Albrecht vs. Bartram challenge?

tucson9ball · Aug 15, 2013

This is supposed to take place in a few days and does anybody know what is in the middle?

I've heard it will be live streamed PPV and the winner will get 75% /loser gets 25%. This sounds like bith players will make money regardless of the outcome.

There are people making side bets in the action room, or 'trying" to get bets. The line on this is in question.

What I'm getting at is this...any time there is more bet on the rail than in the middle, seems a lil weird to me.

Anybody else have thoughts?

gutshot · Aug 15, 2013

I'm of the philosophy that if you are not one of the two players matching up, then you don't need to know.

That being said, I doubt the loser will be making any money.

BasementDweller · Aug 15, 2013

What is a man's sense of pride worth?

Personally, when it comes to grudge matches I don't see how it really matters how much they are betting. Both of these guys have their pride on the line here. If Chris cleans his clock like he is implying he will, I think this will set Gene back a bit, not to mention it's not exactly great PR for his instruction.

On the other hand, if Gene pulls out the victory do you thing Chris will be able to say, "Well, we weren't betting enough!" I don't.

Sometimes it's not about the money.

KoolKat9Lives · Aug 15, 2013

gutshot said:
I'm of the philosophy that if you are not one of the two players matching up, then you don't need to know.

That may be true but...

- it's never stopped some people here from asking

- some people know, and usually someone leaks it

- it makes people feel really cool to know it when others don't

- it's pool, ain't much transparency

Scott Lee · Aug 15, 2013

This is a BS statement. Gene teaches a LOT of players, and most of them see some kind of immediate improvement (same thing as me, Randyg, Stan, Little Joe, Joe T, and many others). It has nothing to do with how well he plays. That's like saying Pro One has no validity unless Stan Shuffett wins the US Open 9 Ball. Gene plays great, but Bartram is better...and will win this match, imo. I don't think losing one match with a pro-ability player will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson biz...maybe on his pocketbook, but not his business. Again, this is my opinion, as a fellow teacher. Best of luck to both players! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

BasementDweller said:
If Chris cleans his clock like he is implying he will, I think this will set Gene back a bit, not to mention it's not exactly great PR for his instruction.

cookie man · Aug 15, 2013

Scott Lee said:
This is a BS statement. Gene teaches a LOT of players, and most of them see some kind of immediate improvement (same thing as me, Randyg, Stan, Little Joe, Joe T, and many others). It has nothing to do with how well he plays. That's like saying Pro One has no validity unless Stan Shuffett wins the US Open 9 Ball. Gene plays great, but Bartram is better...and will win this match, imo. I don't think losing one match with a pro-ability player will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson biz...maybe on his pocketbook, but not his business. Again, this is my opinion, as a fellow teacher. Best of luck to both players! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Well said Scott.

Okie · Aug 15, 2013

While the amount is really not our concern I believe that your instincts are spot on Chris. Something don't add up with this match. I am sure the answer lies in the same place as all answers....follow the money and you will find the answer.

Ken

Okie · Aug 15, 2013

Scott Lee said:
This is a BS statement. Gene teaches a LOT of players, and most of them see some kind of immediate improvement (same thing as me, Randyg, Stan, Little Joe, Joe T, and many others). It has nothing to do with how well he plays. That's like saying Pro One has no validity unless Stan Shuffett wins the US Open 9 Ball. Gene plays great, but Bartram is better...and will win this match, imo. I don't think losing one match with a pro-ability player will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson biz...maybe on his pocketbook, but not his business. Again, this is my opinion, as a fellow teacher. Best of luck to both players! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

You're absolutely correct Scott!

Teaching != playing
Chris Bartram's game > Geno's

Ken

BasementDweller · Aug 15, 2013

Scott Lee said:
This is a BS statement. Gene teaches a LOT of players, and most of them see some kind of immediate improvement (same thing as me, Randyg, Stan, Little Joe, Joe T, and many others). It has nothing to do with how well he plays. That's like saying Pro One has no validity unless Stan Shuffett wins the US Open 9 Ball. Gene plays great, but Bartram is better...and will win this match, imo. I don't think losing one match with a pro-ability player will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson biz...maybe on his pocketbook, but not his business. Again, this is my opinion, as a fellow teacher. Best of luck to both players! :thumbup:

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

For it to be a "BS statement" as you so eloquently put it, wouldn't it have to be untrue? Basically, what you are saying is -- if Gene gets wiped out and doesn't look very good on the table that would be GOOD PR for his instruction? I don't think so and that's what I said. It's pretty simple really.

If you want to be delusional and think that an instructor that PLAYS bad on video is not bad for business than go right ahead. Although I would call that type of thinking BS.

Banks · Aug 15, 2013

It was posted a few times in the other thread what they're playing for, I think in the first page or two. Gene's got a huge pair to put up his hard cash on this one. Can't deny that one bit.

Put_upor_shutup · Aug 15, 2013

tucson9ball said:
This is supposed to take place in a few days and does anybody know what is in the middle?

I've heard it will be live streamed PPV and the winner will get 75% /loser gets 25%. This sounds like bith players will make money regardless of the outcome.

There are people making side bets in the action room, or 'trying" to get bets. The line on this is in question.

What I'm getting at is this...any time there is more bet on the rail than in the middle, seems a lil weird to me.

Anybody else have thoughts?

Seems a little weird to u?Maybe its just better if u put it on paper the way u are thinking it in ur head so we can determine exactly what u r saying?Are u implying that maybe they are not really playing like we think or something?Interesting..

mantis99 · Aug 15, 2013

BasementDweller said:
For it to be a "BS statement" as you so eloquently put it, wouldn't it have to be untrue? Basically, what you are saying is -- if Gene gets wiped out and doesn't look very good on the table that would be GOOD PR for his instruction? I don't think so and that's what I said. It's pretty simple really.

If you want to be delusional and think that an instructor that PLAYS bad on video is not bad for business than go right ahead. Although I would call that type of thinking BS.

Any local teacher would get hammered by Johny Archer. I highly doubt the local players would hold that against him. If Gene goes out and can't run 3 balls, then I expect that would hurt his business. If he goes out and plays a solid game but gets beat by a superior pro level player, I don't think that will hurt him at all. In fact, if he has a good showing and still loses, it may actually benefit his business if people see that he can play at an advanced level.

KoolKat9Lives · Aug 15, 2013

Gene has proven repeatedly he has a strong game. No way he's gonna play Chris like a blind overweight dachsund with epilepsy. No way he loses more students than he gains in this endeavor. IMO

BasementDweller · Aug 15, 2013

mantis99 said:
Any local teacher would get hammered by Johny Archer. I highly doubt the local players would hold that against him. If Gene goes out and can't run 3 balls, then I expect that would hurt his business. If he goes out and plays a solid game but gets beat by a superior pro level player, I don't think that will hurt him at all. In fact, if he has a good showing and still loses, it may actually benefit his business if people see that he can play at an advanced level.

Exactly my point.

While Scott and Geno are both instructors they go about it totally differently from what I can tell. Geno shows people that he can play. They gather round and see what he can do. Then he opens up and shares some info with them about what makes HIS game tick. It's because HE CAN play that he becomes believable. This is what opens doors for him...like it or not.

Scott goes about it totally differently, as do many instructors. He can fill us in on his business model if he wants to.

I'm not debating whether or not instructors should be judged by how well they play. The fact is, by many people they are. If Geno goes out and gets drilled 21-7 and 21-9, it won't exactly be good for his business model.

Scott Lee · Aug 15, 2013

Chris...I never said Gene will play "bad", and I seriously doubt that he will. It may even be a close match. All I said was that I believe Bartram plays better. I also seriously doubt that losing a match to Bartram will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson business...that's coming from another instructor who couldn't beat Bartram either (and never claims to be some kind of champion player)! LOL People who choose who to take lessons from, based solely on who can beat whom, are seriously delusional. Yes, a good instructor has to be able to play and be able to demonstrate concepts and principals, but they sure don't have to play pro level to be a good teacher. Conversely, I've personally seen pro players who couldn't teach at all!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

BasementDweller said:
If you want to be delusional and think that an instructor that PLAYS bad on video is not bad for business than go right ahead. Although I would call that type of thinking BS.

Scott Lee · Aug 15, 2013

Chris...Since you've never been around either one of us, you're mistaken here too. Gene goes into a room, and does free "mini" lessons, I think he calls them, to anyone who wants them. Some people choose to get the full lesson from him, based on that. They may or may not see him playing, either gambling or in a tournament. Gene is promoting his aiming method...not his obvious playing ability. The way he teaches, from what I know (and I have heard from many people) involves much more than just Perfect Aim...as it should. Not all that different than what Randyg, me and many other good instructors do.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

BasementDweller said:
Exactly my point.

While Scott and Geno are both instructors they go about it totally differently from what I can tell. Geno shows people that he can play. They gather round and see what he can do. Then he opens up and shares some info with them about what makes HIS game tick. It's because HE CAN play that he becomes believable. This is what opens doors for him...like it or not.

Scott goes about it totally differently, as do many instructors. He can fill us in on his business model if he wants to.

I'm not debating whether or not instructors should be judged by how well they play. The fact is, by many people they are. If Geno goes out and gets drilled 21-7 and 21-9, it won't exactly be good for his business model.

klockdoc · Aug 15, 2013

Scott Lee said:
Chris...I never said Gene will play "bad", and I seriously doubt that he will. It may even be a close match. All I said was that I believe Bartram plays better. I also seriously doubt that losing a match to Bartram will have any negative affect on Gene's lesson business...that's coming from another instructor who couldn't beat Bartram either (and never claims to be some kind of champion player)! LOL People who choose who to take lessons from, based solely on who can beat whom, are seriously delusional. Yes, a good instructor has to be able to play and be able to demonstrate concepts and principals, but they sure don't have to play pro level to be a good teacher. Conversely, I've personally seen pro players who couldn't teach at all!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

I've asked a lot of pro/semi pro players his they perform different shots and get the response, "I don't know, I just see them".

I like the instructors that can tell you WHY it happened the way it happened and how to duplicate it. That's an Instructor.

BasementDweller · Aug 15, 2013

Scott Lee said:
Chris...Since you've never been around either one of us, you're mistaken here too. Gene goes into a room, and does free "mini" lessons, I think he calls them, to anyone who wants them. Some people choose to get the full lesson from him, based on that. They may or may not see him playing, either gambling or in a tournament. Gene is promoting his aiming method...not his obvious playing ability. The way he teaches, from what I know (and I have heard from many people) involves much more than just Perfect Aim...as it should. Not all that different than what Randyg, me and many other good instructors do.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

GOOD GRIEF....wrong again. I've been in the room with him and watched him live and in action.

Even jumped in a few ring games with him.

You two go about it differently. I'm fairly certain of that.

***Edit to add -- I have been venturing out of my basement the last couple of years.

***

Limpkinw · Aug 15, 2013

Are there many/any instructions in the world that would be favored against Bartram?

If so it is a short list.

Kudos to Gene for putting up. I think he can surprise!

Gene gets business in a few ways, sometimes he does mini lessons sometimes he plays and then lets that open the door.

I wish both players luck.

nobcitypool · Aug 15, 2013

I've had multiple lessons from both Scott and Gene. For sure, they go about it slightly different as they're focus is generally on different areas of the game. Scott's primary focus, initially at least, is on the stroke. Gene's focus in on Perfect Aim. With that said, both share a common thread in that they both spend the majority of the time instructing with the student having the cue in his hand versus show and tell. Neither use very much show and tell at all. If the student has difficulty with a concept, a shot or whatever, they will then step forward and demonstrate it for the student.

That's first hand experience and knowledge providing that description, take it for whatever it is worth. Both Scott and Gene can play as well, nobody can be confused. If Gene is on and Chris is off a bit, it could be a very tight match. I seriously doubt Gene will embarrass himself, he is a very good player. I think people have to realize Bartram can beat just about anybody on the planet on any given day. The match is being played in his home town on what apparently is considered to be his home table. Something is out of sync here if he doesn't win rather handily.

Albrecht vs. Bartram challenge?

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

Taught 'em all I know

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

Seeker

Seeker

AzB Silver Member

Banned

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

Taught 'em all I know

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

ughhhhhhhhhh

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member

AzB Silver Member