Tips for Students of CTE

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
It might be nice to have one thread where we could exchange tips about aiming with CTE -- things we have learned that might help someone else learn more easily or quickly.

I ask that this thread be limited to talking about Stan Shuffett's version of CTE -- not earlier versions or someone's hybridization.

I also plea that everyone leave all contentious debate out of this thread. Let's just accept that "it works" in some fashion, whether that is with mechanical precision or through conscious or unconscious user adjustments. Some people are over-the-top advocates, some think it's an absurd way to try to hit a pool shot, and others are somewhere in between -- let's just accept all that. I'll also be disappointed if anyone tries to use this thread as a platform for ill-mannered attempts at humor, such as "Tip: use ghost-ball aiming instead."

I hope that we all have reached a stage now where a thread like this is possible. I'll start it out.

Tip -- Buy Stan's DVD.
I have been amazed at how many people seem to be sincerely interested in CTE, and in aiming methods more generally, but have not spent a measly $45 (and that is pretty measly in this day and age) to hear and see what Stan presents first hand. The on-line outlines, summaries, and discussion can be useful, but they don't adequately substitute for the DVD.

I was a student of CTE long before the DVD came out, and what was available was pretty poor. A lot of people who tried to learn it from Hal Houle were left mystified or deemed it geometrically flawed and unworkable. Hal's instructions, at least to many people, were simply: sight center to edge, offset the stick inside or outside depending on thickness of cut needed, and pivot to center. That simple prescription is full of holes, and many of us were unable to add enough meat to the bones to make it into a usable method.

Stan was one of those students who went to see Hal. But Stan was intrigued enough to stick with it until he was able to give it some structure and make it a much more usable method. Stan's specification of secondary sighting lines and specific pivot lengths (for manual CTE) elevates the method to something that is now useful to many more people.

The DVD has high production qualities (for a pool DVD). Some viewers wish he had explained some things more fully or differently, but, overall, it is reasonably well done. I urge those interested in CTE, or aiming methods more generally, to buy it.​

Tip -- Use Streamlined Shot "Call-Outs"
Stan's method essentially presents the player with a menu of ways to align oneself -- or determine the final cue-stick alignment -- for a shot. Some students have expressed confusion, difficulty, or dismay in trying to keep the options straight as the shots present themselves during a game or match. When I use the method, I find it helpful to streamline that menu in my mind, in the following ways.

The center-to-edge line always goes to the outside (side farther from the pocket) of the object ball, and I doubt that anyone has any difficulty in immediately seeing that. Stan then uses A, B, and C for the secondary alignment lines, and left and right for the pivots. My mental way of implementing this makes two changes in terminology:

Instead of thinking of A, B, or C, I find it easier in actual play to just think "1" or "2," where this means 1 or 2 quarters of the OB. So "A" and "C" are both "1" (one quarter) and "B" is "2" (two quarters). Since the side for the CTEL is instantly obvious on a shot, I just think whether to align for 1 vs. 2 quarters for the secondary alignment (forget the very thin cuts for now).

Instead of thinking "left" or "right" for the 1/2-tip offset for the pivot, which have different effects depending on the direction of the cut, I just think "out" or "in," where "out" means outside and "in" means inside.

So as I approach a shot, I call out (to myself) either "1-out," or "1-in," or "2-out," or "2-in" depending on the shot.

This can be done very quickly. In fact, I find that I can make an alignment-menu selection and align myself for the shot, including pivot, almost as quickly as I can go around the table one-stroking using only "feel." And the process can certainly be done at least as quickly as ghost-ball or contact-point-to-contact-point aiming. For precision, it is probably good to not do it that quickly, but I just mention this because of objections sometimes made about CTE possibly disrupting one's "flow" or pace of play.

So ............ as I move to each shot, I just call out to myself one of:
1-out
1-in
2-out
2-in​

and then go into aligning my body for CTEL plus the call-out. I hope someone finds this tip useful. If you need any further clarification, please just ask.​

Now -- how about some tips from other users.
 
Last edited:

DrGonzo

As your attorney...
Silver Member
For the love of God, I hope this thread stays within the confines of its purpose. I bought Stan's dvd and am still struggling with the pivot. The only problem with looking for answers is that I end up having to wade through a dozen pages of arguements for every page or so of helpful posts. I would love to see a condensed post of only helpful information. Let's please not argue about merits of this system. If you don't agree with it or dont want to learn/use it, just leave it alone...:grin:
 

pablocruz

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
For the love of God, I hope this thread stays within the confines of its purpose. I bought Stan's dvd and am still struggling with the pivot. The only problem with looking for answers is that I end up having to wade through a dozen pages of arguements for every page or so of helpful posts. I would love to see a condensed post of only helpful information. Let's please not argue about merits of this system. If you don't agree with it or dont want to learn/use it, just leave it alone...:grin:

Pivot from the object ball plane rather than the bridge!!
 

JE54

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My problem is determining which is the correct pivot some of the time. I'm going to try 1 in, 2 in etc. and see if that helps.
 
Last edited:

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
You already mentioned to buy the DVD. Here's another tip- if you don't understand it, give Stan a call like he stated to do. Then you have known good info.

Good point, Neil. But I hope we also get some tips from people who know the method well and might add something that Stan would not or say it a bit differently.
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Pivot from the object ball plane rather than the bridge!!

Well, I think Stan is teaching pivoting from the bridge with manual CTE, so that would be a different technique, or perhaps an alternative. Is this from Spidey CTE?

Even if it isn't what's on the DVD, I'd still be interested if you can explain it clearly.
 

Redneck Jim

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Some Tips

Some tips that help me:

A general tip is to learn the basic manual pivot cte well, before tackling the pro one part.

1 On the DVD, stan refers to "Aim Points" of A, B, & C. This causes some confusion for some of us. The first week,
I assumed that Aim Points were to aim at. Sounds logical, but it's not the case.
I now think of A, B, & C as Reference Points or Secondary Alignment Points.

The DVD contains a lot of shots explained and demonstrated using all the alignment visuals and pivot points.
When I started out with them, some would go and others didn't. In my case, I decided to kind of simplify it
until I "got it" figured out.

2 To make sure I had my visuals, pivot, and stroke correct, I set up and practiced the following shot.
- Set the object ball in the middle of the table (20 on the table grid)
- set the cue ball at number 18 on the table grid.
The objective now is to shoot the object ball into the short rail (number 24)
and come straight back and hit the cue ball.
I used center to right edge of ob, left side of cue ball to A on the ob, with a half tip right pivot (cue tip starts right of center cue ball before the pivot).

Assuming your stroke is good, The result of shooting this shot will let you know if your visuals, bridge placement, & pivot are on the money.
Occasionally, I'm able to have the object ball come back and hit the cue ball head on, but I'm satisfied at this point to just get a hit of any kind.

Once you are having success with the shot above, then you can try some of the other shots, knowing that your fundamentals are ok.

This is the point I'm at right now myself. The main thing to remember is that this cte is the real deal.
It's taking me a bit longer to learn than I hoped, but I'm not the brightest bulb in the string.
I am making progress though, and there is no sound like the solid "thunk" of a well hit ball going into center pocket.

The most important tip I can give is to ignore any of the naysayers that are probably going to show up.
I mean, don't reply to them or give them any attention at all. In fact, feel free to add them to your ignore list (under User Cp at the top of this page).
If you can't control your urge to respond to them, do everyone else trying to learn CTE a favor, and reply to the naysayer by Private Message.

Just remember the title of this thread - "Tips for Students of CTE". If the post doesn't apply to it, just ignore it.

Good luck to everyone & I hope we can help each other. There are a lot of people on here that will be glad to help.
In fact, I've got help from some of them already, and appreciate thier willingness to assist me.
 
Last edited:

DrGonzo

As your attorney...
Silver Member
Did the people who use this system start by memorizing the table grid and practicing the exact shots from the video so you already know which way to pivot from the beginning of the shot?
 

AtLarge

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Did the people who use this system start by memorizing the table grid and practicing the exact shots from the video so you already know which way to pivot from the beginning of the shot?

No need to memorize the table grid. Here's a post that includes the grid and most of the shots from the DVD. This worksheet should be quite helpful in setting up shots and practicing how to acquire the correct visuals. Just print it out and take it to the table.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=2933145&postcount=560
 

eezbank

Silver Surfer
Silver Member
Did the people who use this system start by memorizing the table grid and practicing the exact shots from the video so you already know which way to pivot from the beginning of the shot?

I used this drill to help memorize the pivots. I like to visualize a rail on cut shots. Maybe this will help someone else.

CueTable Help

 

Murdoch7627

Frank Reid aka "Fly Man"
Silver Member
So far this thread is going great. I will repeat what has already been said.. If you have purchased the DVD and have questions, call Stan. He is happy to work/talk with you. This aiming system works but it does take practice to get it down correctly. Practice the exact shots on the DVD. Do not just toss the ball on the table and think you are learning. This does not work.

Regards to all,

Frank
 

DrGonzo

As your attorney...
Silver Member
How does CTE work when using english. I don't remember this subject being discussed in the dvd in the CTE section. There was a short segment on english in the pro one section, but with the whole purpose of the CTE pivot to get you back to center cb, wouldn't adding english change the pivot and thus the aim point?
 

Redneck Jim

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Good suggestions, Redneck. For your practice shot, you numbered the CB location as 20, also, so that must be a typo.

Thanks for pointing that out. The cue ball should be at grid location 18.

I've edited my orig post ( #9 ), so hopefully no confusion.
 

Redneck Jim

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I think it would be clearer if you stated that you set your bridge hand so you were 1/2 tip right of center, and then pivoted to center. As you have it stated, you shot with right english.
What I should have stated was:

I used center to right edge of ob, left side of cue ball to A on the ob, with a half tip right pivot (cue tip starts right of center cue ball before the pivot).

Thanks for catching that & I'll make yet another correction to post #9.

As far as the bridge placement, I didn't really keep track of it. Sounds like something I should investigate more.
 
Top