Historic Cues. Do you have any?

WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Historic - The Babe Cranfield's cue

A lot of great posts on this thread, thank you very much. I was going after the past on this thread, and I think it's captured that. Here's a wonderful piece of history, the cue of Babe Cranfield. As you can see, it's a beat-up Rambow Hoppe style. Sometime late in its life it received another wrap, but the original was white with green speck. Babe is more than not, given the credit for the longest run ever, though in practice, a 768. It was most likely with this cue, as Babe told me this was the cue that he exchanged with Willie Mosconi very early in their pool careers when they thought the other cue felt better.

I need to give credit to my good friend Larry Moy, attorney, and author of The Straight Pool Bible, with Babe Cranfield, for these pictures. I was good friends with Babe primarily in the 70s, and Larry was his friend and co-author into the 80s and beyond. Anyhow, the Babe taught us both a good deal of cue attitude, so many thanks to both.

As you can see, the cue in the first two pictures is pretty well worn, but that's how they used them in those days. Cues were not closet queens. The last picture is from an engraving on his case, simply titled "Babe"

All the best,
WW
 

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Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
A lot of great posts on this thread, thank you very much. I was going after the past on this thread, and I think it's captured that. Here's a wonderful piece of history, the cue of Babe Cranfield. As you can see, it's a beat-up Rambow Hoppe style. Sometime late in its life it received another wrap, but the original was white with green speck. Babe is more than not, given the credit for the longest run ever, though in practice, a 768. It was most likely with this cue, as Babe told me this was the cue that he exchanged with Willie Mosconi very early in their pool careers when they thought the other cue felt better.

I need to give credit to my good friend Larry Moy, attorney, and author of The Straight Pool Bible, with Babe Cranfield, for these pictures. I was good friends with Babe primarily in the 70s, and Larry was his friend and co-author into the 80s and beyond. Anyhow, the Babe taught us both a good deal of cue attitude, so many thanks to both.

As you can see, the cue in the first two pictures is pretty well worn, but that's how they used them in those days. Cues were not closet queens. The last picture is from an engraving on his case, simply titled "Babe"

All the best,
WW


Wow. Amazing.

It looks like the forearm is turned or sanded down almost to the shape of a coke bottle.

Can you comment on that? Do you know anything about how and/or why that was done? Did Babe do it himself for some reason?


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WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Wow. Amazing.

It looks like the forearm is turned or sanded down almost to the shape of a coke bottle.

Can you comment on that? Do you know anything about how and/or why that was done? Did Babe do it himself for some reason?


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Chop, Babe's cue was so thin at the joint, that it would bounce for a minute when he placed in on the rail to rack the balls. I'm sure he didn't do it himself, as he had no way of doing that. I think it just came from Herman Rambow that way, originally to Willie Mosconi. Here's a theory of mine. I think this picture, from Billiards Digest, just might have the picture of the very cue. It was well known that Mosconi and Cranfield traded cues in the early days because they liked the feel of the other. This is a very early picture, and has that same very tapered look. Later on, maybe even more wear. Hard to tell, just a theory of mine.

All the best,
WW
 

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Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Chop, Babe's cue was so thin at the joint, that it would bounce for a minute when he placed in on the rail to rack the balls. I'm sure he didn't do it himself, as he had no way of doing that. I think it just came from Herman Rambow that way, originally to Willie Mosconi. Here's a theory of mine. I think this picture, from Billiards Digest, just might have the picture of the very cue. It was well known that Mosconi and Cranfield traded cues in the early days because they liked the feel of the other. This is a very early picture, and has that same very tapered look. Later on, maybe even more wear. Hard to tell, just a theory of mine.

All the best,
WW


I see that in the picture. Very interesting. Thank you.


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WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I don't own this cue, but I wish I did. Harvey martin Owned by Jim McFarlane.

I currently live right down the street to the Elks Lodge where these guys played and practiced though... Just need to find a Harvey Martin at a garage sale now!

What a nice Harvey Martin cue. I was hoping someone would post a Martin. It's easy to see where Tad Kohara got some of his early influence, when looking at a Martin. From what I understand, Martin made a lot of carom cues, as well as pocket billiard cues, which would be rare today.

Also, it was quite a feat to get a new cue from Martin. He was somewhat the Dennis Searing of his day. I've heard there was no chance you could get a new Martin, unless he knew you well. So the stories go, he might invite you to lunch, or afternoon tea, or something. Then he would say, "I understand you're interested in a cue..."

Great post, thank you.

All the best,
WW
 

skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
Dig it.

To me a historic cue needs something.

Words like:

Only one.
First one.
Last one.
Won xxxx championship.
Owned and played extensively by (name historic player).
Broke the mold.
Changed the direction of cue making.
Set a standard.
Ties to a greater point in history. (example would be the non-brass war time Brunswick Hoppe cues)



If you were going to write a book on the history of cues, a historic cue would be in that book. Specifically that cue, not an example, but that cue. Certainly there are exceptions like the war time Hoppe cues, unless you can show me the first one or last one which I think at this point is impossible.

Where is the cheap cue that Reyes broke onto the scene with?

Who has Bill Strouds last cue?

Stroud claims to have been the first to core a cue. Where is it?

Mizerak owned many cues and did not play most of them. Where is his Bushka?

Where is the first Joss? Where is the last cue Stroud made with Janes?

That Rempe cue we saw in this forum made by Joss that is tied to Rempe himself? Why is it not in this thread?

Prototypes for Cuetec? Protoypes for Predator? Where are they?

Bob Beucci is said to have made his earliest Meucci brand cues like Huebler, with nylon inserts. Show me one.

Where are the cues from the movie The Hustler?

Where are the cues from The Color of Money?

Where are the cues featured on the covers of the magazines we were reading 30 years ago? Pool & Billiards and Billiards Digest come to mind but there are more of course. And I mean the exact cue in the picture.

Where is the first Black Boar with a crown butt cap?

This is a very cool thread. :thumbup:





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Sure, cues that changed the direction of cue making like ALL Bushka's, Szamboti's, early Gina's, Martins, Rambo's, Brunswicks, Palmers, even early Kersenbrocks and SW should be included..... Post them ALL because they all playd a part in where cue making is today....

That said, a few today are carving their own niche in the "historic" book....
 

Chopdoc

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Sure, cues that changed the direction of cue making like ALL Bushka's, Szamboti's, early Gina's, Martins, Rambo's, Brunswicks, Palmers, even early Kersenbrocks and SW should be included..... Post them ALL because they all playd a part in where cue making is today....

That said, a few today are carving their own niche in the "historic" book....



Sure. Post anything at all.

.




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classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
This Balabushka belonged to Richard Austin of Memphis Tennessee, a man of dubious distinction... passed away awaiting the death penalty in Tennessee. Stories were he was a gambler, hustler and member of some sort of an organization. We received the cue via his ex...

JV


The Tennessee Department of Correction says the state's oldest and longest serving death row inmate has died of natural causes.

Spokeswoman Dorinda Carter said 68-year-old Richard Austin was found dead in his cell at the DeBerry Special Needs Facility in Nashville on Sunday. He spent 30 years on death row.

Austin was sentenced to death in 1978 after a conviction in Shelby County of accessory before the fact to murder.

Austin was found to have hired a fugitive from prison to kill undercover policeman Julian Watkins. Watkins was investigating illegal gambling operations at the Golden Cue, a Memphis establishment that Austin owned.

Austin was the first person sentenced to die under Tennessee's current death penalty law, which was enacted in 1977.
 

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skins

Likes to draw
Silver Member
This Balabushka belonged to Richard Austin of Memphis Tennessee, a man of dubious distinction... passed away awaiting the death penalty in Tennessee. Stories were he was a gambler, hustler and member of some sort of an organization. We received the cue via his ex...

JV


The Tennessee Department of Correction says the state's oldest and longest serving death row inmate has died of natural causes.

Spokeswoman Dorinda Carter said 68-year-old Richard Austin was found dead in his cell at the DeBerry Special Needs Facility in Nashville on Sunday. He spent 30 years on death row.

Austin was sentenced to death in 1978 after a conviction in Shelby County of accessory before the fact to murder.

Austin was found to have hired a fugitive from prison to kill undercover policeman Julian Watkins. Watkins was investigating illegal gambling operations at the Golden Cue, a Memphis establishment that Austin owned.

Austin was the first person sentenced to die under Tennessee's current death penalty law, which was enacted in 1977.

This cue was restored right?... This is a cue I'd love to have. Just phenomenal.
 

WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
This cue was restored right?... This is a cue I'd love to have. Just phenomenal.

No doubt it was restored, whatsoever. And this is an incredible story. I wonder how many fancy Bushkas were owned by death row people. This might be one of one.

Joe, great post. There are a lot of ways cues can be historic, and this one checks several boxes all the way around.

All the best,
WW
 

classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
No doubt it was restored, whatsoever. And this is an incredible story. I wonder how many fancy Bushkas were owned by death row people. This might be one of one.

Joe, great post. There are a lot of ways cues can be historic, and this one checks several boxes all the way around.

All the best,
WW

Was ratty as hell and the wrap was shot. I would have loved to keep it as it was blue/yellow white veneers and one of my favorite Bushka patterns. We got it with a 4 point Boti copy by McDaniels.

JV
 

Soldtonight

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Great thread!

Ok, Hands down the coolest most interesting thread on AZ in a long while. Can't wait to see more gentlemen.
 

Bigb'scues

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Palmer 1970s..............
 

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WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Picked up this second catalog Palmer and vintage Brunswick case at SBE
It's in beautiful shape....one shaft is unplayed...I removed the foil with the name (put it aside for safe keeping)
And realigned the rings and window which have a tendency of going all which ways over the years

Great post. I believe you have the Palmer Model D, which was one of the most popular in that era, early 70s.

It looks like someone added a leather wrap to yours, as I don't recall Palmer doing that. Great looking cue.

All the best,
WW
 
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classiccues

Don't hashtag your broke friends
Silver Member
Barry Szam 200th cue

IMHO Any 100/200 etc.. cue is a milestone. Especially with the guys who have very low output...

However this cue sticks out in my mind because of a SBE. My friend comes in with cash and he is looking for a piece to put away. So at that time, this cue was 2500. We had a fancy floating spear ivory McDaniels, fancy , lotta ivory for 2500 also.

Against my recommendation he bought the McDaniels. He reminds me of this every time I talk to him. He couldn't get over the fanciness of the McD....

JV
 

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Type79

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I had to take apart and put back and glue together the buttsleeve section of my own Model D, as they tended to separate a bit, shall we say.

This is not good advice.

Palmer never glued the rings together in the butt sleeves and it creates a nightmare if they ever need to be removed due to a poor repair or otherwise.

Never never never glue together the rings on a Palmer and if you do, please inform buyers that the cue was irreparably modified. This is a an irreversible modification that in most cases destroys the rings.
 

WildWing

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
There are no buyers. Nothing is for sale, nor will ever be. And I don't destroy anything.

I like to play with my Model D, and the separation at the rings was causing vibrations. I'm sure many cue repairmen have dealt with this situation.

As always, your advice is appreciated.

All the best,
WW
 
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