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Exclamation How to Find the Perfect Pool Stance - 05-09-2019, 10:38 AM

FYI, I just posted a new YouTube video in which I demonstrate "textbook" or "orthodox" pool and snooker stances and offer advice and techniques to help an individual find their own perfect stance. Here it is:

How to Find the Perfect Pool/Snooker/Billiards Stance

Check it out and let me know what you think.

Did I leave out anything important?

Do you think I represented anything incorrectly?

Thank you in advance for the feedback,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 10:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dave View Post
FYI, I just posted a new YouTube video in which I demonstrate "textbook" or "orthodox" pool and snooker stances and offer advice and techniques to help an individual find their own perfect stance. Here it is:

How to Find the Perfect Pool/Snooker/Billiards Stance

Check it out and let me know what you think.

Did I leave out anything important?

Do you think I represented anything incorrectly?

Thank you in advance for the feedback,
Dave
FYI, here are the additional resources mentioned in the video:

Earlier videos dealing with the stance:
- stance fundamentals
- things people do wrong with the stance

Additional supporting resources dealing with important related topics:
- stance FAQ resource page
- advantages of a low stance
- fundamentals “best practices” check-sheet
- pre-shot routine
- vision center
- stroke fundamentals

Enjoy,
Dave

Last edited by dr_dave; 05-09-2019 at 01:00 PM.
  
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05-09-2019, 10:54 AM

Thank you! At my age (75) and height (6'3") I do bend my knees with a wider stance..

Left eye has macular degeration, so I don't place the cue directly under my chin.

The point? Stance can and should be an individual thing. So glad you brought that up.
  
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05-09-2019, 10:54 AM

I stopped watching after the part where you said, ideally, weight distributed equally between both feet.
  
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05-09-2019, 11:03 AM

I didn't hear anything about ''torso weight''.


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Stance - 05-09-2019, 11:08 AM

Thank you Dr. Dave! Great stuff!

I'm frustrated that I don't have this totally solved. When I played many hours a day it was never a problem, but these days I have struggled with a couple of things.

First of all, my vision center is very far to the left, but not totally under my left eye. I am a right handed player. I use a more traditional pool stance. I have tried the snooker stance but I do struggle with timing and power, and also distance from the table. For whatever reason I keep coming back to the pool stance. OK, fine, it should work. But my challenge is that while when I am standing up I am sighting the ball correctly under my vision center, it's easy to get off line as I drop into the shot. In other words since my left leg is stepping forward and to the left it is easy for my balance to shift a little to the left and for my eyes to slide out of line. Sometimes I solve this by placing my left foot, then sighting upright again, then making sure I come straight down, but it seems a little clumsy.

My other big challenge is with elevated shots. It doesn't help that I'm 5'7", but Varner and Pagulyan can do it. I haven't figured out the best stance. Do I move my front foot forward, then kick my back foot out and behind me? I don't know what's best, and it's really hard sighting when my body is elevated.

The only solution I've come up with is to shoot lots of drills that require great sighting, elevation, and so on. I just try to outwork it. But I know if I had a better set up I'd play better.

I'll read the rest of your resources and keep practicing. Much appreciated!
  
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05-09-2019, 11:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by pwd72s View Post
Thank you! At my age (75) and height (6'3") I do bend my knees with a wider stance..

Left eye has macular degeration, so I don't place the cue directly under my chin.

The point? Stance can and should be an individual thing. So glad you brought that up.
Thank you for the comments.

Stance can be very "individual," but many individuals seem to have trouble finding the best solution.

I hope the video helps some of those people,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 11:22 AM

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Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
I didn't hear anything about ''torso weight''.
Good point. Somebody with a heavy torso is probably even less suited to a "textbook" or "orthodox" stance, with lots of waist bend. A wider stance and more knee bend would definitely be better for these people.

Or did you have other ideas in mind?

Thanks,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 11:30 AM

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Originally Posted by FranCrimi View Post
I stopped watching after the part where you said, ideally, weight distributed equally between both feet.
I assume you are making a point that some (if not many) people have more weight on the back foot, and I agree with you. But I looked through many books and online resources before I filmed the video to make sure I adequately represented what most people think are the "generally recommended" "textbook" or "orthodox" pool and snooker stances.

Also, I clearly state and demonstrate in several places in the video how things need to be customized for each individual.

I hope you can find the desire and patience to watch the remainder of the video.

Regards, and thanks for the comment,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 11:36 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Man View Post
Thank you Dr. Dave! Great stuff!
You're welcome ... and thank you. I aim to swerve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Man View Post
I'm frustrated that I don't have this totally solved. When I played many hours a day it was never a problem, but these days I have struggled with a couple of things.

First of all, my vision center is very far to the left, but not totally under my left eye. I am a right handed player. I use a more traditional pool stance. I have tried the snooker stance but I do struggle with timing and power, and also distance from the table. For whatever reason I keep coming back to the pool stance. OK, fine, it should work. But my challenge is that while when I am standing up I am sighting the ball correctly under my vision center, it's easy to get off line as I drop into the shot. In other words since my left leg is stepping forward and to the left it is easy for my balance to shift a little to the left and for my eyes to slide out of line. Sometimes I solve this by placing my left foot, then sighting upright again, then making sure I come straight down, but it seems a little clumsy.
You might try placing both feet before the shot, and practice bringing your head straight down, as I demonstrate in the video. You might also try the "mirror stance chicken dance" that I demonstrate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Man View Post
My other big challenge is with elevated shots. It doesn't help that I'm 5'7", but Varner and Pagulyan can do it. I haven't figured out the best stance. Do I move my front foot forward, then kick my back foot out and behind me? I don't know what's best, and it's really hard sighting when my body is elevated.

The only solution I've come up with is to shoot lots of drills that require great sighting, elevation, and so on. I just try to outwork it. But I know if I had a better set up I'd play better.
FYI, some good advice for this can be found here:

elevated cue effects and advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Man View Post
I'll read the rest of your resources and keep practicing. Much appreciated!
I like when people do their "homework." I hope you find some things that are helpful.

Regards,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 12:49 PM

Good info dr. dave. I try to keep my back leg straight with the cue over that toe.
Whether or not that happens might be questionable but it's my thought process.

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05-09-2019, 01:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dave View Post
Good point. Somebody with a heavy torso is probably even less suited to a "textbook" or "orthodox" stance, with lots of waist bend. A wider stance and more knee bend would definitely be better for these people.

Or did you have other ideas in mind?

Thanks,
Dave
Teeter totter torso tummy.

Like a teeter totter, when one bends over forward to lay their bridge hand on the surface to address the shot, one also offsets this forward movement by sticking their back side outward...........................


Here's how I explain the OP.


To me, just saying ''weight between the feet'' is VERY misleading to the end user/student. One must 1st explain what ''WBTF'' really means. Also using the word Orthodox/textbook/terminology to explain stance is vague.

First, I ask my students if they have ever sat on a 3 legged chair, and I also mention to them how stable it is to sit in, especially on an uneven surface.

Next I tell them/like that chair, your body also has 3 weight bearing points to be ''aware'' of. One weight point for each foot, and one weight point for your torso. Two of your weight points physically touch the ground.

When they are down on the shot I make them....Very Aware of where their torso center of weight ''IS''. Their 3rd leg.

The 3rd legs weight, is it left of center, right, is it too forward or too rearward? Is it centered between your leg spread? Will it allow your bridge hand to flop on the play surface and bear no ''weight''.


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05-09-2019, 01:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph Kramden View Post
Good info dr. dave. I try to keep my back leg straight with the cue over that toe.
Whether or not that happens might be questionable but it's my thought process.
This is certainly the "textbook" approach, but it isn't the best answer for all people, especially tall people like me.

Regards,
Dave
  
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05-09-2019, 01:15 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Island Drive View Post
Teeter totter torso tummy.

Like a teeter totter, when one bends over forward to lay their bridge hand on the surface to address the shot, one also offsets this forward movement by sticking their back side outward...........................


Here's how I explain the OP.


To me, just saying ''weight between the feet'' is VERY misleading to the end user/student. One must 1st explain what ''WBTF'' really means. Also using the word Orthodox/textbook/terminology to explain stance is vague.

First, I ask my students if they have ever sat on a 3 legged chair, and I also mention to them how stable it is to sit in, especially on an uneven surface.

Next I tell them/like that chair, your body also has 3 weight bearing points to be ''aware'' of. One weight point for each foot, and one weight point for your torso. Two of your weight points physically touch the ground.

When they are down on the shot I make them....Very Aware of where their torso center of weight ''IS''. Their 3rd leg.

The 3rd legs weight, is it left of center, right, is it too forward or too rearward? Is it centered between your leg spread? Will it allow your bridge hand to flop on the play surface and bear no ''weight''.
Thanks Bill.

It sounds like you are saying: The center of gravity of your torso should be fairly centered between your feet, and the weight on the feet should be balanced front (toes) to back (heels). Would you say that's an accurate summary of your approach?

Regards,
Dave

Last edited by dr_dave; 05-09-2019 at 01:17 PM.
  
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Thanks Dave - 05-09-2019, 01:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_dave View Post
FYI, I just posted a new YouTube video in which I demonstrate "textbook" or "orthodox" pool and snooker stances and offer advice and techniques to help an individual find their own perfect stance. Here it is:

How to Find the Perfect Pool/Snooker/Billiards Stance

Check it out and let me know what you think.

Did I leave out anything important?

Do you think I represented anything incorrectly?

Thank you in advance for the feedback,
Dave
Very interesting, thanks for the video.
  
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