8 ball handicaps

[NathanDetroit]

Not talking about league handicaps. Also, game handicaps based on Fargo ratings seem pretty well understood.

I'm looking more at ball handicaps like in Chinese pro events where women and juniors have their last ball removed before shooting at the eight.

Say an APA SL5 who seldom has a break and run is playing a 6 who has a bnr once every 4/5 racks: shouldn't the 5 ask for a ball rather than a rack in an action match?

If the 6 has seen how the last ball handicap has worked in Chinese games, and says no, how many balls before his first shot might the 5 ask for?

Action does happen after my league, so looking for an edge.

 

[Zerksies]

I only know of spotting games in 8 ball.

Two ways to play it.

If we are talking ball spots in a game, somehow I would figure leaving the clusters as my spot if you are talking last ball.

But then you can also re-spot balls on the stronger players run. Say I pocket the first three balls and they get spotted. etc.

 

[Pool Hand Luke]

I like that. I used to give one guy 3 balls of his choice before he took his first shot. That made the game fairly equal. Another guy there liked to loudly declare he gave his opponents 3 balls and still beat them easily. I watched one of his games and his generosity was to choose the 3 balls for his opponent. He would take all the hangers and easy set ups every game thus clearing pockets for his own balls and being the better player to begin with easily win each game. After each game he would announce as loudly as possible: "Look, I'm giving him 3 balls and I'm still up 8 to 1." LOL. Some people.

I play 9 ball with another guy but never learned what giving the 5 or 7 or whatever ball as a handicap involved. I'm guessing if he's at the table and makes the 4 or the 6 he can take the next ball off the table and continue shooting. Is this correct?

 

[straightline]

I play 9 ball with another guy but never learned what giving the 5 or 7 or whatever ball as a handicap involved. I'm guessing if he's at the table and makes the 4 or the 6 he can take the next ball off the table and continue shooting. Is this correct?

This is really confusing. Regardless, if the game is 9 ball, balls given become money balls or count toward winning the game. They must be legally potted by the player being spotted. Unless this is another April fools bit...

 

[David in FL]

I like that. I used to give one guy 3 balls of his choice before he took his first shot. That made the game fairly equal. Another guy there liked to loudly declare he gave his opponents 3 balls and still beat them easily. I watched one of his games and his generosity was to choose the 3 balls for his opponent. He would take all the hangers and easy set ups every game thus clearing pockets for his own balls and being the better player to begin with easily win each game. After each game he would announce as loudly as possible: "Look, I'm giving him 3 balls and I'm still up 8 to 1." LOL. Some people.

I play 9 ball with another guy but never learned what giving the 5 or 7 or whatever ball as a handicap involved. I'm guessing if he's at the table and makes the 4 or the 6 he can take the next ball off the table and continue shooting. Is this correct?

That's a sucker bet for a lower rated player

I often offer to let them remove five balls of their choice after the break.

Especially on a bar box, it's seldom that a weak player can get out and he'll leave you a wide-open table while he only has one ball or maybe the eight remaining.

You should win in that scenario at least nine times out of 10.

 

[LowRight]

How about allowing the weaker player to have the option to shoot the 8 early? So, for example, if you're giving him 2 balls, when he has 2 or less balls left, he can shoot the 8 for the win or any of his remaining balls (perhaps to get better shape on the 8). Handicaps would range from 0 to 7. With 7, he could shoot the 8 at any time!

This is much better than allowing the weaker player to remove balls, since in 8-ball, your balls act like your soldiers, blocking your opponent. That is, if you want a FAIR matchup. If you're looking for an edge......

 

[hang-the-9]

Not talking about league handicaps. Also, game handicaps based on Fargo ratings seem pretty well understood.

I'm looking more at ball handicaps like in Chinese pro events where women and juniors have their last ball removed before shooting at the eight.

Say an APA SL5 who seldom has a break and run is playing a 6 who has a bnr once every 4/5 racks: shouldn't the 5 ask for a ball rather than a rack in an action match?

If the 6 has seen how the last ball handicap has worked in Chinese games, and says no, how many balls before his first shot might the 5 ask for?

Action does happen after my league, so looking for an edge.

Being able to shoot the 8 early in 8 ball I think is a stronger handicap than in 9 ball. I would say maybe 1 ball for 1-2 levels, 2 balls for 2-3 levels, 3 balls for 4-5 levels. Also need to sort out if this would be something where you actually remove the balls or the player can just play the 8 when they have 3 balls left. Also are they required to play the 8 then or can they pick to shoot another ball for position? There are 2-3-4 different ways to play this.

 

[JessEm]

In what conceivable region is a "6 who has a bnr once every 4/5 racks", a 6!!??

 

[NathanDetroit]

In what conceivable region is a "6 who has a bnr once every 4/5 racks", a 6!!??

I guess mid Michigan.

Care to expand on your comment

 

[JessEm]

I guess mid Michigan.

Care to expand on your comment

Sure. In the Twin Cities that's an upper, top-tier 7.

Hence the issue with Vegas aspirations in APA. SLs are highly regionally-sensitive. Highly. With a huge disparity between larger and smaller regions. It's just baffling to me, that region isn't accounted for at Nationals in some form or fashion.

 

[Cornerman]

In what conceivable region is a "6 who has a bnr once every 4/5 racks", a 6!!??

I was a 6 that had a break and run every 4/5 racks. For about 4 weeks.

 

[Iwishiwasrich]

Before you went up to a 7 ?

 

[Ken_4fun]

You can let them have the break and they can continue to shoot even if they dont make a ball on the break.

Once they decide on either solids or stripes allow them to take 1 or 2 balls off the table (usually if they have balls tied up or trouble balls)

As noted above, the only way I have done much is game spots. But maybe the 2 ideas above might help.

Ken

 

[JessEm]

I was a 6 that had a break and run every 4/5 racks. For about 4 weeks.

You were probably averaging one or two innings for a minimum of year prior to BNR-ing every 4/5 racks. That's still a 7 around here.

 

[Mobiker]

I remember a league that gave lower-skilled players one or more ball-in-hand shots. Like a get-out-of-jail-free card, you could use it when you wanted.

 

[NathanDetroit]

I was a 6 that had a break and run every 4/5 racks. For about 4 weeks.

So, keeping to the thread, what handicap would you have given an SL5?

 

[Cornerman]

So, keeping to the thread, what handicap would you have given an SL5?

Games on the wire

 

[tomatoshooter]

I like that. I used to give one guy 3 balls of his choice before he took his first shot. That made the game fairly equal. Another guy there liked to loudly declare he gave his opponents 3 balls and still beat them easily. I watched one of his games and his generosity was to choose the 3 balls for his opponent. He would take all the hangers and easy set ups every game thus clearing pockets for his own balls and being the better player to begin with easily win each game. After each game he would announce as loudly as possible: "Look, I'm giving him 3 balls and I'm still up 8 to 1." LOL. Some people.

I play 9 ball with another guy but never learned what giving the 5 or 7 or whatever ball as a handicap involved. I'm guessing if he's at the table and makes the 4 or the 6 he can take the next ball off the table and continue shooting. Is this correct?

What a tool. A clever sucker bet is okay on occasion but don't sabotage your opponent and pretend like that makes you a good player.

Does anyone ever give odds? Like in a race to 5, the stronger player wins $10 for every game he is ahead and the weaker player wins $50 if he wins the race. I don't care for handicaps that alter the game, like removing balls, etc. You aren't really playing the same game at that point. And games on the wire, I want to beat my opponent, not the spread.

 

[NathanDetroit]

Games on the wire

The point here is that lower/less skilled players need to level the game. You,after all, moved up because you were beating players in what is a "games on the wire" league.

 

[Bob Jewett]

There are many, many ways to spot at eight ball other than games on the wire. I think the OP wants the weaker player to be able to shoot as much as the stronger player, so games on the wire are no good here.

The weaker player:

• removes one (two, three) balls at the start
• removes one (two, three) balls whenever they want
• has an extra ball in hand (or two or three) any time during the game
• gets a hand-span at the start of every inning (moves the cue ball by up to 8 inches or so
• gets ball in hand at the start of each inning (or shot)
• doesn't give up ball in hand on a foul

The stronger player:

• banks the eight
• banks the even balls (or the odds, not including the eight) -- kicking at a sitter is OK
• has to play one and stop (or two or three)
• has to play in numerical order towards the eight (Saratoga?)
• has to play in the order given -- one ball at a time -- by the weaker player -- "Go for the seven now."
• has to play off-handed or one-handed

I used the "I'll take three of yours off the table" scam on my roommate. Didn't end well.