Turning point of getting to next level of play

luck

Most improvements were a discovery then long brutal amounts of time to incorporate the discovery. The best took years to put it in my game.

However, a right angle turn that I incorporated into pool and several other forms of competition, there is no such thing as luck! Or to be more exact, it is such a tiny percentage of what causes wins and losses that it doesn't matter.

An example, the player that rearranges the furniture every shot. You lose to a player that does this and it is easy to blame their good luck or your bad luck. In reality, their playing style creates wide swings in the balls they pocket. It isn't luck at all, it is playing style.

There is almost no such thing as good rolls and bad rolls. Nor do we consistently lose to someone worse than us. I have had a few small time gamblers that played me for weeks or months quit playing me saying, "I am the better player but I can't outrun your luck!" Hated to lose them as customers but better that they thought it was luck than skill.

Once I threw out the jack of all trades excuse, "luck", I became a far better competitor. I think I became a better person too when I applied the same thoughts about luck to my life. When we are honest, very very little that happens is random chance. We not only set up our successes, we set up our failures too.

Hu

hang-the-9 said:

Do any of you remember the point you went from a mid-pack player to finishing in the money? Or any significant jump? And what did it take to get there? Did you finally hang up one game winner more than you can take? Had some guy taunt you that you sucked and could not beat him in 100 years? Something became clear in your head that was confusing or you were just too stubborn to change? Take on a new instructor?

I'm almost 50 and still finding little ways to improve but having a hell of a time getting to a solid A level. I can cash in a lot of local events, and people don't take me as a push-over, but seems I am losing to players clearly worse than me even with all the experience I have.

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Playing the ghost a lot was huge.

I realized as I improved that I could give a game to the better players. It's not just being good that matters. It's a lot of things. I focused on defensive plays and better patterns and saw little things they did that were different than what I was doing. For example, instead of slow rolling they might go an extra rail or two, that sort of thing. I watched a lot of videos. I saw that good players were taking me seriously. Sometimes I put enough heat on them to shake up their games.

The other thing is, if you want to improve your 9 ball game, try practicing straight pool. If you then want to improve your straight pool game, practice 9 ball. Practice banks and kicks. Practice defense. The main thing is: practice and practice the stuff that improves both the overall pocketing ability and speed control.

I took a lesson from Dennis Orcullo. He said "Chris, you have speed. If you practice 5 hours a day, you can be a top player." Hard to swallow, but that's the kind of thinking you need to do to really move up.

Once you move up, it takes a lot less to stay there but a lot more to improve.

This year it feels like I've finally taken my game to the next level. Since I normally practice every day, practice isn't what did it.

I think that I finally settled on a grip, aiming technique, and stroke where I mainly need to focus on cue ball control instead of making the ball.

I have a teammate on our first place team that was openly telling everyone yesterday that it's no fun playing me anymore, because he never gets to shoot. I mean, he was adamant about it. But it's sounds so weird to me because I want to get much better than I am.

It's going to be hard pushing myself to get better when my own teammate is already ticked off with my good play. Weird situation for sure. Practicing before leagues last night I ran two racks in a row on him and while I was running out he was actually complaining to me that I shouldn't run out and to give him a shot.

Oh, and after 3 weeks of leagues I'm number one on both nights. So my increased level of play is being objectively reflected in the league stats too.

[My goal is to reach a 700 Fargo Rating, when I'm just over 600 right now. I can't imagine if I'm playing at a 700 level how much my opponents and teammates will be complaining. ]


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I think after all the kinks are worked out in your game--your mechanics are pretty sound, ball pocketing is good, cue ball control is passable, etc.--it comes down to focus.

When a player is really laser focused on the table and the task at hand, it shows. And that's rare to see. Only pros seem to have that laser focus consistently, rack after rack. That's why they are pros. I almost never see it in pool rooms, and when I do, the person is almost always a very good player.

I know plenty of guys who shoot well enough and have the potential to play much better than they do, but their minds aren't right. They don't take their time, or they only take their time on certain shots and then rush through the most critical shots in the rack.

I'm guilty of it myself but I'm getting better about it. It's an ego protection thing, I believe. If you take your time, really bear down, and still miss, it hurts worse than if you give yourself an excuse.

"I rushed it."

"I didn't take it seriously enough."

Once I started bearing down on every shot, or as many shots as I could, I found that I didn't need those excuses as much, because I started making fewer and fewer mistakes.

hang-the-9 said:

Almost all of my games are lost due to laziness, not walking around to check the angle, not lining up well, going for hard shots instead of an easy safe. I treat the tournaments as a place to go hang out with fellow players, say hi to friends, etc.. more than trying to seriously beat people.

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to me
it sounds like you've answered your question as well as anybody could
if you really want to improve
why not clean up what you know to be wrong with your game?
addition by subtraction- ?

Earl mentioned something on the new
Billiard network upload that made a
little jump for me.
Don't get too perfect, or try to.

If I had a $1 for all the times I got straight
in or that just off straight position where
you have to force it, I would be on my
own island by now. It's mentally draining also.

For me, it was absolutely a result of getting comfortable in the particular scene.

I tried to visit and hot balls at places where tournaments would be...that was helpful, as was a a couple dozen events under my belt.

Peyote and no underwear are other comfort options. Not together though.

Man, I know a dude who could have been great, were it no for his head.

When his mix was right, he manhandled some very well known players for some good money, but he never could become a winner.

If I were going on the road and could somehow ensure his mental state, he'd be one of 2 players I'd take a road shot with.

BlueRaider said:

I think after all the kinks are worked out in your game--your mechanics are pretty sound, ball pocketing is good, cue ball control is passable, etc.--it comes down to focus.

When a player is really laser focused on the table and the task at hand, it shows. And that's rare to see. Only pros seem to have that laser focus consistently, rack after rack. That's why they are pros. I almost never see it in pool rooms, and when I do, the person is almost always a very good player.

I know plenty of guys who shoot well enough and have the potential to play much better than they do, but their minds aren't right. They don't take their time, or they only take their time on certain shots and then rush through the most critical shots in the rack.

I'm guilty of it myself but I'm getting better about it. It's an ego protection thing, I believe. If you take your time, really bear down, and still miss, it hurts worse than if you give yourself an excuse.

"I rushed it."

"I didn't take it seriously enough."

Once I started bearing down on every shot, or as many shots as I could, I found that I didn't need those excuses as much, because I started making fewer and fewer mistakes.

Click to expand...

Get_A_Grip said:

This year it feels like I've finally taken my game to the next level. Since I normally practice every day, practice isn't what did it.

I think that I finally settled on a grip, aiming technique, and stroke where I mainly need to focus on cue ball control instead of making the ball.

I have a teammate on our first place team that was openly telling everyone yesterday that it's no fun playing me anymore, because he never gets to shoot. I mean, he was adamant about it. But it's sounds so weird to me because I want to get much better than I am.

It's going to be hard pushing myself to get better when my own teammate is already ticked off with my good play. Weird situation for sure. Practicing before leagues last night I ran two racks in a row on him and while I was running out he was actually complaining to me that I shouldn't run out and to give him a shot.

Oh, and after 3 weeks of leagues I'm number one on both nights. So my increased level of play is being objectively reflected in the league stats too.

[My goal is to reach a 700 Fargo Rating, when I'm just over 600 right now. I can't imagine if I'm playing at a 700 level how much my opponents and teammates will be complaining. ]


_______

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A bit of gold there! When we first start playing we focus on pocketing the object ball. However, what we are doing with the cue ball is often more difficult than what we are doing with the object ball. There is usually a wide range of speeds that will pocket the object ball, a much smaller window of speed to do what you want to with the cue ball. If you plan your shot correctly it is impossible to make the cue ball do what you want it to and not pocket the object ball. The cue ball is the tail that wags the dog. It was even more evident in the days of big or heavy cue balls. If I remember correctly the mud ball was about an eighth inch bigger than the other balls. That is a bunch!!


Oddly enough, while they never verbalize the thought even in their own minds, many people would prefer not winning to offending people by winning. Blew my mind when I discovered this, still seems strange. Why compete if not to win? I once talked to a man that had competed for eighteen years, had all of the nice toys, and had never won a single event large or small! He was happy and would remain happy if he never won even a dozen person one day event. I have found lady competitors more willing to admit it than men, some say they don't want to win because everyone will be mad at them or everyone will hate them. The people winning now are more respected than hated, why would you not be the same? Trying to coach these people will make you crazy!

Hu

ShootingArts said:

A bit of gold there! When we first start playing we focus on pocketing the object ball. However, what we are doing with the cue ball is often more difficult than what we are doing with the object ball. There is usually a wide range of speeds that will pocket the object ball, a much smaller window of speed to do what you want to with the cue ball. If you plan your shot correctly it is impossible to make the cue ball do what you want it to and not pocket the object ball. The cue ball is the tail that wags the dog. It was even more evident in the days of big or heavy cue balls. If I remember correctly the mud ball was about an eighth inch bigger than the other balls. That is a bunch!!





Oddly enough, while they never verbalize the thought even in their own minds, many people would prefer not winning to offending people by winning. Blew my mind when I discovered this, still seems strange. Why compete if not to win? I once talked to a man that had competed for eighteen years, had all of the nice toys, and had never won a single event large or small! He was happy and would remain happy if he never won even a dozen person one day event. I have found lady competitors more willing to admit it than men, some say they don't want to win because everyone will be mad at them or everyone will hate them. The people winning now are more respected than hated, why would you not be the same? Trying to coach these people will make you crazy!



Hu

Click to expand...

Yep. The mental side of the game is huge. When my teammate insisted that I should miss and give him a chance to shoot, I kept my focus and still ran out. It's pool. He might get to shoot the next game.

But having to listen to someone complaining that you run out too often is still going to be a pain in the butt to deal with and could start to get discouraging.




_______

hang-the-9 said:

Do any of you remember the point you went from a mid-pack player to finishing in the money? Or any significant jump? And what did it take to get there? Did you finally hang up one game winner more than you can take? Had some guy taunt you that you sucked and could not beat him in 100 years? Something became clear in your head that was confusing or you were just too stubborn to change? Take on a new instructor?

I'm almost 50 and still finding little ways to improve but having a hell of a time getting to a solid A level. I can cash in a lot of local events, and people don't take me as a push-over, but seems I am losing to players clearly worse than me even with all the experience I have.

Click to expand...

Two or three things made the significant jumps for me:

1) Playing more (jumped from being a good league player to an APA SL-7 in 1992 when it was more difficult to become an APA SL-7

2) Learning about squirt (Grady Matthews called it deflection), and all but dropping "throw" from my english adjustments. (no longer feared or was confused inside english)

3) Hal Houle (gave me the tools to develop a solid aiming system)

I'd credit number 3 as what upped my game from being a threat to cash (and getting a lot of 2nd places) to being a favored to win at the local level.

When my main focus became application of English for position shape & cue ball speed.
Stop and stun shots, draw, follow and basically anything center ball became thoughtless.

Literally, you just approached those shots as second nature, didn’t give it much thought.
Of course, how hard & soft you stroked the cue ball was considered with center ball cuts.

What I’m driving at is you find yourself working on the finer points of improving your game.
That’s when I realized my game had reached a different gear & I was delighted for awhile.

Then I woke up & realized how many more gears there were ‘til you really become great.
The reality is improving is a race you can never win but it’s certainly a race worth entering.


Matt B.

hang-the-9 said:

I made the post to see what others have gone through and if anyone had had a few simple things that came up that was a clear signpost in advancement, not so much as to figure out what I should do to improve. Almost all of my games are lost due to laziness, not walking around to check the angle, not lining up well, going for hard shots instead of an easy safe. I treat the tournaments as a place to go hang out with fellow players, say hi to friends, etc.. more than trying to seriously beat people.

Click to expand...

Maybe you could of made it clear in the OP that you already know (or think you do) what prevents you from becoming a solid A player.
Once you included this (I'm almost 50 and still finding little ways to improve but having a hell of a time getting to a solid A level) it kind of implied you were looking for a solution.

The_JV said:

Years back I was hitting balls with another local guy that who would just torture me constantly. I was struggling, and complaining about my inconsistency. He simply commented that my problem was most likely due to all the tricks shots I was playing.

Of course being confused by the comment, I asked what he meant. He explained that every time I made the cue ball do something it didn't want to do naturally. I was playing a "trick shot". Being a pool player, and subsequently cynical, I figured he was being a dick. However he went on to explain his approach of running through most shots and opting to play additional rails, rather than playing excessive draw.

He was/is an exceptional player, so I took it to heart. Once I altered my thinking and adjusted my patterning play accordingly. My success jumped significantly.

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Ditto for me. I don't remember exactly where or what I heard, but once I realized there were much easier ways to move the CB around my playing abilities jumped up a couple of levels quickly.

Sounds like you are a master player disguised as an A player....

hang-the-9 said:

Do any of you remember the point you went from a mid-pack player to finishing in the money? Or any significant jump? And what did it take to get there? Did you finally hang up one game winner more than you can take? Had some guy taunt you that you sucked and could not beat him in 100 years? Something became clear in your head that was confusing or you were just too stubborn to change? Take on a new instructor?

I'm almost 50 and still finding little ways to improve but having a hell of a time getting to a solid A level. I can cash in a lot of local events, and people don't take me as a push-over, but seems I am losing to players clearly worse than me even with all the experience I have.

Click to expand...

I couldn't help feel your pain.

Sounds like you do everything well as far as drawing the ball, right English, left English, patterns and on and on and on.

Worked very hard at the game and just can't get to another level. Kind of stuck.

I teach the most important thing that any player can learn. It's called Perfect Aim. It's not an aiming system but the way the eyes naturally work while aiming a pool shot.

If the dominant eye and the non dominant eye are not in the correct position to do their own thing the most perfect picture is not going to the brain. If the correct picture is not there the brain can't help you do the things you need to do. At least not good enough.

Once the dominant eye is determined for sure it doesn't stop there. The stance and stroke have to be adjusted to fit the body along with the perfect eye position.

This can be manually done instead of counting on the eyes to just do this naturally.

I do a skype lesson that I do for $150. Takes about 2 to 3 hours. In person I charge $300.

I want to just help you. The skype lesson is free for you. Just want to help.

I have a thread on the main forum, The reason lower level players can't improve. I've done about 100 lessons since I started this thread and about 20 of these players have written glowing reviews about how much this has helped them.

You just need to download skype on your phone and have a way to set it up so I can see you and your table and the rest is history. Just need a time that will work for you and me.

Good news is I'm free all weekend. The bad news is I get tested for covid 19 Monday. Pretty much a slam dunk. Just need to affirm it.

Don't worry. I can teach up a storm and get you playing the best pool of your life.

715-563-8712 I'm going to do a bunch of skype lessons while I'm isolating. The sooner the better.

And like I said, I feel your pain. I fix pain, at least on the pool table. Once you learn how to harness these eyes everything starts to work so much better. Right now you have no idea how crooked the sights are on your (GUN) pool shot.

Tonight would even work. I feel pretty good. Give me a call Either way.

genomachino said:

I couldn't help feel your pain.

Sounds like you do everything well as far as drawing the ball, right English, left English, patterns and on and on and on.

Worked very hard at the game and just can't get to another level. Kind of stuck.

I teach the most important thing that any player can learn. It's called Perfect Aim. It's not an aiming system but the way the eyes naturally work while aiming a pool shot.

If the dominant eye and the non dominant eye are not in the correct position to do their own thing the most perfect picture is not going to the brain. If the correct picture is not there the brain can't help you do the things you need to do. At least not good enough.

Once the dominant eye is determined for sure it doesn't stop there. The stance and stroke have to be adjusted to fit the body along with the perfect eye position.

This can be manually done instead of counting on the eyes to just do this naturally.

I do a skype lesson that I do for $150. Takes about 2 to 3 hours. In person I charge $300.

I want to just help you. The skype lesson is free for you. Just want to help.

I have a thread on the main forum, The reason lower level players can't improve. I've done about 100 lessons since I started this thread and about 20 of these players have written glowing reviews about how much this has helped them.

You just need to download skype on your phone and have a way to set it up so I can see you and your table and the rest is history. Just need a time that will work for you and me.

Good news is I'm free all weekend. The bad news is I get tested for covid 19 Monday. Pretty much a slam dunk. Just need to affirm it.

Don't worry. I can teach up a storm and get you playing the best pool of your life.

715-563-8712 I'm going to do a bunch of skype lessons while I'm isolating. The sooner the better.

And like I said, I feel your pain. I fix pain, at least on the pool table. Once you learn how to harness these eyes everything starts to work so much better. Right now you have no idea how crooked the sights are on your (GUN) pool shot.

Tonight would even work. I feel pretty good. Give me a call Either way.

Click to expand...

You obviously haven't read the whole thread. If you had, you'd know he's not in pain. Already knows what the problem is but has no desire to fix it.
The part I highlighted in red.....Where did you come up with that?
I really don't have an opinion regarding what you teach but I seriously doubt it's an antidote for laziness which is really the only thing we can be sure of regarding the OP.

If he gives me a call this will help...

sparkle84 said:

You obviously haven't read the whole thread. If you had, you'd know he's not in pain. Already knows what the problem is but has no desire to fix it.
The part I highlighted in red.....Where did you come up with that?
I really don't have an opinion regarding what you teach but I seriously doubt it's an antidote for laziness which is really the only thing we can be sure of regarding the OP.

Click to expand...

It will help. Hope he calls so we can see. Just trying to help...FREE......

Once you have the tools what sets people apart is focus. You have to plan the outs and take nothing for granted.