Mosconi Cup Day One

spartan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Probably most worst performance by both teams on Day 1. I am guessing if average TPA of all players was lowest ever and few if any shot above 900 TPA whole day. Most matches had players miss 5 or more shots each over such short races. :ROFLMAO:
 

Slide Rule

ConservativeHardLiner
Silver Member
Next time around the timer buzzer needs to be much higher in decibels.

The players could barely notice the warning. Sarcasm off.

The match was better in the sense that there were no screamers no persons
attempting to interrupt focus and aim. That is, a no audience situation
improved the presentation and the overall play.

Would it be possible to freeze the rules, conditions, and other constantly
changing issues that appear to convey advantage?

 
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jokrswylde

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Respectfully, push outs have to be called period. Obvious or not has no significance, it's literally the only thing you need to call in 9-ball so not hard to remember. I play at very amateur local tournaments and push outs are always called. Always.

Sent from my SM-G960F using Tapatalk

You are right. I was facetiously assuming that everyone knew that...especially a highly ranked pro! :)
 

Brookeland Bill

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Seriously...you don't have to watch it. It takes serious effort to watch the Mosconi Cup this year...you have to know about DAZN, sign up (for $20), and then watch it.
All you have to do is not do any of the above.
Your particular criticism of the event is neither welcomed nor constructive.
I don’t For the reasons I’ve starte. There’s a difference in disrespect and a suggestion.
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Gold Member
Silver Member
Adapting to conditions is the name of the game. If you refuse to play in a tournament because the color of the balls interfere with your pattern recognition, that's on you. I have no problems taking notice of a new color and playing accordingly. Many old pool players are just resistant to change. Anything that breaks from what they're used to is considered anathema. Did the new colors throw me off too? Sure, once I registered the new number and color, I was able to see the out just fine. Anyone who says they can't get out because the color of the balls prevents them from doing so, can't get out to begin with. Utterly ridiculous.
You seem to have a comprehension problem, everybody keeps saying the 5 ball is the 4 ball, when you play shape on the wrong ball because its a color that has been around since the beginning of the game NEVERMIND......
 

surlytempo

Member
You seem to have a comprehension problem, everybody keeps saying the 5 ball is the 4 ball, when you play shape on the wrong ball because its a color that has been around since the beginning of the game NEVERMIND......
And you don't seem to get it, it doesn't matter. Take notice of the difference, adapt and play accordingly. Blaming the color of the balls for your inability to run out says more about your ability than it does about the color of the balls being a problem. That's like blaming Artemis cushions for not playing like the SuperSpeed rails you're used to. They're just different. So adapt and play.
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Gold Member
Silver Member
And you don't seem to get it, it doesn't matter. Take notice of the difference, adapt and play accordingly. Blaming the color of the balls for your inability to run out says more about your ability than it does about the color of the balls being a problem. That's like blaming Artemis cushions for not playing like the SuperSpeed rails you're used to. They're just different. So adapt and play.
I'm assuming you have no experience in the real world, otherwise you wouldn't make nonsensical statements like this.

The difference in this scenario could cost these guys $15,000, in my world doing something like this could cost a life or many lives.

It must be nice being perfect 😏

BTW, I have a job where if I make a single mistake people could die, but bottom line is if I make a single mistake I'm fired, no questions asked. Thats why we don't do stupid shit like change the color of a ball to the same color as another ball for the last 100 years.
 
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surlytempo

Member
I'm assuming you have no experience in the real world, otherwise you wouldn't make nonsensical statements like this.

The difference in this scenario could cost these guys $15,000, in my world doing something like this could cost a life or many lives.

It must be nice being perfect 😏
Let's be clear, they're not being cost anything. They're getting something, win or lose, that wasn't ever theirs to even begin with. If the tournament director and sponsors negotiate a deal for the betterment of the activity or in the betterment of their business interests, it's up to the players to abide. You act like we're somehow doing Matchroom a favor by allowing them to host the Mosconi. You wanna talk about the real world, don't go around biting the hand that feeds.

Pool needs Matchroom desperately, and if that means we have to make some color adjustments to get paid and boost the image of the sport, then get. the. fuck. over. it.
 

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Gold Member
Silver Member
Let's be clear, they're not being cost anything. They're getting something, win or lose, that wasn't ever theirs to ever begin with. If the tournament director and sponsors negotiate a deal for the betterment of the activity or in the betterment of their business interests, it's up to the players to abide. You act like we're somehow doing Matchroom a favor by allowing them to host the Mosconi. You wanna talk about the real world, don't go around biting the hand that feeds.

Pool needs Matchroom desperately, and if that means we have to make some color adjustments to get paid and boost the image of the activity, then get. the. fuck. over. it.
You clearly have no understanding what we're talking about.

Maybe you should pause and wonder why everyone disagrees with YOU
 

surlytempo

Member
You clearly have no understanding what we're talking about.

Maybe you should pause and wonder why everyone disagrees with YOU
Yeah man, the only way a person can possibly understand something is if they agree with you. You're really demonstrating what a bright bunch of punch you are. Carry on my wayward friend.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Let's be clear, they're not being cost anything. They're getting something, win or lose, that wasn't ever theirs to even begin with. If the tournament director and sponsors negotiate a deal for the betterment of the activity or in the betterment of their business interests, it's up to the players to abide. You act like we're somehow doing Matchroom a favor by allowing them to host the Mosconi. You wanna talk about the real world, don't go around biting the hand that feeds.

Pool needs Matchroom desperately, and if that means we have to make some color adjustments to get paid and boost the image of the sport, then get. the. fuck. over. it.

How about if we just pee a little on the hand that feeds?

That OK by you?

MR made a poor, confusing, and ugly decision. Sure, they can do it. Doesn’t make the balls any less confusing or ugly. Or make it less of a topic for polite conversation.

Lou Figueroa
 

surlytempo

Member
How about if we just pee a little on the hand that feeds?

That OK by you?

MR made a poor, confusing, and ugly decision. Sure, they can do it. Doesn’t make the balls any less confusing or ugly. Or make it less of a topic for polite conversation.

Lou Figueroa
Is it really much wonder why pool is in the state that it's in; playing for meager sums, showing up to press conferences in shorts, asking for deals on venues. With that kind of attitude, you may as well go around telling other people how to decorate their homes. Pool players are incredibly entitled. Matchroom took a flyer on pool, and the response from the community is WAAAAAAAHHHH. 🙄
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Is it really much wonder why pool is in the state that it's in; playing for meager sums, showing up to press conferences in shorts, asking for deals on venues. With that kind of attitude, you may as well go around telling other people how to decorate their homes. Pool players are incredibly entitled. Matchroom took a flyer on pool, and the response from the community is WAAAAAAAHHHH. 🙄
I agree that Matchroom has done a lot for pool and they have profited handsomely while doing it. MR is not a philanthropic organization, in case you didn't know. For that reason they make decisions that will increase their bottom line. Are you following me so far? But in making those decisions it is entirely possible they may make some that are not in the overall best interests of the sport. When they (or whoever it is that made this decision) realizes this, the prudent thing to do would be to correct it in the future.

We have seen similar situations arise in other sports (Baseball, Basketball, Hockey and Football) and the powers that be have made the necessary changes to rectify their mistakes when needed. Hopefully that will happen here. The court of public opinion (like AZB) is a powerful one and should be recognized. I have absolutely no problem with the many people (including myself) who have pointed out the fallacy of constantly changing the ball colors to suit a sponsor. IMO, that is far more damaging to our sport than someone wearing shorts to a press conference.

A long time ago I produced a major pool tournament that was to be televised on ESPN. It meant big dollars to me in sponsorship money to be televised. At the last minute the ESPN producer of the show told me that I needed to shorten the final matches to fit television air times. I REFUSED! He gave me an ultimatum and my response was to tell him he could pack up his trucks and crew, and leave. The matches were played full length and televised on ESPN! That was one of my proudest moments in pool, and no one even knew about it until years later.
 
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surlytempo

Member
I agree that Matchroom has done a lot for pool and they have profited handsomely while doing it. MR is not a philanthropic organization, in case you didn't know. For that reason they make decisions that will increase their bottom line. Are you following me so far? But in making those decisions it is entirely possible they may make some that are not in the overall best interests of the sport. When they (or whoever it is that made this decision) realizes this, the prudent thing to do would be to correct it in the future.

We have seen similar situations arise in other sports (Baseball, Basketball, Hockey and Football) and the powers that be have made the necessary changes to rectify their mistakes when needed. Hopefully that will happen here. The court of public opinion (like AZB) is a powerful one and should be recognized. I have absolutely no problem with the many people (including myself) who have pointed out the fallacy of constantly changing the ball colors to suit a sponsor. IMO, that is far more damaging to our sport than someone wearing shorts to a press conference.

A long time ago I produced a major pool tournament that was to be televised on ESPN. It meant big dollars to me in sponsorship money to be televised. At the last minute the ESPN producer of the show told me that I needed to shorten the final matches to fit television air times. I REFUSED! He game me an ultimatum and my response was to tell him he could pack up his trucks and crew, and leave. The matches were played full length and televised on ESPN! That was one of my proudest moments in pool, and no one even knew about it until years later.
I hear you, but no one has really made a sound argument for why their preferred color of balls is in fact the right choice. Saying "it's what we're used to" isn't a valid argument, certainly not one backed by any sort of color analysis or psychology. A long time ago, pool held perhaps a bit more clout, but, my thinking is, if you tried to run a similar ESPN televised production today and gave them that response, they would probably say "Ok. Good luck to you then."

But no, I disagree, the color of balls is not going to be more damaging to our sport than the professional decorum exhibited by players that make them and the game marketable. On this point, China has certainly proven me right. The most publicly marketable pool players in Asia right now have both sex and/or professional appeal.

AZB is currently a hub for billiard enthusiasts but that does not mean it should remain so. And considering that a good portion of the vocal members here are seemingly anti-science, anti-vaxx, COVID deniers, it's not likely to be a community that's going to be well received by the public at large as the bastion of pool's intellectual elite should pool see a return to media popularity. Not without some serious image control. In its current iteration, given the rampant ignorance around here, I doubt very much it will be promoted as the front page of pool should that time come.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
I hear you, but no one has really made a sound argument for why their preferred color of balls is in fact the right choice. Saying "it's what we're used to" isn't a valid argument, certainly not one backed by any sort of color analysis or psychology. A long time ago, pool held perhaps a bit more clout, but, my thinking is, if you tried to run a similar ESPN televised production today and gave them that response, they would probably say "Ok. Good luck to you then."

But no, I disagree, the color of balls is not going to be more damaging to our sport than the professional decorum exhibited by players that make them and the game marketable. On this point, China has certainly proven me right. The most publicly marketable pool players in Asia right now have both sex and/or professional appeal.

AZB is currently a hub for billiard enthusiasts but that does not mean it should remain so. And considering that a good portion of the vocal members here are seemingly anti-science, anti-vaxx, COVID deniers, it's not likely to be a community that's going to be well received by the public at large as the bastion of pool's intellectual elite should pool see a return to media popularity. Not without some serious image control. In its current iteration, given the rampant ignorance around here, I doubt very much it will be promoted as the front page of pool should that time come.
A well worded response but one that I disagree with pretty much across the board. Rather than debate you endlessly why I disagree with you, I will leave it at that.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Is it really much wonder why pool is in the state that it's in; playing for meager sums, showing up to press conferences in shorts, asking for deals on venues. With that kind of attitude, you may as well go around telling other people how to decorate their homes. Pool players are incredibly entitled. Matchroom took a flyer on pool, and the response from the community is WAAAAAAAHHHH. 🙄

Puh-leeeeze, MR is making good money off pool, or they wouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Lou Figueroa
 

Scrunge19

Registered
Matchroom is hosting these tournaments to make money first and foremost. Which is what businesses do and I have no problem with that. And while it’s great that they’ve stepped up and are producing these events for us, it doesn’t mean they’re immune to criticism when it’s deserved. Emily Frazer needs to learn to handle criticism better so the product can continue to improve.

That said, changing the colors of the balls was dumb. I can see making the 9 ball black and yellow, but flip flopping the colors of the 4 ball and 5 ball makes absolutely no sense and deserves criticism. This is no different than tennis being played on blue clay or the NHL considering playing on blue ice. Both leagues ended those experiments early because of how poorly they were received by competitors and fans.
 
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