AzBilliards.com Simple question for you experts on 14.1
 Page 2 of 2 < 12
(#16)
Dan White
AzB Silver Member

Status: Online
Posts: 3,292
vCash: 500
Join Date: Oct 2005

02-15-2018, 03:48 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by RobMan This right here. f your table has a score counter - use one scoring wheel for the running score; the other for the rack score. Subtract off the running score so that the rack score always add to 14. End of rack - add the rack score to the running score and reset the rack wheels to zero. If using paper, use tick marks for each ball score. At end of each rack, right the running score in the grid and circle. If you subsequently foul, subtract from the running score. Or use an app like Straight Pool Deluxe on your Ipad!
Just a comment about score keeping in general... I don't know how everybody else keeps score, but this is what I was taught and what I find easiest. Opponent runs a few balls and misses. He marks his score on the beads or score counter. I run about half a rack and miss. I have no idea how many I made because that's the last thing I should be thinking about during a run. After my miss, I count the balls on the table, say 5. Then I look at my opponent's rack score of 4. That makes 9. It takes 6 balls to total 15 so I know I have 6 balls. As a side note, if I already had 1 ball it wouldn't matter. I still have a total of 6.

Sorry if I'm pointing out the obvious but I didn't want anyone to confuse counting up to 14 for some reason instead of 15.

Dan White

(#17)
ChrisinNC
AzB Silver Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 1,322
vCash: 500
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Boone, NC

02-15-2018, 10:05 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dan White Just a comment about score keeping in general... I don't know how everybody else keeps score, but this is what I was taught and what I find easiest. Opponent runs a few balls and misses. He marks his score on the beads or score counter. I run about half a rack and miss. I have no idea how many I made because that's the last thing I should be thinking about during a run. After my miss, I count the balls on the table, say 5. Then I look at my opponent's rack score of 4. That makes 9. It takes 6 balls to total 15 so I know I have 6 balls. As a side note, if I already had 1 ball it wouldn't matter. I still have a total of 6. Sorry if I'm pointing out the obvious but I didn't want anyone to confuse counting up to 14 for some reason instead of 15.
We have dial scorers on the wall near the chairs for each table, with four dials (2 on top and 2 on bottom) so you can keep the rack score and the total score for each player. It kind of gets on my nerves when I'm playing a young player who doesn't understand the etiquette of keeping score in straight pool, who keeps his finger on the dial while I'm shooting, adjusting the dial after every ball I make. It takes a little time until they understand the concept of not having to do that, and that all you need to do at the end of any player's inning is to subtract from 15 the number of balls left on the table and the number of balls made in the rack to that point by both players, and whatever is remaining is what the player's run totals, and each rack score when one ball is left on the table always adds up to 14 - very simple once you get the hang of it,

 (#18) tc in l a AzB Silver Member     Status: Offline Posts: 310 vCash: 1700 iTrader: 7 / 100% Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: los angeles 02-16-2018, 11:15 AM Hey Chris, thanks for your all of your input from a proprietor's view, sounds like you have a great room. Can you post a picture or two of these counters you're using and where you bought them? Tony C
(#19)
RobMan
AzB Silver Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 634
vCash: 500
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Marietta, GA

02-16-2018, 01:31 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dan White Sorry if I'm pointing out the obvious but I didn't want anyone to confuse counting up to 14 for some reason instead of 15.
This is exactly the way I was taught many many years ago and the way I do it today. You are right, sometimes what we think is obvious is not.

(#20)
ChrisinNC
AzB Silver Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 1,322
vCash: 500
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Boone, NC

02-16-2018, 03:46 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by tc in l a Hey Chris, thanks for your all of your input from a proprietor's view, sounds like you have a great room. Can you post a picture or two of these counters you're using and where you bought them? Tony C
Thanks. I'll try to take a photo and get someone to help me figure out how to post it. A simple set of dial scorers have two scorers, so you need two (top and bottom) to make what you'll need for 14.1. I had my handyman who is also my table mechanic to make and stain the wood bases they are attached to. I know Ken at Classic Billiards in Maryland has them available.

 (#21) alinco AzB Silver Member     Status: Offline Posts: 702 vCash: 4100 iTrader: 0 / 0% Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Elkridge, MD 02-23-2018, 04:12 PM As a side note on the break shot...failure to get 2 object balls to a rail is not a foul. It is an illegal break and you lose 2 points. Other player has the option of playing the table or having you re-break. An illegal break is not a foul so does not count towards 3 consecutive fouls. Andy
(#22)
AtLarge
AzB Gold Member

Status: Online
Posts: 9,537
vCash: 500
Join Date: Apr 2008

02-23-2018, 11:26 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by alinco As a side note on the break shot...failure to get 2 object balls to a rail is not a foul. It is an illegal break and you lose 2 points. Other player has the option of playing the table or having you re-break. An illegal break is not a foul so does not count towards 3 consecutive fouls. Andy
Under WPA (world-standardized) rules, it is not called an "illegal break," it is a "breaking foul." So it is a type of foul (a 2-pointer) but different from "standard fouls" (1-pointers). And, yes, a breaking foul does not count toward the 3-foul rule.

Just to be different, the CSI rules (BCAPL and USAPL) use the term "opening break violation" rather than "breaking foul."

(#23)
Seth C.
AzB Silver Member

Status: Offline
Posts: 161
vCash: 500
Join Date: Feb 2014

02-25-2018, 06:54 AM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by AtLarge Under WPA (world-standardized) rules, it is not called an "illegal break," it is a "breaking foul." So it is a type of foul (a 2-pointer) but different from "standard fouls" (1-pointers). And, yes, a breaking foul does not count toward the 3-foul rule.
Just to complete the picture, the WPA 14.1 rules also prescribe what happens when both a breaking foul and a standard foul occur on the same opening break shot:

"A breaking foul is penalized by the loss of two points as mentioned under 4.3 Opening Break Shot, as well as a possible re-break. If both a standard foul and a breaking foul happen on one shot, it is considered a breaking foul."

 (#24) arcstats AzB Silver Member   Status: Offline Posts: 133 vCash: 500 iTrader: 0 / 0% Join Date: Jul 2013 02-25-2018, 08:28 PM If a player were to scratch on the opening break after two balls and the cue have contacted a rail, does this count as a legal break and the player is only penalized 1 point?
(#25)
AtLarge
AzB Gold Member

Status: Online
Posts: 9,537
vCash: 500
Join Date: Apr 2008

02-25-2018, 09:08 PM

Quote:
 Originally Posted by arcstats If a player were to scratch on the opening break after two balls and the cue have contacted a rail, does this count as a legal break and the player is only penalized 1 point?
Yes. BIH behind the line for the opponent.

 Page 2 of 2 < 12

 Thread Tools Rate This Thread Rate This Thread: 5 : Excellent 4 : Good 3 : Average 2 : Bad 1 : Terrible

 Posting Rules You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts BB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off Forum Rules
 Forum Jump User Control Panel Private Messages Subscriptions Who's Online Search Forums Forums Home Main Category     Main Forum     Live Stream Area     Wanted/For Sale         For Sale Items         eBay Auctions         Wanted     Room Owner Discussion     14.1 Pool     Canadian Pool     Snooker     Carom Billiards     Memories of Steve Mizerak     English Pool     Billiard and Pool History in the U.S.     BEF Juniors Pool     Non Pool Related     Test Area     Cuesports: Rules & Strategies     AzB Hall of Fame     Pool Room Reviews Tournament Talk     U.S. Tournament Announcements     European Tournament Annoucements     Asian Tournament Announcements     Super Billiards Expo     Junior National 9-Ball Championships     World Championships     US Open Championships     Derby City Classic/Southern Classic     BCAPL 8-Ball Championship     US Bar Table Championship     WPBA     Matchroom Events     Eurotour     Other Tours & Events Products Talk     Pool Tables and Accessories Reviews     Cue Reviews     Cue and shaft reviews     Cue Case Reviews     Cue Machinery and Supplies     Cue & Case Gallery     Ask The Cuemaker     Cue Accessory reviews     Other Item reviews     Talk To A Mechanic Instruction & Ask the pros     Aiming Conversation     George 'Ginky' San Souci     Instructional Material reviews     Instructor Reviews     Melissa Morris     Sarah Rousey     Ask The Instructor