Establishing the value of a cue

[pletho]

I have often wondered who it was or what is was that set the standard and value of a cue.

I see all these new cue makers and cues who have value assigned to them from someone, who is this "someone who puts the value on a cue" or who "determines which cuemakers cues are worth more than anothers"

Is it playability, collectabilty, beauty.....ect..

Is there a determining body of cue collectors who ultimatly set a value as a group?

I have often seen poeple on here say it is worth this and not that, how do you know what it is worth?

Blue book of cues? How do they decide, is it political?

Any other ideas?

 

[bsmutz]

I'm not a cuemaker nor a cue collector, but it's pretty much the same as any other product. The more work put into making something (amount of inlays, splices, etc.) and the more valuable the materials used to make it (ivory, rare wood, leather wrap, etc.), the more it's worth. The higher the perceived quality (cuemaker's reputation, perfectly aligned points, etc.), the more it's worth. The rareness of something can also drive the price up. In the end, it all boils down to what someone is willing to pay for any given product.

 

[Gregg]

The value of a cue, like fine artwork, is what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

[qbilder]

If the cues become popular for whatever reason, but are tough to get directly from the builder or at all, then people will begin to pay elevated prices to get them. The entire market decides a cue's worth, not just one person. On the flip side, if the cues never become popular then they never sell at inflated prices in the secondary market. Mostly it has to do with the supply:demand ratio. If 100 people are in the market for one builder's cues, but he has only built 50, then those cues are going to be worth whatever the highest roller is willing to pay. If 50 people want a builder's cues & he has built 100, then those cues are not going to sell fast or high in secondary market. There are lots of variables but the nuts of it is supply:demand.

 

[eddieindetroit]

If you look at one of those "Blue books" on pool cues, divide that number by two or three and you might be around the going rate.
If the "Blue book" lists a value of $1000, you will likely end up at $300-$400 on ebay tops.
Ebay sets the market these days.

Eddie

 

[WheatCues]

If you look at one of those "Blue books" on pool cues, divide that number by two or three and you might be around the going rate.
If the "Blue book" lists a value of $1000, you will likely end up at $300-$400 on ebay tops.
Ebay sets the market these days.

Eddie

Pawn shops use the same formula !!!

You should NOT base the value of your cues from E-bays going rate. the whole point of that site is to offer a BARGAIN !!!

From a cuesmakers point of view... if you start selling you work on E-bay the going selling price will become your new marketing worth, and you will never be able to sell your cues for what they are worth...

The bluebook is an excellent reference for establishing a going rate, but shaould not be considered bottom line or compared to E-bay's prices.... that's like comparing a garage sale to a retail store....

Of course that is just my opinion and I could be wrong !



- Eddie

 

[cueaddicts]

If you look at one of those "Blue books" on pool cues, divide that number by two or three and you might be around the going rate.
If the "Blue book" lists a value of $1000, you will likely end up at $300-$400 on ebay tops.
Ebay sets the market these days.

Eddie

Yeah, the blue book is and can be off considerably. For example, on page 722, it gives the secondary market for a level 2 (no points) Dennis Searing (0-25 inlays) @ 90% condition = $985.

There is no way to really print a book every 3-4 years. Sometimes demand changes on the same cues within 6 or 12 months....they are very hot, then not, just like turing a faucet off. The only way to really know is to be in the business or very close to it, with friends constantly helping to track and determine current market value. Generally, speaking though, you are right. eBay can be a very good reflection of the market....lots of buyers. In fact, all the buyers I know still look there, most a few times a week at least.

 

[qbilder]

I second the ebay notion. About 3-4 times a week I browse ebay to keep an eye on who's cues are being sold on their, how much interest is being shown and how much cash they are going for. I believe ebay is kinda dying in the higher end cue market, though. Lots of fraud & bad publicity has pushed lots of deals into private settings & online forums like here. Watching the AZ forum is a GREAT way to gage the market.

 

[cubswin]

I think that cue value is constantly changing. One year you may pay 1500 for a 4 point cue with nice veeners from one maker, the next that same cue may be 900 or 2000 depending on the maker. Its a fluid market, and on the top end I think its a pretty small market that a few people drive. Lets face it, there are tons of people playing pool, but not that many that will spend 6,000 on a cue.

Cue makers get hot, go cold, then get hot again all without any flaws in their craftsmanship. Just depends what cue is currently being hyped.

Personally I try to buy from lesser known makers, sometimes those guys get hot and then it becomes hard to get one of their cues. Take qbilder for example, its hard to get one of his. The reason is three fold. His cues play very very well in the minds of many (myself for example), and he doesn't turn out that many cues. The third reason is that not too many people sell his cues when they get one. Only a couple people that flip his, the rest like them so much they hang onto them. Richard Harris Bluegrass cues would be another example that has those three characteristics, yes you can always find a used one, but not very many at any given time.

 

[TATE]

It's a good question. The cue market is so small that the last couple of prices fetched seem to determine the next guesstimates on value, which usually affects the asking price.

Players and collectors often want to know a value of a cue even if they have no plans to sell it, just as you might want to check the value of your car or house for the heck of it. prices are the same way - comparables. A lot of collectors and all dealers track prices. So these folks as a group are often asked an opinion of the value. That's exactly what the dealers, collectors and so forth give - an opinion as to what the cue would sell for on e-bay or in the general market.

The blue book, even at a few years old, is a pretty good general guide if the information is properly interpreted. Some of the values were off at time of printing, so you have to know the market anyway to assess a value.

I have attempted to publish a value guide on the Palmer cues I collect.

http://www.palmercollector.com/Values.html

I published these prices about a year ago and need to update them because some of the values have increased on the upper echelon cues and maybe a few have decreased on the more common cues. To arrive at these numbers, I track actual transactions and assess the shape a cue was in, E-bay or any other source, and I consider the rarity of the cue, it's importance, which can have an effect on the demand from other collectors.

I do believe E-bay reflects the cash market for resold cues, but you can't look at one transaction - you have to look at many and average them out, because E-bay is all over the place on collectibles.

Chris

 

[Str8PoolPlayer]

I have bought, sold, or traded over 350 Highend Cues (mostly on eBay) since the mid-1990's and it is my opinion that the elements which define the value of any given cue are the same as those which define the value of fine artwork, custom handmade knives, highend watches, designer jewelry, etc. ... Since "playability and hit" are subjective at best, the established reputation of the cue-builder and the high-water mark he has achieved in actual sales are key elements notwithstanding supply, demand, and current market trends (now adrift in the doldrums of a foundering economy) ...

Bottom Line - Having been in the firearms business over 3 decades (now retired) and also being a advanced collector of custom handmade knives, really high-end watches, rare coins, fine art, high-end cues, and exotic cars I can state without reserve that the safest and wisest investment is to buy one cue for $1500.00 rather than ten cues for $150.00 each (unless that $1500.00 cue is a Dale Perry !!!) ... The Internet affords everyone the opportunity to thoroughly research cues, cue-builders and current market values ... "Blue Books" are great for reference but never forget - "Books don't buy Cues, People buy Cues" ... This Forum, in particular is a great place to gather such information, as there is a wealth of knowledge right here at your fingertips ...

 

[Cuaba]

Cues go Cheap on eBay!

The bluebook is an excellent reference for establishing a going rate, but shaould not be considered bottom line or compared to E-bay's prices.... that's like comparing a garage sale to a retail store....

When someone bids on eBay, they don't know how straight the cue is or how it hits. These are two factors that can greatly affect what the buyer is willing to pay. eBay bidders tend to be very conservative because they really don't know what they are going to end up with in terms of playability. By the time they get the cue and find out, there is often a no return policy. So you can't blame eBay bidders for being cheap. And the prices are not necessarily a good indicator of what cues will bring in a proper retail environment where the buyer can get a feal for the cue.

 

[Matthys]

Hey pletho, support your local cuemaker!

 

[asiasdad]

I have bought, sold, or traded over 350 Highend Cues (mostly on eBay) since the mid-1990's and it is my opinion that the elements which define the value of any given cue are the same as those which define the value of fine artwork, custom handmade knives, highend watches, designer jewelry, etc. ... Since "playability and hit" are subjective at best, the established reputation of the cue-builder and the high-water mark he has achieved in actual sales are key elements notwithstanding supply, demand, and current market trends (now adrift in the doldrums of a foundering economy) ...

Bottom Line - Having been in the firearms business over 3 decades (now retired) and also being a advanced collector of custom handmade knives, really high-end watches, rare coins, fine art, high-end cues, and exotic cars I can state without reserve that the safest and wisest investment is to buy one cue for $1500.00 rather than ten cues for $150.00 each (unless that $1500.00 cue is a Dale Perry !!!) ... The Internet affords everyone the opportunity to thoroughly research cues, cue-builders and current market values ... "Blue Books" are great for reference but never forget - "Books don't buy Cues, People buy Cues" ... This Forum, in particular is a great place to gather such information, as there is a wealth of knowledge right here at your fingertips ...

My experience has been:

with ebay - when I see a cuemaker repeatedly on there, then it has extremely diminished value. Everyone uses Dale Perry as an example.

with the Blue Book - the photos, descriptions, and cuemaker background information is the best available, however the pricing could never be accurate as the market fluctuates just as the car market does, and the car blue books are released every 2 months, not 1 every several years.

with AZBilliards - I have experienced the best overall current market values by simply following this site the last 2 years.

I would also like to say that if you use this site to sell cues and you do not send Mike the token thirty five bucks to get a gold banner under your user id then you are a schmuck with no business selling cues on his site.

 

[BPG24]

The value of a cue, like fine artwork, is what someone is willing to pay for it.

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!