Cue confusion
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Demetris_gr
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Unhappy Cue confusion - 01-13-2008, 10:12 AM

The opinions stated in this post are personal, coming from an amateur player. Having said that, I confess that I am really confused lately with the ?technologically advanced shafts?, like the 314(2). I play with such a shaft for more than a year now and I still can?t find out anything that makes it superior to any other plain shaft. Lately, I was forced to play for a week with my old cue (a very cheap one). I wasn?t expecting to play any good, since supposed to be a much inferior cue and on top of that I wasn?t used to it. Furthermore, the cue?s shaft had a cheap tip installed on it, in contrast with the moori tip that I was using in my 314. I even asked the captain of my team not to play on the leagues match. Anyway, I played and played much better than I play with my ?good? cue and everything was feeling right and better .

Is anyone other that feels like I feel about these shafts? I feel like, they don?t give you any feedback. I don?t think that they generate more spin than a normal shaft with a well shaped tip. In addition, I got the impression that plain shafts are more forgiving.

Of course, they have much less deflection, but I?ve got the feeling that deflection is seriously overrated. We are talking about slight better deflections rates, which don?t result to anything significant. You have to compensate for deflection anyway, a lot or les will not make any difference. It would be nice, if you didn?t need to compensate at all and therefore, take that parameter complete out of the equation. This is not the case with any shaft though.

Another, thing that I have come across is that if you have developed a very good stroke then you will be able to apply much more spin with such shafts and generally appreciate them much more. My objection here is that if you have an excellent stroke then you will probably be able to generate much more spin and play much better with any shaft anyways.

The only positive think that I can think of (for playing with a 314, Z or OB shaft) is that because they are not very forgiving, they help you to develop a very good stroke.

Anyway, these are my thoughts. As I said, I am really confused and would like to read other ppls opinions on the subject. I am thinking to switch to another cue and probably to a bit softer tip (than moori). I am curious if the feel that the OB shafts have is the same to a 314, or are more responsive. Does the OB-1 feel more like a plain cue and gives you some feedback, or it feels dead like a 314? Before many years, I was playing with a buffalo cue and liked it. I haven?t found a buffalo retailer on the internet though, which is weird .

Thanks a lot for reading my long post . I probably was a bit hoarse with my 314(2), but these are my personal thoughts and wanted to share them with you.
  
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JoeyInCali
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01-13-2008, 10:39 AM

The over and under of this thread is 10 pages.


  
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alstl
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01-13-2008, 11:16 AM

I'm not an expert but in my opinion nobody can tell you what cue will be the best for you. The most inexpensive option is to get some people to let you hit some balls with their cue and see what you like. If you keep buying different cues and shafts in search of the right one that can get expensive.
  
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01-13-2008, 11:31 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demetris_gr
... I was playing with a buffalo cue and liked it. I haven?t found a buffalo retailer on the internet though, which is weird ...
I've got a buffalo cue, you can buy mine

Buffalo cues are made by Adam. Adam don't have license to sell those buffalo cues in the USA. I think it got something to do with the trademark. Buffalo is also a billiard brandname from an other company.


Cues
Player: Butt: Buffalo Premium 5, Shaft: Predator 314, Tip: Everest 12.75mm;
Breaker: Butt: Longoni P8 3c, Shaft: Pro2+, Tip: Tiger Sniper 12mm;
Jumper: Stinger Shadow B/J, Ferrule: Phenolic, Tip: White Diamond 13 mm.
Cue Case
Case: Laperti 3/5.
  
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Poke N Hope
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01-14-2008, 08:37 AM

I read this thread shortly after it was posted but I did not have time to reply. I looked for the thread this morning and was amazed that is was on page four. I figured you would have been flamed to hell by the "Radial Consistency Aficionados? ?.

Yes, I agree with you, Deflection is overrated to a certain extent. All shafts will deflect, you will have to make adjustments with any shaft. The debate: Laminated vs. Solid Maple shafts has a long history here.

I believe that it is the Indian not the arrow. There is no such thing as a magic shaft that you can use that will make you three balls better just by using it. Practice and playing is what will make you better.

I believe if you have go fundamentals (Stroke, Stance, Follow thru etc..
) you can play with anything.

Bottom Line: Different Strokes for Different Folks. Some like laminated, others don?t. I believe that having a shaft with the proper taper for your playing Style and a properly groomed tip is two of the most important things in a shaft.
  
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NervousNovice
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01-14-2008, 08:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demetris_gr
I am curious if the feel that the OB shafts have is the same to a 314, or are more responsive. Does the OB-1 feel more like a plain cue and gives you some feedback, or it feels dead like a 314?
The 314-2 feels stiffer than the 314-1. I know some good players who prefer the original 314 for its higher quality and softer hit. They are also the people who don't like OB-1; too soft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poke N Hope
Bottom Line: Different Strokes for Different Folks. Some like laminated, others don?t. I believe that having a shaft with the proper taper for your playing Style and a properly groomed tip is two of the most important things in a shaft.
Would you please explain what do you mean by different taper for playing style? Maybe it is illusion, but from looking at those tournament pictures, I have a feeling that a lot of those good players like smaller tip like 12.25mm with very thin shaft i.e. long taper, much longer than those standard 12-15".
  
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Poke N Hope
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01-14-2008, 09:51 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by NervousNovice
Would you please explain what do you mean by different taper for playing style? Maybe it is illusion, but from looking at those tournament pictures, I have a feeling that a lot of those good players like smaller tip like 12.25mm with very thin shaft i.e. long taper, much longer than those standard 12-15".
There is a lot of factors that make up someones playing style. They Are:
  • Normal Stroke Speed. Hard, Medium or soft?
  • Position Play. Natural Angle or do they like move cue ball?
  • Perference to use Bottom or Top English?
  • Quality of Equipment. Slow or fast table?
  • Etc...
For example: A player who has a soft stroke speed, preference is in using bottom english and plays on a average to slow table is not going to do well with a shaft that has a 9-10" taper. Typically they will play much better with a shaft with a longer taper.

This is just a rule of thumb, everybody is different.
  
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NervousNovice
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01-14-2008, 10:15 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poke N Hope
For example: A player who has a soft stroke speed, preference is in using bottom english and plays on a average to slow table is not going to do well with a shaft that has a 9-10" taper. Typically they will play much better with a shaft with a longer taper.
Hmm.....but why? I think a longer taper means less stiff and whippier right? Is that related to what you are trying to say?
  
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trustyrusty
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01-14-2008, 10:23 AM

someone with a softer normal stroke will not notice a whippier shaft, is what I believe he is saying...
  
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01-14-2008, 10:36 AM

the fact is it matter the abilty of the player, not the cue i know some great players who could pick up a broomstick and wax your ass , all the while you playing with scruggs,szamboti. the best and highest does not alway mean the best unless you are a collector.I know some guys that have 10 to 15 thoudand dollar cues but they play with a mcdermott lol.
  
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Poke N Hope
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01-14-2008, 10:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by NervousNovice
Hmm.....but why? I think a longer taper means less stiff and whippier right? Is that related to what you are trying to say?
You will be able to draw the cueball with less effort with a 13" taper than a 9" taper on a slow table.
  
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Demetris_gr
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01-15-2008, 11:54 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poke N Hope
I read this thread shortly after it was posted but I did not have time to reply. I looked for the thread this morning and was amazed that is was on page four. I figured you would have been flamed to hell by the "Radial Consistency Aficionados? ?.

Yes, I agree with you, Deflection is overrated to a certain extent. All shafts will deflect, you will have to make adjustments with any shaft. The debate: Laminated vs. Solid Maple shafts has a long history here.

I believe that it is the Indian not the arrow. There is no such thing as a magic shaft that you can use that will make you three balls better just by using it. Practice and playing is what will make you better.

I believe if you have go fundamentals (Stroke, Stance, Follow thru etc..
) you can play with anything.

Bottom Line: Different Strokes for Different Folks. Some like laminated, others don?t. I believe that having a shaft with the proper taper for your playing Style and a properly groomed tip is two of the most important things in a shaft.
I think that I agree with all that you said. I have tried many different things and for only one I am really sure that it helps: a properly groomed tip. I can't say the same for anything else, including expensive shafts.
  
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01-15-2008, 12:13 PM

FWIW, and its not worth much... as this topic has been discussed in an endless number of threads. Some like the laminated shafts, some don't. I don't. I'd rather have the traditional old school shaft myself.

But its the practice and time spent on the table that counts, not the cue. And quality practice, working on simple things like your stroke mechanics, and repeating shots and position play until its second nature. I played with the predator cues, and they weren't for me. I generally shoot with a Bob Frey SP, and also have a jacoby cue that I use as a back up stick as well as a break cue. I found an old stock Dufferin cue on ebay paid thirty bucks for it. It has an aluminum joint. Just bought it to have something to take with me to the bars and shoot with, something that I wasn't concerned about getting beat up, etc... and suprisingly, that $30 Dufferin cue shoots pretty damn well considering what I paid for it - and it came with a case!

Last edited by thedude; 01-15-2008 at 12:15 PM.
  
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01-15-2008, 12:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demetris_gr
Is anyone other that feels like I feel about these shafts? I feel like, they don?t give you any feedback. I don?t think that they generate more spin than a normal shaft with a well shaped tip. In addition, I got the impression that plain shafts are more forgiving..
I don't know about this "more forgiving" concept, but for the rest of it, a whole lot of people agree with you. Especially people who grew up using regular shafts.

But, I also find that people just starting out and then getting good at the game with a 314 have preferred a regular shaft when they try one. That's not everyone, but enough to tell me something.

Fred


--------

Name: Freddie Agnir
Shooting Cue: 2017 Tascarella (w/blokid extension)
Breaking Cue:Gilbert

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