efren today,I just wish they played in their primes
And i do put Efren at the top of the modern players in his prime
It seemed to me that he had great judgement,banking abilities,
cue ball control,knowledge of the rails and if any weakness it was not moving the balls uptable in the end game when he needed 1 or 2 balls (playing the count)
I would like to hear his defense of my critique
Having seen Ronnie Allen play a number of times, I think he
was the beginning of the more 'aggressive' style of One Pocket...
but you did have guys like Jersey Red and Bugs who could bank
from anywhere!
Then Efren just brought his insane cue ball control and shot-
making to the game. My dream 1P match would be Ronnie and
Efren both in their prime.
And I'd like Ronnie but I know I'm most likely in the minority. He was just such a pitbull-on-crack when he played for the cheese. I just don't see how *anyone* could've faded that when he was in his mid-to-late 20s. And it isn't an age-prejudice deal. Efren's 2 weeks older than I am. It's just a strong feeling about R.A.'s game.
Hey, interesting comment. I have noticed that Efren likes to keep his balls down-table, regardless of the ball count too. In one match I was watching online, the Commentators even mentioned that this was his style. I guess that Efren doesn't like to "waste" time by playing an up-table game, since his cue ball control and skills of running balls are so great when the balls are down-table, he probably figures that he's still not in much danger of giving away the game when playing like this.
Having seen Ronnie Allen play a number of times, I think he
was the beginning of the more 'aggressive' style of One Pocket...
but you did have guys like Jersey Red and Bugs who could bank
from anywhere!
Then Efren just brought his insane cue ball control and shot-
making to the game. My dream 1P match would be Ronnie and
Efren both in their prime.
I think Efren and Ronnie are the two giants.....
...the general feeling in Ronnie’s day was that he was two years ahead of everybody.
Well, I think Efren was two years ahead in his time also.
...but the best players are today...they are heirs to accumulated knowledge.
I got to see Eddie play a number of times at a place called Guys & Dolls in Suitland
MD. I was there for the famous match between him And Eddie Kelly. Best 1 hole I
ever saw till Efren . Eddie T ran 8 & out from nowhere when Kelly needed 1.
Started with a kick bank off the bottom rail, then 1 3 railer, a 2 railer and out !
Still one of the greatest outs I've ever seen. The whole room applaud ! Kelly's stake horse didn't like that ! lol