In defense of JR

whitewolf

whitewolf

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
In the aiming methods thread you wondered why no one came to help you in that a lot of pool players play by feel. I decided to let that thread make it to the end finally and then to back you up.

My proposition is that players, including professionals, indeed shot by feel with no aiming system, contrary to what DM has been telling us all.

When asked what aiming system Earl used, he said that he just spins the balls into the holes. I defy anyone out there, especially DM, to name me a 'system' that can teach this. This is a prime example of shooting by feel.

Another example. Let's say you just made the 7 ball in 9 ball and leave yourself with a straight in 8 ball, about 2 feet from the pocket with the 9 ball back up on the other rail. The cue ball is too far from the object ball to really draw back down to the 9 ball, assuming we all aren't Cory Duels. So the good players know to put some high right or high left and power through the object ball, throwing it back into the corner pocket and continuing on hitting 3 rails to get perfectly back on the nine ball. This is another example of shooting purely by fee.

Drivermaker, you are trying to put a label on everything, and you owe JR an apology. He is not the village idiot. He is a member of the 'cave man' pool club, of which I contend there are numerous members. Yes, believe it or not, he plays by feel with no aiming system a great deal of the time.

Why am I using the term 'cave man' pool. Because you, DM, relate to things described in sexual terms, and maybe I can get my point across to you. Granted this is all tongue-in-cheek, but let me ask you: when you are having sex DM, do you see the hole and then use an aiming system to find your way there. No, please don't tell me, you pull the string on your Mawissa Doll, and she replies: "oh Devil Man, this time use 'Center to Edge', you know they like it so much better that way."

Now JR on the other hand really has what the women like. He is sensitive, plays by feel, and really has 'the touch'. Women dig JR. Why they just have MOs when they watch him shoot, secretly wishing they could get some of 'the touch'.

I really appreciate Fred and his effort to bring forth and explain aiming systems. Don't get me wrong. He is indeed very sincere and has some nifty things for the needy. I just feel sorry for Fred. I can just imagine him shooting that straight in shot I mentionsed above: "oh my God, I am not shootng with my Predator, so I will have to account for another .005% of serve and .5% of sliding friction - where is Dr. Dave when I need him. Fred, you are so left brained that a pool cue is growing out your left ear. You probably have a Dr. Dave doll also. But I can appreciate how far you have come in pool and I congratulate you again.
 
Honestly, I think the balls going in is the byproduct of cueball control.
If they know where the cueball is going, they have to know where the ob is going.
 
Boy ain't that the truth, Joey. Well stated. We control at best the wood, the other spheres are just results of energy transfer.
 
I don't understand all the sighting methods discussed...honest!! If you asked me to explain how I sight on a ball, I don't think I could actually tell you. I know I do, but I don't think about it. Maybe if I did and consciously thought about it, my game would get better, but I would probably just be more confused.....Joe
 
We need more pirates.

It has been scientifically proven that a reduction in pirates has led to an increase in global warming.
piratesarecool.jpg

(I will ignore all mentions of the causation v correlation argument).

Ships ahoy...or something :D
 
I already think about too much when I play pool to also think about aiming systems. I use next to none. Aiming in pool isn't a whole lot different from aiming in target shooting or darts. What aiming system do they use? My only aiming system would be to practice all the shots repeatedly until I pratically don't have to aim at all.

I would say practice the same pre shot routine to help you when things get tight.
 
whitewolf said:
.. you pull the string on your Mawissa Doll, and she replies: "oh Devil Man, this time use 'Center to Edge', you know they like it so much better that way."
Click to expand...
He's got one too?? :eek:

Available at www.amazon.com/php32266/$hks/mawissadoll.php?

Just $19.95 while stocks last!
 
whitewolf said:
I really appreciate Fred and his effort to bring forth and explain aiming systems. Don't get me wrong. He is indeed very sincere and has some nifty things for the needy. I just feel sorry for Fred. I can just imagine him shooting that straight in shot I mentionsed above: "oh my God, I am not shootng with my Predator, so I will have to account for another .005% of serve and .5% of sliding friction - where is Dr. Dave when I need him.
Click to expand...
Anyone who can actually read knows exactly where I stand when it comes to Dr. Dave. You're pathetic Ray. Dr. Dave and I definitely are not on the same page. Did you not read one fuckin' post that I wrote? Big surprise, since I'm not convince you can read at all. I'm the one defending the non-scientific base aiming, while someone else is defending the more traditional physics-wise correct aiming. Pay attention. Friggin' idiot.

Fred, you are so left brained that a pool cue is growing out your left ear.
Click to expand...
You're such an idiot. Did you not read a single word? If I am "so left brained," what does that make Colin Colenso, the main person with whom I am debating against???
You probably have a Dr. Dave doll also.
Click to expand...
Where in your pea-brained world did you ever think that I am a fan of Dr. Dave? Do you never read anything?

You need serious help.

Fred
 
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I don't get it. If Fred or DM or one of the "Houleigans" are successful in pocketing balls using the aiming systems and Colin or whoever is successful in pocketing balls by "feel", then why is one wrong and the other right? What the hell is the argument about? Are the "feel" players trying to prove that the aiming systems don't work? Isn't that sort of like proving that a Bumblebee can't fly? On paper he isn't supposed to fly, but By God, I've seen 'em do it. What's the point of all this B.S.?
 
whitewolf said:
In the aiming methods thread you wondered why no one came to help you in that a lot of pool players play by feel. I decided to let that thread make it to the end finally and then to back you up.

My proposition is that players, including professionals, indeed shot by feel with no aiming system, contrary to what DM has been telling us all.

When asked what aiming system Earl used, he said that he just spins the balls into the holes. I defy anyone out there, especially DM, to name me a 'system' that can teach this. This is a prime example of shooting by feel.

Another example. Let's say you just made the 7 ball in 9 ball and leave yourself with a straight in 8 ball, about 2 feet from the pocket with the 9 ball back up on the other rail. The cue ball is too far from the object ball to really draw back down to the 9 ball, assuming we all aren't Cory Duels. So the good players know to put some high right or high left and power through the object ball, throwing it back into the corner pocket and continuing on hitting 3 rails to get perfectly back on the nine ball. This is another example of shooting purely by fee.

Drivermaker, you are trying to put a label on everything, and you owe JR an apology. He is not the village idiot. He is a member of the 'cave man' pool club, of which I contend there are numerous members. Yes, believe it or not, he plays by feel with no aiming system a great deal of the time.

Why am I using the term 'cave man' pool. Because you, DM, relate to things described in sexual terms, and maybe I can get my point across to you. Granted this is all tongue-in-cheek, but let me ask you: when you are having sex DM, do you see the hole and then use an aiming system to find your way there. No, please don't tell me, you pull the string on your Mawissa Doll, and she replies: "oh Devil Man, this time use 'Center to Edge', you know they like it so much better that way."

Now JR on the other hand really has what the women like. He is sensitive, plays by feel, and really has 'the touch'. Women dig JR. Why they just have MOs when they watch him shoot, secretly wishing they could get some of 'the touch'.

I really appreciate Fred and his effort to bring forth and explain aiming systems. Don't get me wrong. He is indeed very sincere and has some nifty things for the needy. I just feel sorry for Fred. I can just imagine him shooting that straight in shot I mentionsed above: "oh my God, I am not shootng with my Predator, so I will have to account for another .005% of serve and .5% of sliding friction - where is Dr. Dave when I need him. Fred, you are so left brained that a pool cue is growing out your left ear. You probably have a Dr. Dave doll also. But I can appreciate how far you have come in pool and I congratulate you again.
Click to expand...


This is beyond a shadow of a doubt the most ridiculous post you've ever made. I can't even imagine if you tried harder, that it could get more nonsensical.

The only thing CaptJR is going to get from me is a Mexican Hat Dance and now a Riverdance on top of his cap.

We have 5 senses...TASTE; SMELL; HEARING; SIGHT; and FEEL. Each one is SEPARATE. The process of aiming is VISUAL...We use our SIGHT and EYES to LINE UP THE BALLS. IT CAN'T BE DONE ANY OTHER WAY.

FEEL comes from the fingers and hands. Close your eyes to take a shot and tell me how FEEL allowed you to do it. For someone to continually say that it comes about as a result of feel needs to get touch with what their eyes are doing.

NOBODY CAN PLAY BY FEEL OTHER THAN A BLIND PERSON.

The eyes and VISUAL IMAGERY play the role in orienting us to the balls. Some ways, methods, and SYSTEMS are better than others. WAKE UP!!
 
Wow, I just saw DM's response to my post. Y'all can expect something from me tonight. I'm at work right now and really can't spend very much time going through it. Thanks White Wolf for bringing this to my attention AND for trying to explain my views. I'll continue this later.
 
Jude Rosenstock said:
Wow, I just saw DM's response to my post. Y'all can expect something from me tonight. I'm at work right now and really can't spend very much time going through it. Thanks White Wolf for bringing this to my attention AND for trying to explain my views. I'll continue this later.
Click to expand...


Oh boy...oh boy...oh boy....I can't wait. Hey Jude, think you can take a couple of hours off early??
 
drivermaker said:
This is beyond a shadow of a doubt the most ridiculous post you've ever made...
Click to expand...

I think you forgot to put "this week" at the end of your sentence. The week is young, and WW is just getting started.

He averages a dumbass post every time he hits the "submit" button. Every time. Feel sorry for him. He doesnt' know much about the game, he can't read, and Fast Larry is still his hero.

Fred
 
Hmmm
Ever see a quick-draw competitor?
You know, like with a western style wheel gun?
They aim. I wonder what system they use to aim?
And how the hell to they find time to use it?
 
You know ...

This post is starting to sound a lot like the
'evolution' vs. 'creationism' argument ...
who cares if evolution exists with all its
scientific theories, Maybe God planned it that way.
 
BazookaJoe said:
Hmmm
Ever see a quick-draw competitor?
You know, like with a western style wheel gun?
They aim. I wonder what system they use to aim?
And how the hell to they find time to use it?
Click to expand...


I don't know but who would you rather be in a gun fight from 100 yds...the guy with a rifle already aiming at your heart with a scope...or the quick draw guy that's whipping his pistol out at the count of three and shooting like Yosemite Sam. (BTW, those guys are soooo fast, they can draw and shoot just as fast as the guy already standing there ready to pull the trigger)
Who's going to be more accurate?
 
GeraldG said:
I don't get it. If Fred or DM or one of the "Houleigans" are successful in pocketing balls using the aiming systems and Colin or whoever is successful in pocketing balls by "feel", then why is one wrong and the other right? What the hell is the argument about? Are the "feel" players trying to prove that the aiming systems don't work? Isn't that sort of like proving that a Bumblebee can't fly? On paper he isn't supposed to fly, but By God, I've seen 'em do it. What's the point of all this B.S.?
Click to expand...

Good post. The point is to see who has the biggest dick. imho.

"Houleigans," I like it...that name should stick.

The problem is that the term "feel" is incorrect. It would better be stated by the concept of, "consciously playing subconscious pool." Or in this exact topic, "consciously aiming subconsiously."

In other words, each shooter has consciously learned how to pot balls. Once done numerous times, the subconscious mind has now learned it and takes over the task, freeing up the conscious mind to do something else. By using a process of integration (my term is "The Recipe"), one can then add new aiming information via the conscious mind again, and overlearn that, so the subconscious mind can take over that task, too. Thus, some come to call it "feel," when it is really overlearned skill.

Now as to what exact aiming method(s) is overlearned, that is up to the player, his goals, his spot in his journey of pool, and how much shit he's willing to put up with here with to learn something new. :rolleyes:

Jeff Livingston
 
drivermaker said:
I don't know but who would you rather be in a gun fight from 100 yds...the guy with a rifle already aiming at your heart with a scope...or the quick draw guy that's whipping his pistol out at the count of three and shooting like Yosemite Sam. (BTW, those guys are soooo fast, they can draw and shoot just as fast as the guy already standing there ready to pull the trigger)
Who's going to be more accurate?
Click to expand...

I have an ex co-worker who could draw and snap before you could pull the trigger. It was amazing.
How fast can they shoot?
http://www.fastdraw.org/video/fastestg-men.wmv
How accurate can they be?
deadly
http://www.fastdraw.org/video/cal-blanktarget.wmv
 
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