Old timers...tell me about The Miz

[lewdo26]

I am interested in his mental game for purposes of this thread.

I'd like to know how he compares with the other players that are known for a great mental game: Varner & Co.

From what I've seen of his tapes, Miz looks like he has a healthy relationship to the game.

Taking joy in playing as well as thriving in competitive situations.

Oh and his concentration too appeared to have been sick.

 

[jay helfert]

Miz had a burning desire to WIN! He thought he was the best player in the world, and he didn't want anyone to beat him...EVER!

And guess what. He was the best player in the world! For a while anyway. He was probably the man to beat from the early 70's to the early 80's. I'm only talking tournament pool here, not gambling. Miz was not a big gambler.

Earl finally broke him down with back to back wins at Caesars Tahoe and then Reds. Miz was never quite the same after those two losses in final matches.

That's when he started getting bigger and bigger. The bigger he got, the more his game slipped.

 

[Matt_24]

Are there any MIZ gambling stories? Why did he not gamble? I know he always worked as well so perhaps that had something to do with it. I'm just curious, as I'm a huge MIZ fan and love hearing stories about him.

 

[jay helfert]

Are there any MIZ gambling stories? Why did he not gamble? I know he always worked as well so perhaps that had something to do with it. I'm just curious, as I'm a huge MIZ fan and love hearing stories about him.

I didn't say he wouldn't gamble. He just preferred not to. He was a married working man, a schoolteacher. Money was hard to come by for him.

But woe be the man who challenged Steve to a game. If you made him mad, he would put some money up, and then he would roast you on the spit. Some of the East Coast guys remember a few of his gambling wins I'm sure. I heard about them but don't know (or remember) enough to be specific.

 

[Thunderball]

http://forums.azbilliards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=49

 

[9BallPaul]

What's up with Steve Jr.?

Miz had a son, Steve Jr., who posted here for only a week, more than a year ago, then dropped from sight. Posts were very interesting and insightful, for example, they discussed Miz's baseball career in the minors.

wondering what happened that he stopped posting....

 

[jerseybillG]

look on the miz section of this forum...

 

[Paul8ball]

I played The Miz once in 1972. It was a student exhibition at The University of Michigan. I had never seen a professional pool player at that point and I had no idea what was in store for me. Mr. Mizerak came up to me before the match and introduced himself and then apologized for beating me! We had not played yet. At that time he was a school teacher in New Jersey and apparently there was only one flight between Detroit Metro and Newark that got him home in time to teach school the next day. This meant that he was in hurry.

Anyway, he was true to his word, he pounded me 150 to 33 in 3 innings (one of his was the opening break.) When he apologized to me he was very kind to me. He told me that he usually played "soft" in student exhibitions because he knew that my friends all came to watch me play The Miz. In this case he did not have time and that he intended to play me like I was the second best player in the world. He had just completed book on pool. He gave me a copy and signed it.

He was also very kind and gave us a brief lesson on playing pool. His observations have stuck with me to this day. I noticed that he took off his glasses to play pool. When I looked through his glasses I could not see anything! When he say back down, I asked him about his glasses and he admitted that he was legally blind at that time (20/200). He then proceeded to explain that eyesight is not as important as most people think to playing top level pool.

To prove his point, he had us set up a spot shot. He put the cue ball in the kitchen. He lined up the shot while he was standing. Then he leaned over, made a bridge, turned his head away, opened his bridge hand, took the cue stick out, returned it to his bridge, and then pulled the trigger and made the ball. He told us to spot it again. He made it again without even bothering to line the shot up again.

Afterwards, he explained that most people miss balls because they do not deliver the cue ball to the spot that they are aiming at. His procedure was to look at the required path of the object ball while he was standing. When the shot permitted it, he would lay his cue stick on the table on the line the cue ball would be traveling. Then he would bend over and make a bridge. This way he was lining his body up with the shot.

He told me that he rarely thought about pocketing the ball during his shot. He was mostly concerned about the speed and the required spin to produce the next position. In his mind pocketing the ball was automatic as long as his body was in the proper position to deliver the cue ball to his aiming spot. This is a lesson that I have kept with me to this day.

I will never forget the day that I met Steve Mizerak. Afterwards, I became a big fan of his and traveled to many straight pool tournament for the chance to watch him play. I once saw him put an opponent on 3 fouls to start a game which he won 150 to minus 18!

 

[worriedbeef]

I played The Miz once in 1972. It was a student exhibition at The University of Michigan. I had never seen a professional pool player at that point and I had no idea what was in store for me. Mr. Mizerak came up to me before the match and introduced himself and then apologized for beating me! We had not played yet. At that time he was a school teacher in New Jersey and apparently there was only one flight between Detroit Metro and Newark that got him home in time to teach school the next day. This meant that he was in hurry.

Anyway, he was true to his word, he pounded me 150 to 33 in 3 innings (one of his was the opening break.) When he apologized to me he was very kind to me. He told me that he usually played "soft" in student exhibitions because he knew that my friends all came to watch me play The Miz. In this case he did not have time and that he intended to play me like I was the second best player in the world. He had just completed book on pool. He gave me a copy and signed it.

He was also very kind and gave us a brief lesson on playing pool. His observations have stuck with me to this day. I noticed that he took off his glasses to play pool. When I looked through his glasses I could not see anything! When he say back down, I asked him about his glasses and he admitted that he was legally blind at that time (20/200). He then proceeded to explain that eyesight is not as important as most people think to playing top level pool.

To prove his point, he had us set up a spot shot. He put the cue ball in the kitchen. He lined up the shot while he was standing. Then he leaned over, made a bridge, turned his head away, opened his bridge hand, took the cue stick out, returned it to his bridge, and then pulled the trigger and made the ball. He told us to spot it again. He made it again without even bothering to line the shot up again.

Afterwards, he explained that most people miss balls because they do not deliver the cue ball to the spot that they are aiming at. His procedure was to look at the required path of the object ball while he was standing. When the shot permitted it, he would lay his cue stick on the table on the line the cue ball would be traveling. Then he would bend over and make a bridge. This way he was lining his body up with the shot.

He told me that he rarely thought about pocketing the ball during his shot. He was mostly concerned about the speed and the required spin to produce the next position. In his mind pocketing the ball was automatic as long as his body was in the proper position to deliver the cue ball to his aiming spot. This is a lesson that I have kept with me to this day.

I will never forget the day that I met Steve Mizerak. Afterwards, I became a big fan of his and traveled to many straight pool tournament for the chance to watch him play. I once saw him put an opponent on 3 fouls to start a game which he won 150 to minus 18!

nice post, and i agree with what he said about eyesight. The only time i think you need a real crystal clear view of the balls to help is on extreme cut shots when you need to focus on the edge of the object ball.

 

[Terry Ardeno]

I am interested in his mental game for purposes of this thread.

I'd like to know how he compares with the other players that are known for a great mental game: Varner & Co.

From what I've seen of his tapes, Miz looks like he has a healthy relationship to the game.

Taking joy in playing as well as thriving in competitive situations.

Oh and his concentration too appeared to have been sick.

Lewdo,
Your initial post in and of itself was a very accurate assessment of him, so you're right on track with your perception of him.

One thing I would like to add is this. The Miz was as humble as anyone who ever lived, when he was not playing or discussing pool! Here are some examples of what I mean.

In the early and mid 1980's, ESPN had Steve doing commentary with Barry Thomkins in the booth. The Miz would diagram a shot before it was actually played by the shooter, and after it was shot, Miz would invariably say something like "Wow, he followed my track exactly. Am I good or what!" After a zillionth time in the tournament that this was said, Thomkins started ignoring it and not even responding with the time honored nervous giggle that often accompanies an awkward situation.
Steve Mizerak took a lot of pride in his standing as one of the very best players who ever lived. His identity switched from being known as a teacher to a pool player. That was who he wanted to be and what he long to be recognized for.

Another example. McCready was shooting and ESPN had a blurb accross the screen that McCready appeared in the "Color of money". A few shots later, Mizerak blurted out to Thomkins "I was in the color of money!" Thomkins made some small talk and the commentary on the match ensued.
But these were telling insights into his head that I never forgot. Who he was was a great pool player and he was justifiably very proud of his achievements without coming off as a guy full of pride, if you understand what I'm trying to say here. He wanted people to know more that he accomplished what he did rather than just being a guy full of pride and needing his ego stroked. I think he wanted the general public to have a respect for his accomplishments, rather than for him as just a person. He seemed self-deprecating at times, but never with his pool achievements.

I think Mizerak took his God given intelligence and channeled it into pool. Mix in a healthy dose of natural talent and add his competitive spirit and you have "The Miz", a great pro who was known more for consistancy than as having a strong mental game. And he never struggled with either.

 

[SteveMizerak]

Here I am!

Miz had a son, Steve Jr., who posted here for only a week, more than a year ago, then dropped from sight. Posts were very interesting and insightful, for example, they discussed Miz's baseball career in the minors.

wondering what happened that he stopped posting....

Just took a sabatical....the baseball career you are speaking of is Steve Sr., my grandfather, not my father. He was encouraged by his father to play baseball but something happened, I believe he injured someone playing somehow, and never wanted to play after that....pool was the way from there.

You can call me Jr. but my father and grandfather were Steve Sr. and Jr., sharing the same middle name, mine is different. I don't think that makes me the 3rd?

Let me read the rest of the post....I didn't think to look outside the one forum.

Thanks
Steve

 

[SteveMizerak]

Another example. McCready was shooting and ESPN had a blurb accross the screen that McCready appeared in the "Color of money". A few shots later, Mizerak blurted out to Thomkins "I was in the color of money!" Thomkins made some small talk and the commentary on the match ensued.
But these were telling insights into his head that I never forgot. Who he was was a great pool player and he was justifiably very proud of his achievements without coming off as a guy full of pride, if you understand what I'm trying to say here. He wanted people to know more that he accomplished what he did rather than just being a guy full of pride and needing his ego stroked. I think he wanted the general public to have a respect for his accomplishments, rather than for him as just a person. He seemed self-deprecating at times, but never with his pool achievements.

Terry,

Since his passing, that was the most accurate description of his life I have read so far, in my opinion.

He was very proud of his achievements. That came from an early age, as my Grandfather was very tough on him growing up and my Grandfather was a very proud person himself. He did want the general public to have a respect for his accomplishments. I think after the Lite Beer spots it bothered him that he was more known for that in the GP than for his pool accomplishments. I also have to say that I think later in life, around that same time (the commerical), until his passing, it became more and more about his ego. Now that I am older and can understand life better I can see the picture clearer. There were many life changing events around that time and I think in many respects he was not the same person he was before that time....I can tell you this from close experience.

He was self-depricating at times and I think that was because something was missing in life after the commerical. It's likely we will never know what it was that he felt was missing but there was something there that frustrated him. Maybe the recognition from the general public was it. Closest thing I can think of so far.

Don't misunderstand this post...I am very proud of his accomplishments, I love to hear the stories and insight from everyone but there is more to the man than his pool game and thank you Terry for bringing "realistic" light to that fact.

I'd love to hear more thoughts.

Thanks
Steve

 

[Southpaw]

Just took a sabatical....the baseball career you are speaking of is Steve Sr., my grandfather, not my father. He was encouraged by his father to play baseball but something happened, I believe he injured someone playing somehow, and never wanted to play after that....pool was the way from there.

You can call me Jr. but my father and grandfather were Steve Sr. and Jr., sharing the same middle name, mine is different. I don't think that makes me the 3rd?

Let me read the rest of the post....I didn't think to look outside the one forum.

Thanks
Steve

Im sure you already know this, but you're father paved the way for American pool as we see it today...televised I mean. I remember when I was about 7 years old the Miller Lite commercial and from that moment on whenver I saw Pool on TV my dad and I would watch it religiously. I never had the chance to meet your father, but everything I have ever read about him or heard about him is how great of a person he was....since I cannot thank him for my early passion for pool, I will thank you. Thanks and God bless.

Southpaw

 

[JimS]

Seems to me that almost any great player could easily feel "let down" by the game in general.

To be the best in the world, and one of the best ever, at such a difficult game, and still enjoy only limited fortune or fame would be disappointing... to say the least.

How many from the general populace have heard of Earl or Buddy, Keith or Luther, Grady or Freddy?

To get on in life and look back over the accomplishments and see that it led to very limited rewards would be difficult to deal with. It if were me I'd be outwardly philosophical about it but on the inside I'd be a little pissed, or hurt.... or something negative.... even though I'd be fully aware that I made my choices it would still seem somehow unfair.

Yeah.... once again I'd have to see that life really is NOT fair True dat!

 

[Gerry]

I played The Miz once in 1972. It was a student exhibition at The University of Michigan. I had never seen a professional pool player at that point and I had no idea what was in store for me. Mr. Mizerak came up to me before the match and introduced himself and then apologized for beating me! We had not played yet. At that time he was a school teacher in New Jersey and apparently there was only one flight between Detroit Metro and Newark that got him home in time to teach school the next day. This meant that he was in hurry.

Anyway, he was true to his word, he pounded me 150 to 33 in 3 innings (one of his was the opening break.) When he apologized to me he was very kind to me. He told me that he usually played "soft" in student exhibitions because he knew that my friends all came to watch me play The Miz. In this case he did not have time and that he intended to play me like I was the second best player in the world. He had just completed book on pool. He gave me a copy and signed it.

He was also very kind and gave us a brief lesson on playing pool. His observations have stuck with me to this day. I noticed that he took off his glasses to play pool. When I looked through his glasses I could not see anything! When he say back down, I asked him about his glasses and he admitted that he was legally blind at that time (20/200). He then proceeded to explain that eyesight is not as important as most people think to playing top level pool.

To prove his point, he had us set up a spot shot. He put the cue ball in the kitchen. He lined up the shot while he was standing. Then he leaned over, made a bridge, turned his head away, opened his bridge hand, took the cue stick out, returned it to his bridge, and then pulled the trigger and made the ball. He told us to spot it again. He made it again without even bothering to line the shot up again.

Afterwards, he explained that most people miss balls because they do not deliver the cue ball to the spot that they are aiming at. His procedure was to look at the required path of the object ball while he was standing. When the shot permitted it, he would lay his cue stick on the table on the line the cue ball would be traveling. Then he would bend over and make a bridge. This way he was lining his body up with the shot.

He told me that he rarely thought about pocketing the ball during his shot. He was mostly concerned about the speed and the required spin to produce the next position. In his mind pocketing the ball was automatic as long as his body was in the proper position to deliver the cue ball to his aiming spot. This is a lesson that I have kept with me to this day.

I will never forget the day that I met Steve Mizerak. Afterwards, I became a big fan of his and traveled to many straight pool tournament for the chance to watch him play. I once saw him put an opponent on 3 fouls to start a game which he won 150 to minus 18!

WOW!....I say that because without ever really putting it down on paper, that is exactly how I play or aim!!! I thought I was just different. I'm also a lefty, and a big 14.1 lover....which made me a natural big Miz fan! His game was powerfully smooth. Sadly, I never got to meet him, but his commentary, instructionals, and match videos taught me a hell of a lot about the game!

Seemed like he would have been a fun guy to be around....

 

[SCCues]

The Miz

http://forums.azbilliards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=49

Thanks for the link. There's some good threads in that link........

James

 

[Terry Ardeno]

Terry,

Since his passing, that was the most accurate description of his life I have read so far, in my opinion.

He was very proud of his achievements. That came from an early age, as my Grandfather was very tough on him growing up and my Grandfather was a very proud person himself. He did want the general public to have a respect for his accomplishments. I think after the Lite Beer spots it bothered him that he was more known for that in the GP than for his pool accomplishments. I also have to say that I think later in life, around that same time (the commerical), until his passing, it became more and more about his ego. Now that I am older and can understand life better I can see the picture clearer. There were many life changing events around that time and I think in many respects he was not the same person he was before that time....I can tell you this from close experience.

He was self-depricating at times and I think that was because something was missing in life after the commerical. It's likely we will never know what it was that he felt was missing but there was something there that frustrated him. Maybe the recognition from the general public was it. Closest thing I can think of so far.

Don't misunderstand this post...I am very proud of his accomplishments, I love to hear the stories and insight from everyone but there is more to the man than his pool game and thank you Terry for bringing "realistic" light to that fact.

I'd love to hear more thoughts.

Thanks
Steve

Steve,
GREAT to have you posting again.
When SJM resumes posting, I'm fairly certain he'll add some great insight into your father & his career, as I believe "The Miz" was one of SJM's favorite players.
We also thank you for sharing your thoughts with us and for keeping your father's life and accomplishments fresh in our minds.

 

[SteveMizerak]

Terry,

No need for me to keep his life and accomplishments fresh in our minds. Everyone here is doing that already.

I should be the one thanking everyone. He was my father but some of those "life changing events" I eluded to in my last post left him a little more distant from his children than you would think. It's a shame to say but in many respects although I have some interesting deep insight everyone here might be able to fill in some of the blanks on everything else.

Thanks again.
Steve

 

[JimS]

Terry,

No need for me to keep his life and accomplishments fresh in our minds. Everyone here is doing that already.

I should be the one thanking everyone. He was my father but some of those "life changing events" I eluded to in my last post left him a little more distant from his children than you would think. It's a shame to say but in many respects although I have some interesting deep insight everyone here might be able to fill in some of the blanks on everything else.

Thanks again.
Steve

My dad's friends knew him in much different ways than I did and I'd have to say they knew him a lot better than I did. There was alwas the father/son thing that kept coming between us. That's instinct. Can't be avoided. Not EVER... I don't think.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

Terry,

Since his passing, that was the most accurate description of his life I have read so far, in my opinion.

He was very proud of his achievements. That came from an early age, as my Grandfather was very tough on him growing up and my Grandfather was a very proud person himself. He did want the general public to have a respect for his accomplishments. I think after the Lite Beer spots it bothered him that he was more known for that in the GP than for his pool accomplishments. I also have to say that I think later in life, around that same time (the commerical), until his passing, it became more and more about his ego. Now that I am older and can understand life better I can see the picture clearer. There were many life changing events around that time and I think in many respects he was not the same person he was before that time....I can tell you this from close experience.

He was self-depricating at times and I think that was because something was missing in life after the commerical. It's likely we will never know what it was that he felt was missing but there was something there that frustrated him. Maybe the recognition from the general public was it. Closest thing I can think of so far.

Don't misunderstand this post...I am very proud of his accomplishments, I love to hear the stories and insight from everyone but there is more to the man than his pool game and thank you Terry for bringing "realistic" light to that fact.

I'd love to hear more thoughts.

Thanks
Steve

Steve:

Good to see you on here! Here's a real quick story with your dad I thought I'd share with you...

Back in the early '90's, I was JUST starting to play pool. I would steal money out of my dad's wallet (I was 13 or 14 at the time, flat broke and a punk) just to ride my bike miles to a local bowling alley that had a few pool tables. I would hang there until my time was up and ride home. Dad learned I was doing this to get better at something... and there are worse things to do, I guess.

At that time, my dad went somewhere in the mid-west for a business trip. After checking into a Holiday Inn (or something like that), he came down to the hotel bar for a beer to relax after a long flight. When he looked around, there were a bunch of pool tables setup in the conference center so he went to check it out. When he entered, he all-but ran into your dad. My dad knows nothing about pool, but he recognized your dad from TV.

My dad says, "Are you Steve Mizerak?"

"Yes I am!" he said enthusiastically.

They started a conversation and before you know it your dad invited my dad to play a game or two. The next thing you know your father invited my dad out to dinner (along with Nick Varner and a bunch of other best-in-the-world players). As they were having dinner, my dad told everyone his son was just starting to play pool, taking money from his office in secret to play... as well as other things young pool players do at that age. Apparently, everyone thought it was entertaining. Steve says, "Bob, I'm gonna make your sons day... check this out...."

Steve took a Camel Pro 9-ball (the one with the camel instead of the "9") and had everyone at the table sign it... and went to a few other players to have them sign it. He had a waiter put it in a plastic bag so it wouldn't smear and gave it to my dad. "Tell your son this is from the Miz."

Well.....

My dad comes home and gives it to me and I look at it....

Steve Mizerak
Rodolfo Luat
Nick Varner
Efren Reyes
Danny Harriman (who I didn't know at the time, but thank god he was on it)
... and a few others.

Needless to say, I sh*t a brick the size of the Empire State Building. It was the best gift in the galaxy as far as I was concerned. My dad felt like a million bucks when I was bouncing off the walls.

Fast forward to today.... I still have that ball on my mantle at home, protected by plastic. ALL BECAUSE YOUR DAD WENT OUT OF HIS WAY FOR A TOTAL STRANGER! I'll never forget that.

Dave