APA e-mails are up, is the APA in trouble?

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Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
I rebuilt a pool hall, literally from ashes....just for old timers and guys who can run out from everywhere. We hosted 5 open tournaments with top pros playing exhibitions free of charge to spectators in the room and online. Had SVB, Shaw, Strickland, Immonen, Hatch, Thorpe, Morra and Horliefson.

Other than that, nothing just like you. You have 50 times the posts I do so I guess that makes you sherriff around here.

Which pool hall? How often do you do these things, I’d love to come and watch
 

d8nk

Noah B
Why does everything have to be all about money with some of you people? I mean really.... How much money are you going to make on a valley League, or a BCA League, or a tap League? Does it make your penis swell up every time you win 30 bucks at a mini tournament? How about fifty or a hundred bucks per session on Valley League?

I play pool because I enjoy it. I don't give a damn if I win a dime. If I win enough to pay for my entry fee, drinks, food, and basically break even for the night, I'm happy as a clam. If I don't win anything, I'm happy as a clam. I just like to play.


Wow, all the negativity. If you don’t like leagues don’t play. It helps keep the sport alive bottom line. And absolutely what buckshot is saying 100%!!
 

APA Operator

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Because I know you didn't ask, I asked for you. All "new" apps go through a lifecycle like this - lots of bugs that have to be worked out. I don't know why you find it so hard to believe, it seems to be the way software is developed now, very little testing, let the user find the bugs. Amazon, Facebook, eBay, they all went through similar cycles. It takes years to have a "stable", non-simple app that people want to use.

I asked why I can't uncheck that box. The reply was "The un-check box isn't working right now. We have a bug fix coming for it with our next release." So there you have it.
 

jrctherake

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
yes, it would be bad. because 90% of those league players are not coming to tournaments on Fri and Sat night. That's a lot of folks NOT spending money on pool and soon finding something else to do. I don't even like weekend tourneys, they just take too long and I really don't want to be up till 1 or 2 in the morning to be honest.

They get out on a Mon thru Thurs when nothing is going on, hang with friends, and support pool.

They are the ones keep the pool rooms open. Oh, those Sat tourneys will NOT keep the place open by having tables sitting there all week and nobody using them. Yeah, the owner will really love that. And when he doesn't put money in the kitty for the Saturday tourney, folks will b1tch about that. So, he's got to pay for the privilege of folks showing up for a tourney. And when the 2 and out, they are not spending much money.

Well stated.

I'm not fond of leagues in the least unless it's a 14.1 or American Rotation league. If its 14.1 or AR, well, I'm all in but, those leagues are few and far between in my area.

Heck, the average league player doesn't even know the rules in 14.1 or AR much less actually play-em.

We don't have to like leagues but, if we want rooms to stay open, we have to have them.

Jeff
 
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buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
"The nobody that won nothing" that could refer to quite a few coaches too wouldn't you agree?

I wonder how many coaches joined the tour, is taking someone's money for a lesson promoting the game?

My local golf course offers free lessons to kids in HS and middle schoolers, I have seen some professional pool coaches do the same, that is promoting the game IMO, taking someones money(who plays better than the coach), not so much in my opinion.

I believe part of your question was already answered a long time ago... I can't say it any better then this.....

Yeah no shit snooker, that's why Tiger's swing coach has so many more majors than him.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
 

Snooker Theory

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I believe part of your question was already answered a long time ago... I can't say it any better then this.....

You do realize Butch Harmon played in the PGA and also won mulitple tournaments in his career, even winning in the PGA. The thing is, if you watch Butch, he can actually swing the club and knows how to play, he isn't going to shank the ball out of bounds.
 

Cron

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I asked why I can't uncheck that box. The reply was "The un-check box isn't working right now. We have a bug fix coming for it with our next release." So there you have it.

Of course I didn't ask them! I didn't want to confirm the simple reality you just confirmed:

A. The coders at APA are so bad that the security of the APA has to be at least as bad and everyone should be worried a data breach and watch their credit cards.

B. They lied to you and the bug is intentional.

I'm hoping for B as they have my credit cards info (which I'm now fearful is stored in plain text on some AWS buxket wide open to the world).

I'm positive that the first automobile was a mystery at first, but after 20 years of popular usage there was way too many people that understood how they worked who could dispel myths about them.

Now take a HTML checkbox. Are they hard to mess up? Yes, so much so that if you release them messed up, you did it intentionally or you seriously, seriously don't know what you're doing and shouldn't be allowed near a system that takes electronic payments. Ever noticed that these bugs always seem to happen in a way that harms you for someone else's profit, but not the other way? Hmmm... seems like "bugs" are great at generating profit. After all, it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Oh innocent APA, bless your heart.

Lastly, I don't use the "app", I use a browser (but... so an exploit on 1 would work on the other?). Go find any web developer that thinks a check box on a HTM page such as that one is bugged. Even if you have no clue how a web site works you understand how a check box works (yes, it works exactly like you think even in the code). Technically, you have to add code specifically for altering the default state of such a box. By default the box is either on or off, Javascript has to be added to toggle the boolean state of that element, or to put simply, you have to work to make it happen.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
I am not demonizing anyone, please quote me where I am demonizing someone, lmfao

maybe you think you are a great promoter of pool because you sell chalk, I dunno.

is charging someone for a lesson promoting pool or themselves more, if you disagree with my opinion, well that must mean "you have no idea of what your talking about", cause only people who agree with you know what they are talking about right?

That's the point, you don't know what "folks" have done behind the scenes to support pool, but just quote "well, he charged for lessons".... yeah, so what. why not speak about the things he does to promote pool and the free lessons he's given over the years. Why, it does not fit the narrative.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
I rebuilt a pool hall, literally from ashes....just for old timers and guys who can run out from everywhere. We hosted 5 open tournaments with top pros playing exhibitions free of charge to spectators in the room and online. Had SVB, Shaw, Strickland, Immonen, Hatch, Thorpe, Morra and Horliefson.

Other than that, nothing just like you. You have 50 times the posts I do so I guess that makes you sherriff around here.

That's great. So, why are you wasting your time bashing someone else that helps billiards and promotes pool. This makes no sense to me and never will. Just because you don't know everything Scott has done for billiards and the game does not make them any less important than what you do, what I do, what everyone does. And just fro the record, I do a lot more than just sell the best fuggin chalk on the planet (thanks for the plug) but I'm not about to get into a pissing contest because anything done for pool is good for everyone.
 

BryanB

Huge Balls
Silver Member
There we again first thing on your mind is money. What is it with you and money?
What kinks my colon is so many people think leagues are beneath them somehow.

I play leagues but not APA. I did play APA when I started playing in 2012 but I hate the format (slop) and the fact the LO's give nothing back to the players beside participation trophies...which have went in the trash.

If your profile is correct and you've been playing APA since 2002 and you are still a SL 6, maybe, just maybe, you should take the step and play in something a little more competitive. I'm sure you are drinking with your buddies and don't care about being competitive or wanting to improve.
 

SBC

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
That's great. So, why are you wasting your time bashing someone else that helps billiards and promotes pool. This makes no sense to me and never will. Just because you don't know everything Scott has done for billiards and the game does not make them any less important than what you do, what I do, what everyone does. And just fro the record, I do a lot more than just sell the best fuggin chalk on the planet (thanks for the plug) but I'm not about to get into a pissing contest because anything done for pool is good for everyone.
The man wants to come at me over my opinion. So with a minimum of effort he was exposed as a hack.

My view is that APA does not support pool AS IT SHOLUD BE. I explain myself and am met with the typical nit hourde. I'm not the one to sit for that.

Many feel as I do. That this corporation only looks out for the almighty dollar. They do nothing to promote rooms, development of the game or support professional pool.. In many areas the APA has been divisive among rooms and players alike. The prevelance of the APA leads to a dumbing down of the game. Players do not progress as they would by playing short races on Valleys in handicapped formats.
 
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CGM

It'd be a lot cooler if you did.
Silver Member
The man wants to come at me over my opinion. So with a minimum of effort he was exposed as a hack.

My view is that APA does not support pool AS IT SHOLUD BE. I explain myself and am met with the typical nit hourde. I'm not the one to sit for that.

Many feel as I do. That this corporation only looks out for the almighty dollar. They do nothing to promote rooms, development of the game or support professional pool.. In many areas the APA has been divisive among rooms and players alike. The prevelance of the APA leads to a dumbing down of the game. Players do not progress as they would by playing short races on Valleys in handicapped formats.

Opposed to every other corporation that looks out for the well being of interested parties? Everything on this planet revolves around the almighty dollar. Always has. Always will.
 

buckshotshoey

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I play leagues but not APA. I did play APA when I started playing in 2012 but I hate the format (slop) and the fact the LO's give nothing back to the players beside participation trophies...which have went in the trash.

If your profile is correct and you've been playing APA since 2002 and you are still a SL 6, maybe, just maybe, you should take the step and play in something a little more competitive. I'm sure you are drinking with your buddies and don't care about being competitive or wanting to improve.

I am currently playing BCA. Not enough teams in town to have an APA league, and I dont want to travel 30 miles each way to play. Otherwise I would. I'll update my profile.

You and others are forgetting League operators do give back. That's what Vegas is all about. The winning team in my area got full expenses paid to Vegas.... Hotel, entry fees, plane tickets, and our league operator even gave a little bit of expense money. APA isnt about winning money. It's all about Vegas baby!

So many are worried about how much the league operator is making. At the same time you're forgetting how much money they had to invest.... Buying an APA franchise for the area, just for instance. Isn't that what is called living the American dream? Starting and running a successful business?

Tell you what....buy an APA franchise, invest your time and money, put up with whining little *****es all the time. Show us how it is SUPPOSED to be done. But I'm sure everyone here can predict what your (and others) response to this challenge will be.
 
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tableroll

Rolling Thunder
Silver Member
I have started to recieve about 7 e-mails a month from the APA, which is basically up 2100%. I don't necessarily want to stop receiving emails completely (which is the only option I have left), so should I weather this out? If the APA is in trouble, I get it, but if they're not then I'm spamming these, especially since I don't play in it anymore (but have friends who do and like to see how they're doing sometimes).

Personally I do not nor never have played in APA. I play in the other leagues. State tournaments and leagues take a good chunk of your change but I like my league. It is a BCA league and I have been with them for 25 years. Our state tournament charges excessive green fees. That does rile me but I pay it.
 

BryanB

Huge Balls
Silver Member
FYI, I did own a league before I moved this summer. Had it for about 3 years. I paid out approximately 75% of all money paid in. National took a portion that helped fund the national event payout and I kept enough to cover expenses plus a little.

Not sure how big your area is but it is not hard to figure out how much your LO is making. If you have a LO with let's say 200 teams (double jeopardy, Master, doubles) and they happily announce they are funding 3 teams to Vegas for Nationals. Everyone is so happy but not as happy as that LO that is profiting about $12-15k PER MONTH, some more than that. That's after they pay APA national their 20%.
I have no issue with someone making some money but to be robbing the players of this much is BS.

So go login to your APA acount, see how many teams are playing each night, cost to play each night and multiply all that by 45-48 weeks and tell me how much they are bringing in. Once you see that, you will quickly realize how much the players are losing out on.
You know why an APA franchise costs so much? Because it's a freakin cash cow for the LO

edit: I see you are not APA now
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
The man wants to come at me over my opinion. So with a minimum of effort he was exposed as a hack.

Can't you both have opinions with attacking someone's profession and ethics? Surely, that is possible?



Many feel as I do. That this corporation only looks out for the almighty dollar. They do nothing to promote rooms, development of the game or support professional pool..

The APA should NOT be involved in pro pool at all. Not their business any more than my softball team being involved with MLB. They are in the amateur league business in case you were unaware. and yes, the do promote rooms, because for every new room teams play in for APA league, those are all new customers who might.... wait for it.... just come back another time to spend money on food, beer or pool. Wow, what a concept.


In many areas the APA has been divisive among rooms and players alike. The prevelance of the APA leads to a dumbing down of the game. Players do not progress as they would by playing short races on Valleys in handicapped formats.

So, billiards is such a big deal in this country that folks can't enjoy it as a hobby. Does playing softball "dumb" down the sport of baseball because it's on a smaller field, uses a bigger ball and it's slo-pitch? Should be softball league send some cash to the Pro's to show their support?


Come on, get real. Why does everyone have to enjoy the game of pool as much as the most ardent pool fanatic. If folks don't like 14.1, who cares, if they don't like 1P, who cares, if they don't know who Earl is, who cares. I played softball with guys who don't know who many pro players or what teams they are on, or if they are good or bad.

But, no, we got the folks that hate 9b, the ones that hate 8b, the ones that hate LD shafts, the ones that hate jump sticks, or hate this, that or the other thing because it's not "real" pool in their opinion. It's pool, and the more folks playing the better it is for everyone.

news flash, if there were no pool leagues, there were be no more pool in general. Oh, it might be around but it would even more of a fringe sport than it is now with hundreds of thousand of folks playing in leagues.
 

KRJ

Support UKRAINE
Silver Member
Opposed to every other corporation that looks out for the well being of interested parties? Everything on this planet revolves around the almighty dollar. Always has. Always will.

BAM. Drop mic, walk off stage ;)

The last company I worked at had a massive layoff because it did not meet it's target profit. They made money, they didn't lose a nickel. $100B in sales world wide with a net profit of $7B, that was not good enough. 1,000 folks lost their jobs to cut costs in a year they made $7B in profits. I'd hate to think what would have happened if they actually lost money ;) LOL
 

DecentShot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Are no more leagues really that bad? Replace them with local events and tournaments. I'd take a local / national pool tour over leagues.

Yes it would be. A lot of amateur players equate pool with a sense of team, not trying to finish second in a local tourney where you make $48 and go home at 12:30.
 

DecentShot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Ok...indulge the middle aged guy a moment.

I'm in Syracuse.

We had rooms 25 years back with 70 player weekly tournaments. 6 rooms within 30 minutes. You could play tournaments 6 nights a week. Rooms didn't compete over tournament days. Rooms collaborated to have big weekend regional tournaments...no tournament directors taking 30 percent.

Even 10 years back we had 3 rooms that all cooperated and weeknight tournaments would exceed 30. No real players even looked at bar tables and most rooms didn't even have them.

Last few years it's all APA. Rooms are pitted against one another and some excluded entirely. This has been done in Syracuse, Utica, Binghamton and Rochester. All for what ??? Money Money Money.

The APA doesn't care about the history of this game. The rooms that have been hurt by league ops pulling teams. Long as the money keeps rolling in...that is all that matters.

Sad part is most APA players have no idea what a pool hall really was about because they haven't been exposed to it. I've got men playing out of my room who have shot pool together for 65 years. People learning and enjoying all games played on full sized equipment.

I really think the future of pool is losing the identity that made it great. I'm still along for the ride, just don't think I'm going to like the destination.

I'd say the APA pulls a minimum of 15 million a year. That money is not reinvested in the game. Renting a bunch of Valleys and cutting deals with casinos that host events is not promoting anything. Nobody cares if Joe Blow from Idaho wins 10k in prizes at a National.

That's because pool hall culture sucks and the APA is more fun. They aren't promoting anything? Interesting, because they got YOU talking about it. If Old salties who "wanna play sum" are the "history" league players don't know about? Good.
 

DecentShot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Complete opposite. Just have bitter dealings with APA and they way they operate

I've learned with these kind of people, its never really about the money, its about a 5 who should be a 7 who beat me one night and the LO won't bump them even though....blah blah blah.
 
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