Help me run this rack

bruin70 said:

a few nice things about a below the rack breakshot,,,1...there's almost ALWAYS one available. i have never had to manufacture a below-the-rack, whereas there are times when one must do so for a traditional break,,,2...a setup ball is easy if not right there because all one eventually has to do is roll the cb down to the rail,,,3...the breakshot will always be short with no reaching no fuss no muss. don't have to worry about left hand-right hand issues...4,,,in setting this up, there is more leeway for error than any other breakshot i know.

the only reason i don't used it more is because of the stigma of tradition.

Click to expand...

You know I enjoy talking straight pool with you, Bruin. This is a rare exception where I disagree. It is hard for me to believe you have never manufactured a break ball, as the opportunity to do so comes up quite often. Here is a pattern I rather enjoy playing, which I'm sure you've seen and played yourself about a thousand times:

http://CueTable.com/P/?@3AEUY3BCIx4CVML4PBRQ@

- Steve

TheOne said:

What is the order of precedence, take a below rack break shot and connect the dots without doing any hard work or change your whole rack agenda because it's not perfect?

Click to expand...

Count me among the group who loves below-the-rack break shots. When it's off to one side, and you don't have to play it the Craig-Riley-Sexy-Inside-English-Way, it's unmissable, predictable, and very high-yielding.

Bruin mentioned a stigma about these shots... I sure hope new players to the game aren't passing these shots up. For all the reasons Bruin mentioned, they are excellent shots.

- Steve

TheOne said:

well said, I think it's a sexy shot when played well with running side bring the cb round 3 rails into the centre of the table for a feast of shots.

This rack brings up a good point though, all thes balls are in makeable positions without having to break into anything. What is the order of precedence, take a below rack break shot and connect the dots without doing any hard work or change your whole rack agenda because it's not perfect?

Click to expand...

I think unless you are very familiar with them, knowing where the cue ball is going, its easy to get into trouble. Lot of congestion in a smaller area. The pocket is also smaller, especially on a tight table, but you are closer, and frequently the break requires better execution. That is to say most of the time you are using english, and top or bottom spin.

The example stated is what I mean. Yes, you go 3 rails, but you shoot the shot with high inside english. Not that its that difficult. I agree it looks cool. As does going through the last couple balls and spinning up to the center. But my favorite is launching the cue ball so it bounces over the balls a little, but thats more common a shot or two after the break. Some of the small pleasures of 14.1

cuetable said:

Hi,

Just a friendly note that might be helpful to you
From your original layout, if you press "K" and then "N" (both capital letters) you will then get this as the result:

http://CueTable.com/P/?@4AATm4Bcps4...HBjH3IcQs4JCBc3KcQq4LCww1Mbjt4NEcO3OcYu3PaRN@

If you then press "D" it will save the result onto page2.

(the idea of having multiple pages came from Steve Lipsky. he gave me another great idea the other day for me to work on)

Click to expand...

Thanks, for the tip Wei.

Steve Lipsky said:

Count me among the group who loves below-the-rack break shots. When it's off to one side, and you don't have to play it the Craig-Riley-Sexy-Inside-English-Way, it's unmissable, predictable, and very high-yielding.

Bruin mentioned a stigma about these shots... I sure hope new players to the game aren't passing these shots up. For all the reasons Bruin mentioned, they are excellent shots.

- Steve

Click to expand...

lmao, Steve, at my level of play, I'll take any break shot I can get. Below the rack break shots are easier to set up a lot of the time.

hehe, love this thread, good to hear other ideas as I'm very much still learning. Interesting to hear that most people still decided to try to develop a better break ball despite 1 or 2 being available. Also interesting to hear the different ways people chose to go into the cluster. I think it's the snooker in me that enjoys picking a pack apart with each shot opening a ball into the opposite pocket, often a large cluster can be taken apart this way without breaking into it.

PS
I still like the break shot off the 10, I'd be confident of catching the 8 ball half ball first which would nudge the other balls out and open it up nicely (if I passed up the sexy one of course! )

TheOne said:

This rack is all about 1 question, do you like any of the 10 as a break ball?
If yes then ALL the balls can be picked off without moving anything. Once the 3 and 11 have been removed the 2 and 8 can go and then the 1 and 12 will go in the opposite corner using the 14 for easy position. I do like this type of break shot but I suspect the 10 ball maybe a little too central to be ideal.

Therefore as an alternative I would move the 3 and then the 11 because I really like the ATTACK ANGLE from the 10 into the cluster early on (probably 4th shot). I think this shot played at slowish speed would create several break balls and also has many insurance balls if played at the right speed.

Click to expand...

Craig,

I saw the 10 ball too. I think that if you are able to maneuver around this layout and leave yourself a stop shot on the 11 for your key ball, that this is the best angle to get the most from the ensuing break shot. The only problem I see is the 2 and the 8, and you will have to leave the 11 there - not sure how successful I would be at that, maybe I will try it tomorrow to see how it works. BTW - layouts like this are like a good woman, sometimes I just can't help myself and I gotta hit it from behind.

Steve Lipsky said:

You know I enjoy talking straight pool with you, Bruin. This is a rare exception where I disagree. It is hard for me to believe you have never manufactured a break ball, as the opportunity to do so ,,,,,,,,,,

http://CueTable.com/P/?@3AEUY3BCIx4CVML4PBRQ@

- Steve

Click to expand...

i think the reason is, steve, that i still play a "traditional" game, and i'll only opt for the below the rack shot if i don't have a decent normal break, and in those situations, the BTR shots are alway there. . maybe if i decide to play a whole game below the rack, i might have to move some balls. i don't do it enough to encounter any probs.

.........GO BRUINS !!!!!.........
you knew THAT was coming.

From the consenses of ideas, if I may make an observation. This discussion is developing a following, a commradre of sorts. An exchange of ideas and tactics. It like continuing ed., and making friends at the same time.

bruin70 said:

a few nice things about a below the rack breakshot,,,1...there's almost ALWAYS one available. i have never had to manufacture a below-the-rack, whereas there are times when one must do so for a traditional break,,,2...a setup ball is easy if not right there because all one eventually has to do is roll the cb down to the rail,,,3...the breakshot will always be short with no reaching no fuss no muss. don't have to worry about left hand-right hand issues...4,,,in setting this up, there is more leeway for error than any other breakshot i know.

the only reason i don't used it more is because of the stigma of tradition.

Click to expand...

I don't know much, but personally, I only go to the behind the rack break if there's nothing off the sides of the rack available. IOW, it's my second choice as far as break balls go, mostly because you pretty much have only one choice -- a lot of follow, maybe with some english -- as far as where exactly you're going to go into the stack, if you want to break open the rack and get to the center of the table. IOW, you're limited as to how much you can manipulate the cue ball with this shot. Also, there's a good chance you're going to run into traffic going either way -- one or three rails -- especially going by the corner balls.

Lou Figueroa

excuse me if anyone has brought this up, as this thread is now 4 pages long and i'm lazy,,,,

but i think the 7 - 3 - 11 bump the 15 off the rail and out for a breakshot is eminently do-able. from there you can shoot the 10 - 8 and open the cluster,,,or 9 - 8, break the cluster. if the cb gets on the amatuer side of the 8, you go 8 - 2 break the cluster.

the thing is, you already can settle for the 10 - 14 as breakballs,,,the four ball cluster can provide a breakball,,,the 15 can be bumped. that's SEVEN different balls to create breakshots with and six balls (14/7/10/3/15/9) in various combinations to realize them. so it's a matter of how much time do you want to spend fineggling your ideal breakshot.

i could spend more time thinking about all the choices than actually shooting.

There Is No Cluster To Break

The break shot is the 10 and the key ball is the 15, these have to stay. I think the 9 will go into the corner without moving the 15, if I'm correct shoot the 7, 3, 13, 11 (to clear the way for the 1 and 12 later), then the 2, 8 and 14 (these were not a cluster and should not have been moved). Then the 1 and 12 in the corner by the 15, draw back enough off the 12 to see the 5 in the side then the 4 in the lower left corner. Then shoot the 9 behind the 15 into the corner and finally drop the 15 in the same corner for easy position for a behind the rack break with the 10.

If the 9 won't go behind the 15 shoot the 15 after the 4 and leave yourself straight on the 9 into the far corner with little draw for position on the 10.

Most important, don't move the 8,2,1,12, 14 group before pocketing them. If you do you'll create problems that can't be predicted.

Recently I have had a number of 30 ball runs and once in a while a 40 or 50 so take my suggestions with a bit of caution.

Good Luck!