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It appears the person selling/producing fake Sugartrees is an AZ regular!
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It appears the person selling/producing fake Sugartrees is an AZ regular! - 10-15-2012, 07:03 PM

I really hate to do this, but I believe that it is the right thing to do. I believe that I know who has been producing and selling the fake Sugartree cues, as well as some other highly questionable cues on eBay. The sad part is that he is also a regular on this board. I’m doing this because I believe that without honor and integrity, forums like AZBilliards will cease to exist.

Our economy is at an all-time low, so any person that is harmed by an unethical business practice can really suffer. I almost lost $625 due to purchasing one of danutz’s fake Sugartree cues. That may not be a lot of money to some, but it is to me. I also believe that cue-builders work hard to build up their reputations. The last thing they need is for someone to tear it down by scamming others through selling inferior cues with their names on them.

The AZ’er in question is danutz. His eBay seller name is charlese9911. His real name is Charles Scott Edwards of Wichita, KS. I would never post anything like this unless I was 100% sure I was correct. If I am wrong, I sincerely apologize to C.S. Edwards, and will do anything to make it up to him. However, I have unearthed a mountain of evidence to prove that he is indeed the culprit.

I have listed just a few examples that I believe prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that danutz is up to some shady business practices. If you do a search on AZ to see what all danutz has attempted to sell here, you will notice that he edited/erased most of his transactions in June of this year (about the time the fake Sugartree conversations were heating up). However, you can still see titles and match them up with his eBay listings and figure out that we’re dealing with the same person. His eBay seller name (charlese9911).

The reasons that I believe that danutz is Charlese9911 is due to him primarily making 60” cues. Here is an AZ link where he stated that 60” cues should be the new standard. I understand that that in no way means anything wayward, but more than one of the cues in question is 60”. He also sold me a 60” cue that he claims he built (an E Custom cue). He is a cue-builder more than capable of building the cues in question and then trying to sell them off as something other than what they really are. He sure does come into a lot of customs from “Unknown” cuemakers. Now for the proof….

Here is a thread regarding a Sugartree for sale where danutz asks the seller how the signature looks, and if he can get a picture of it. A fake Sugartree is sold by danutz later that month:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showth...d.php?t=273599

Here is a link to a fake Sugartree sold on eBay by danutz (Charlese9911) that I ended up purchasing on AZ. I purchased this cue from CO9baller who took it in on trade from tman561who originally purchased in on eBay from Charlese9911 (danutz). I am very grateful to CO9baller for being such a stand-up guy and giving me a prompt refund when we found out the cue was indeed a fake. I will gladly deal with him anytime.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-S-T-P...p2047675.l2557



Here are some other AZ posts about it:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showth...ight=sugartree
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=285457

Here is a another cue he sold on eBay by danutz (charlese9911) with the impression that it was a Sugartree:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-Pool-...p2047675.l2557



This is a thread about it on AZ:
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showth...ight=sugartree

Check out post #41 where danutz tries to deflect from his obvious deceptions again, and even acts like he’s not the seller.



Here is a link regarding a cue danutz put up on eBay hoping that people may perceive it as a Gus. He tries to defend himself without coming out and saying so in the post. Go to the AZ link, and then to the eBay link from there to see the auction. Danutz’s comment is in post #4. http://forums.azbilliards.com/showth...ight=sugartree



Here is a shaft put up for sale here by danutz and then on eBay by Charlese9911 with the same description:




Here are some of the items he had for sale here on AZ and also on eBay:






I could go on and on as there are many other cues previously posted for sale on AZ by danutz and also by Charlese9911 on eBay. Simple searches will turn up numerous ones. However, remember danutz erased/edited most of his for sale items on AZ in June. The pictures above are just some of the cues in question. If this is not enough evidence to convince anyone that danutz is Charlese9911 and that he is up to no good, than I don’t know what will. Don't forget, he also sells custom cues under his own name of E Custom Cues.


I welcome danutz to come on here and prove me wrong. Believe me, I wish I were wrong about a fellow AZ’er.
  
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wow - 10-15-2012, 08:15 PM

subscribed...

best,
brian kc


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10-15-2012, 08:19 PM

Everything you've posted doesn't prove anything.
1st)He said he thought it was a Sugartree but said it wasn't.
2)He never said it was a Gus but said somebody had there initials put in
the cue.
Look,lots of guys buy things off of ebay and sell it on AZ to
turn a profit.Unless you have clear-cut proof thats he's ripping
people off than its all your own speculation.
Dragging his name through your conclusions isn't fair at all.You should delete this thread before it gets ugly.

Last edited by scsuxci; 10-15-2012 at 08:22 PM.
  
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10-15-2012, 08:26 PM

I believe the OP and I have no dog in this hunt and don't even buy/sell cues (except for 3 on here for myself).

Look at the dudes eBay descriptions. On one of the Sugartree sales he puts that he "thinks" it is a ST and has been around for 25 years and knows what he is talking about, blah blah blah, then on the Brunswick cue he makes sure the "GS" is seen so people would "think" it was a Gus. If he was around for 25 years like he was screaming in the other sale he would know if it was a Gus or not. I was NEVER around cues until I got on this site and I knew that was NOT a Gus, but this dude has been for 25 but he didn't know who in the world "GS" could be? He was baiting ALL THE WAY!

This dude really lost his calling in life because the way these eBay listings are written up this dude could have been one helluva lawyer. A real shister mf'er!!

Just read the OP's post then read these listings and tell me it doesn't sound fishy to you. If it doesn't you might want to learn a few things IMO. He goes out and "hints" these cues are the real deal without saying it is so he is not responsible. He hopes to catch guys that don't know any better and wont show up here showing it off so he can scam them, but if they figure it out here nor there, he plays it off like "I didn't really know and sorry". So he is out NOTHING if he is caught and can't be punished, but if he gets over on someone he is up bigtime.

Good catch Ohplayer!


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10-15-2012, 08:27 PM

You must not have seen his eBay listing for the 60" Purpleheart Sugartree cue. He claimed it was a Sugartree in the description.

He did amend some of his auctions after the heat was turned up. It seems a little late though.

It is coincidence that he happens to have sold all the fake Sugartrees mentioned here on eBay?

I welcome him to come on here and defend himself. I hope I am wrong, but I don't see how that is possible. I just don't want anyone else being taken advantage of.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scsuxci View Post
Everything you've posted doesn't prove anything.
1st)He said he thought it was a Sugartree but said it wasn't.
2)He never said it was a Gus but said somebody had there initials put in
the cue.
Look,lots of guys buy things off of ebay and sell it on AZ to
turn a profit.Unless you have clear-cut proof thats he's ripping
people off than its all your own speculation.
Dragging his name through your conclusions isn't fair at all.You should delete this thread before it gets ugly.
  
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10-15-2012, 08:28 PM

I also have to say about the SugerTree cue,that maybe he didn't
know it was a fake when he got it either since so many other
people thought it was the real deal also.You should of PM'ed him to
discuss this if you had this concern about him.Just my opinion
  
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10-15-2012, 08:29 PM

You hit the nail on the head powerlineman80!

Quote:
Originally Posted by powerlineman80 View Post
I believe the OP and I have no dog in this hunt and don't even buy/sell cues (except for 3 on here for myself).

Look at the dudes eBay descriptions. On one of the Sugartree sales he puts that he "thinks" it is a ST and has been around for 25 years and knows what he is talking about, blah blah blah, then on the Brunswick cue he makes sure the "GS" is seen so people would "think" it was a Gus. If he was around for 25 years like he was screaming in the other sale he would know if it was a Gus or not. I was NEVER around cues until I got on this site and I knew that was NOT a Gus, but this dude has been for 25 but he didn't know who in the world "GS" could be? He was baiting ALL THE WAY!

This dude really lost his calling in life because the way these eBay listings are written up this dude could have been one helluva lawyer. A real shister mf'er!!

Just read the OP's post then read these listings and tell me it doesn't sound fishy to you. If it doesn't you might want to learn a few things IMO. He goes out and "hints" these cues are the real deal without saying it is so he is not responsible. He hopes to catch guys that don't know any better and wont show up here showing it off so he can scam them, but if they figure it out here nor there, he plays it off like "I didn't really know and sorry". So he is out NOTHING if he is caught and can't be punished, but if he gets over on someone he is up bigtime.

Good catch Ohplayer!
  
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10-15-2012, 08:30 PM

He's had multiple fishy cues for sale. Check his AZ posts and eBay listings. It can't be a coincidence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scsuxci View Post
I also have to say about the SugerTree cue,that maybe he didn't
know it was a fake when he got it either since so many other
people thought it was the real deal also.You should of PM'ed him to
discuss this if you had this concern about him.Just my opinion
  
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10-15-2012, 08:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohplayer View Post
He's had multiple fishy cues for sale. Check his AZ posts and eBay listings. It can't be a coincidence.
Exactly. He must the most unluckiest/luckiest person in the world!

First he has had TWO ST cues there were/were not, then a Tim Scruggs that was/was not, and then baited a bad attempt at a Gus but he didn't know what it was. It's amazing his luck is SO BAD he has owned 4 bogus cues.

B.S.! There is NO WAY his luck is that bad. If you read those listings and don't see anything wrong with them, then YOU are the audience he is targeting for this SCAM!


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10-15-2012, 08:33 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohplayer View Post
You must not have seen his eBay listing for the 60" Purpleheart Sugartree cue. He claimed it was a Sugartree in the description.

He did amend some of his auctions after the heat was turned up. It seems a little late though.

It is coincidence that he happens to have sold all the fake Sugartrees mentioned here on eBay?

I welcome him to come on here and defend himself. I hope I am wrong, but I don't see how that is possible. I just don't want anyone else being taken advantage of.
You've made some good points,but i'm thinking if he received these cues
from the same guy then more than his name will be at the forefront
when the ball gets rolling.This should be interesting.If your right,your new
name on AZ should be Matlock
  
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10-15-2012, 09:04 PM

Believe me, I take no joy in this. I struggled with the decision of whether or not to post this, but I didn't want anyone else to get ripped off.

BTW, I'm no Matlock. I was turned on to all of this from another AZ'er who wishes to remain anonymous. He saw that I purchased a fake cue, and wanted to help me out.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scsuxci View Post
You've made some good points,but i'm thinking if he received these cues
from the same guy then more than his name will be at the forefront
when the ball gets rolling.This should be interesting.If your right,your new
name on AZ should be Matlock
  
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10-15-2012, 09:20 PM

Just wondering why these rings look near identical in dimensions & layout.
Cue that was listed as a ST on the bay. These rings seem to look the same as the E Custom in next pic.




Cue that was listed as an E Custom cue by same seller.
Something dont look right. Oh and note the Micro ring usage in the E Custom Ebay listing. I'm no expert, but has Eric ever use rings this fat?
?????????????????


  
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Fakes
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Fakes - 10-15-2012, 09:27 PM

^^^^Beat me to it^^^^^Look at the ring work on the fake cue, and compare it to a E-custom cue.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-Pool-...%3D=&nma=true=


http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=291443

looks identical to me.
  
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10-15-2012, 09:36 PM

How about the TS on the sneaky he sold.
I have not seen enough TS logo's up close. But this look pretty sloppy. Other then the guy who tells him he should put a reserve on it. lmao, nice way to prove its a TS. Have some smuck ask a question that is not a question.

Ebay link


Last edited by 06Busa; 10-15-2012 at 09:42 PM.
  
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10-15-2012, 09:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohplayer View Post
Believe me, I take no joy in this. I struggled with the decision of whether or not to post this, but I didn't want anyone else to get ripped off.

BTW, I'm no Matlock. I was turned on to all of this from another AZ'er who wishes to remain anonymous. He saw that I purchased a fake cue, and wanted to help me out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scsuxci View Post
You've made some good points,but i'm thinking if he received these cues
from the same guy then more than his name will be at the forefront
when the ball gets rolling.This should be interesting.If your right,your new
name on AZ should be Matlock
Ah so that's how one gets into that lock society.....
  
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