Is Schmidt's and charlie 626 Legit

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's not a wpa world championship. It is a world 14.1 championship as it was billed. Just like an apa world championship is a world title because they say it is.

Just like you have a state championship just because whomever put on that tournament called it that.
It's really simple. History belongs to the person who wields the pen. The Billiard Congress of America maintains the record book. The BCA is the North American member of the WPA. So any person who wants to have their name recorded as a World Champion in the record book has to win a WPA sanctioned World Championship.

An event can be named whatever someone wants to as long as that something is not in violation of someone else's intellectual property. Events use deceptive marketing all the time to lure participants and spectators and backers. People on the outside always want to be on the inside.

There are many ways that Dragon could market this event that draw on the rich history of the game without making it into a conflict with the WPA. Of course the allure is being crowned WORLD champion. But what is that worth when it's not lastingly recorded?

If Dragon Promotions wants to crown true world champions then they need to create their own competing organization and be completely separate from the BCA/WPA. Put out their own rule books, their own hall of fame, their own records books. In the end history will decide who gets honored as true world champions and who does not.

The media should then correctly identify the winners as WPA World Champions, or DP World Champions. In the absence of cooperation their should at least be distinction. Blurring the lines does no good and only invites confusion. The winner of the ongoing 14.1 event might feel like a world champion and some people might call him a world champion but officially he won't be recorded as a world champion.

lol.

Lou Figueroa
 

gerryf

Well-known member
There is no copy of the 626 videotape. The original soundtrack has been edited.
There is no unedited 626 videotape, therefore, there is no proof of 626 ball run.
Trust no one. No scouts here.
Would you bet on it?

Put up say, $100,000 for a personal viewing of the unedited tape and see what kind of response you get.

If you aren't willing to put up, then you're just babbling again.
 

logical

apart of their 'semi public'
Silver Member
Captured before you came to your senses and deleted:
Shouldn’t have had to tell you, but once.
I, personally, wouldn’t spend one cent, American or Canadian to see, what can’t be seen, and I am not blinded by the light, either.
Blinded by hate and stupidity.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 
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logical

apart of their 'semi public'
Silver Member
Capture this AKF(arhseholekissingfollower).
You’ve never added one morsel of fact to this thread, only wild ass accusations
applied in your steady fashion of constant grief about the truth involved.
Talk about others, constantly, accusing others of the same hatefulness and stupidity
purely because you cannot defend anything you post because you don’t posses any useful information about what you’re posting.



Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

easy-e

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Capture this AKF(arhseholekissingfollower).
You’ve never added one morsel of fact to this thread, only wild ass accusations
applied in your steady fashion of constant grief about the truth involved.
Talk about others, constantly, accusing others of the same hatefulness and stupidity
purely because you cannot defend anything you post because you don’t posses any useful information about what you’re posting.
Facts like this? "There is no copy of the 626 videotape. The original soundtrack has been edited.
There is no unedited 626 videotape"
 

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Capture this AKF(arhseholekissingfollower).
You’ve never added one morsel of fact to this thread, only wild ass accusations
applied in your steady fashion of constant grief about the truth involved.
Talk about others, constantly, accusing others of the same hatefulness and stupidity
purely because you cannot defend anything you post because you don’t posses any useful information about what you’re posting.
That is fukking HIGHlarious, coming from you!

Your words are at their most accurate, when spoken by you into a mirror.
 

Island Drive

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Haven't looked at this thread for months, coming to this page, feels/sounds like a Politics.
Either your on this side or that, but coming together and agreeing doesn't seeeeeeeeeeeeem an option.
 

gerryf

Well-known member
Capture this AKF(arhseholekissingfollower).
You’ve never added one morsel of fact to this thread, only wild ass accusations
applied in your steady fashion of constant grief about the truth involved.
Talk about others, constantly, accusing others of the same hatefulness and stupidity
purely because you cannot defend anything you post because you don’t posses any useful information about what you’re posting.
Gee Danny, are those hemorrhoids acting up again? You're frothing at the mouth a bit.

You keep insisting that John Schmidt give you a free copy of his run, but you don't ask him. You just complain a lot.

Interesting approach in a bang-your-head-against-the- wall sense. You probably have a headache as well.
 

Cameron Smith

is kind of hungry...
Silver Member
It almost looks like there is a distinction at play. There's the Straight Pool World Championship (not held since 1990), and the World Straight Pool Championship run by Dragon Promotions since 2006.

It reads like the Straight Pool World championships ran sporadically from 1912 to 1990. None of those were sanctioned by the WPA as it didn't exist until 1987). The BCA had world championships sporadically after 1948.

Then after a gap of 15 years with no world championship tournaments, the Dragon Promotions World Straight Pool Championship ran from 2006 to the present (except 2020). The 2006 event was the first Straight Pool Championship ever sanctioned by the WPA, and they also sanctioned 2007, 2008, and 2010, but none since.

If the WPA has only been involved in straight pool in four of the last 30 years, it's almost like it's not involved at all.

Didn't something similar happen recently in Chinese 8-ball or Snooker or something, where they referred to something as a World Championship, but the WPA or another sports organization didn't recognize it.
Yes I remember something similar with the Chinese 8 ball world title not being sanctioned. I’m not sure which ones weren’t sanctioned.

I keep hoping that the WPA would do something to allow someone (not Charlie) to take the reins and promote a proper World 14.1 Championship. Either reduce or eliminate their criteria (including sanctioning fees) or give up the rights to it entirely. The former being most preferable.

It feels like prize money stipulations and sanctioning fees have ensured we will never have another World Champion in 14.1 again. Congrats to Oliver I suppose for becoming World Champ for life.
 

gerryf

Well-known member
Yes I remember something similar with the Chinese 8 ball world title not being sanctioned. I’m not sure which ones weren’t sanctioned.

I keep hoping that the WPA would do something to allow someone (not Charlie) to take the reins and promote a proper World 14.1 Championship. Either reduce or eliminate their criteria (including sanctioning fees) or give up the rights to it entirely. The former being most preferable.

It feels like prize money stipulations and sanctioning fees have ensured we will never have another World Champion in 14.1 again. Congrats to Oliver I suppose for becoming World Champ for life.
I remember reading Willie Mosconi's book, and even back then it was common for championships to have only a small number of competitors. I guess 14.1 was just getting less and less popular.

That seems to be the way, although interest does seem to be increasing, particularly in Europe.

As for Dragon Promotions, they've hung on for 15 years, and without WPA sanctioning they've now become the championship by default. That seems to occur in other sports as well, where a sanctioning body won't go along, and eventually they just become sidelined. Too bad they couldn't just work it out.
 
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Cameron Smith

is kind of hungry...
Silver Member
I remember reading Willie Mosconi's book, and even back then it was common for championships to have only a small number of competitors. I guess 14.1 was just getting less and less popular.

That seems to be the way, although interest does seem to be increasing, particularly in Europe.
I’m not sure, my impression was that in those days the world championships were always small because of the rigorous qualifying structure. I seem to remember Willie mentioning in an interview that you had to win at the city level, then state level and then national in order to be invited to the ‘Worlds’.

I’d love to see a round robin world championship that included winners of the big 14.1 events from around the world along with perhaps the defending world champion and previous years world champion. 6-8 players and use the accu-stats make-it-happen format with a play off match to determine the winner.
 

justnum

Principal Investigator of Magic Trick Shots
Silver Member
I remember reading Willie Mosconi's book, and even back then it was common for championships to have only a small number of competitors. I guess 14.1 was just getting less and less popular.

That seems to be the way, although interest does seem to be increasing, particularly in Europe.

As for Dragon Promotions, they've hung on for 15 years, and without WPA sanctioning they've now become the championship by default. That seems to occur in other sports as well, where a sanctioning body won't go along, and eventually they just become sidelined. Too bad they couldn't just work it out.

Historically in America leagues run by black people were not considered as official as other leagues.

Could the non sanctioning of dragons events be motivated by racism? How long is the line to get sanctioning for a pool event?

Just imagine a future where everyone posts a 14.1 run on the internet as if it were food porn.

Some governments give probationary sanctioning and then allow up to ten years to achieve full sanctioning.

Does the sanctioning body have a development plan for tournament promoters short on prize money?

Or is it just Dragon promotions that got redlined?
 
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Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Historically in America leagues run by black people were not considered as official as other leagues.

Could the non sanctioning of dragons events be motivated by racism? How long is the line to get sanctioning for a pool event?

Just imagine a future where everyone posts a 14.1 run on the internet as if it were food porn.

Some governments give probationary sanctioning and then allow up to ten years to achieve full sanctioning.

Does the sanctioning body have a development plan for tournament promoters short on prize money?

Or is it just Dragon promotions that got redlined?
Some species kill their own for the good of the species.
 

PVD16

New member
Historically in America leagues run by black people were not considered as official as other leagues.

Could the non sanctioning of dragons events be motivated by racism? How long is the line to get sanctioning for a pool event?

Just imagine a future where everyone posts a 14.1 run on the internet as if it were food porn.

Some governments give probationary sanctioning and then allow up to ten years to achieve full sanctioning.

Does the sanctioning body have a development plan for tournament promoters short on prize money?

Or is it just Dragon promotions that got redlined?
There are fee attached to the sanctioning body and payouts to participants set a certain levels . If you are unwilling or unable to pay them you will not be sanction. Not Racism.
 

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Does the sanctioning body have a development plan for tournament promoters short on prize money?
Screenshot_20210715-113504__01.jpg
 

gerryf

Well-known member
One thing is for sure: It's not much of a "World Championship" when the promoter is pulling spectators out of the stands to fill the field.

Lou Figueroa
just sayin'
Do you know if the field each year is growing, shrinking, or staying the same?

It may not be a World (global) championship, but it seems to be a World (of straight pool) championship.

I had the sense that straight pool was becoming more popular, just by the fact that i see people playing it now and again, or talking about it.

14.1 seems to be caught in a bind - not enough players because there's not enough money in it, and not enough money it because there's not enough players.
 

justnum

Principal Investigator of Magic Trick Shots
Silver Member
Do you know if the field each year is growing, shrinking, or staying the same?

It may not be a World (global) championship, but it seems to be a World (of straight pool) championship.

I had the sense that straight pool was becoming more popular, just by the fact that i see people playing it now and again, or talking about it.

14.1 seems to be caught in a bind - not enough players because there's not enough money in it, and not enough money it because there's not enough players.

The pool player infrastructure falls on the WPA. They do have American 14.1 on the calendar, the flipside to that problem is , there aren't enough events through the year to make practicing 14.1 worth money.
 

Cameron Smith

is kind of hungry...
Silver Member
Do you know if the field each year is growing, shrinking, or staying the same?

It may not be a World (global) championship, but it seems to be a World (of straight pool) championship.

I had the sense that straight pool was becoming more popular, just by the fact that i see people playing it now and again, or talking about it.

14.1 seems to be caught in a bind - not enough players because there's not enough money in it, and not enough money it because there's not enough players.
I wouldn’t call it a world championship in any respect since too many of the worlds elite 14.1 specialists are missing each year. The European and American 14.1 championships are the premiere events in straight pool currently. I would have argued in favour of Charlie’s event back in 2011 when there was still a strong field present. But it shrinks each year and I don’t think the lack of attendance is due to popularity of 14.1 (or lack of) but rather the tournament itself. Meanwhile, the American 14.1 Championship appears to grow each year, 2020 not withstanding.
 

gerryf

Well-known member
The pool player infrastructure falls on the WPA. They do have American 14.1 on the calendar, the flipside to that problem is , there aren't enough events through the year to make practicing 14.1 worth money.
In October is the International Open in Virginia. It has tournaments in 9-ball, 10-ball, and One-pocket. It looks like only the 9-ball is WPA sanctioned.

The American 14.1 Championship seems to typically have 40-some players, and that's been dominated by Europeans now, since John Schmidt was the last American to win it back in 2012 I believe.

The Dragon World 14.1 is also dominated by Europeans.

I'm not sure what it would take to make it bigger. Maybe that pool-loving billionaire everyone keeps looking for. Someone should ask Elon Musk if he's interested.
 
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