Pool Industry Political Bickering

tonmo

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Anyone else find this "bickering through PR" to be absurd?

After playing casually in college (nearly 20 years ago now) I got the "pool bug" about a year ago, when I got a home table. I started researching, reading, buying DVDs, DVR'ing matches, (I even put up a user-contributed home-video website FWIW, which now runs ads on AZB via Google so PoolVids.com is a supporter! :D) and I began listening to Run Out Radio.

I've listened to every Run Out Radio -- it's a great show -- it's fascinating to listen to Mike and Jerry talk about the state of pool in the US and around the world. As an outsider, at the time I was really surprised and intrigued by how all of these governing agencies conflicted and contradicted each other, and seemingly fell short of their duties in one way or another.

Over the past week or so there have been a number of press releases on the AZB homepage -- one body staking claim to men's rankings, another essentially saying "no it's ours", a player publically denouncing a governing organization, that organization countering the claims -- and all with real heavy rhetoric.

So much drama! Not sure why Press Releases are appropriate; I don't think the fans care to hear it. Let's start with the US -- what are the things these groups are aligned on? That would be more interesting -- it's confusing enough *without* the drama... What are the good things happening that these groups are *not* fighting about??

I guess the observation here is -- it seems there is too much focus on the negative goings-on.
 
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JAM

Professional Railbird
Silver Member
It is sad that pool politics are in the midst, but I must say that I think it is good that AzBilliards website lets us know what's happening, as it pertains to professional pool in the United States. It appears that Philippines is having their share of unrest as well in recent times. :(

On a good note, the league play and recreational shooters seem to be doing well. However, there is a new trend on the horizon of people creating their own pool rooms, right in there own homes. This is an article I just read which was interesting. I wish they had pictures:

Five years ago, Leslie Ann Pilling, an interior designer, helped convert a rarely used 14-foot-by-30-foot formal living room into an upscale pool hall for Farmington Hills residents Nori and Mark Klar. They own Warren Prescriptions, a pharmacy and high-end gift shop.

Mark Klar wanted a pool table so their sons' friends would hang out. Nori Klar wanted a functional room they would use more often.

"I love being in here," Nori Klar says. "The colors and the feel of the room make it very relaxing."

LIKE A CLUB: Ever since billiard tables started making their way from pool halls into private homes, they've become prettier -- and more functional. Felts are available in more colors than traditional green, and a pool-table top can be covered for dining or adjusted to add table tennis or air hockey games.

This billiard room features a custom-made antique oak table with taupe felt, a gray tile floor, a French antique light fixture, floor-to-ceiling draperies and six Baker chairs covered in green ultrasuede. Custom cherry wood leaves can convert the billiard table into a dining area for more than a dozen guests.

"I created a very classy billiard room with a custom table," Pilling says. "The space feels like one walked into a club in New York versus someone's basement to shoot pool."

WANT IT? An off-the-shelf pool room might cost $15,000 for the same-size room. Custom-designed billiard rooms can cost up to $75,000. For more information, go to www.leslieannpillingdesign.com or call 248-723-9770.


JAM
 

JAM

Professional Railbird
Silver Member
Here's a black-and-white picture of a dining room which has been converted to a pool room. Notice the drop pockets underneath the table cloth! :D

JAM
 

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ironman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
tonmo said:
Anyone else find this "bickering through PR" to be absurd?

After playing casually in college (nearly 20 years ago now) I got the "pool bug" about a year ago, when I got a home table. I started researching, reading, buying DVDs, DVR'ing matches, (I even put up a user-contributed home-video website FWIW, which now runs ads on AZB via Google so PoolVids.com is a supporter! :D) and I began listening to Run Out Radio.

I've listened to every Run Out Radio -- it's a great show -- it's fascinating to listen to Mike and Jerry talk about the state of pool in the US and around the world. As an outsider, at the time I was really surprised and intrigued by how all of these governing agencies conflicted and contradicted each other, and seemingly fell short of their duties in one way or another.

Over the past week or so there have been a number of press releases on the AZB homepage -- one body staking claim to men's rankings, another essentially saying "no it's ours", a player publically denouncing a governing organization, that organization countering the claims -- and all with real heavy rhetoric.

So much drama! Not sure why Press Releases are appropriate; I don't think the fans care to hear it. Let's start with the US -- what are the things these groups are aligned on? That would be more interesting -- it's confusing enough *without* the drama... What are the good things happening that these groups are *not* fighting about??

I guess the observation here is -- it seems there is too much focus on the negative goings-on.

I don't understandd why the press releases either. Don't talk, just collect the money and keep quiet. They would all be far more respected without any attention.
 

Blackjack

Illuminati Blacksmack
Silver Member
tonmo said:
Anyone else find this "bickering through PR" to be absurd?

After playing casually in college (nearly 20 years ago now) I got the "pool bug" about a year ago, when I got a home table. I started researching, reading, buying DVDs, DVR'ing matches, (I even put up a user-contributed home-video website FWIW, which now runs ads on AZB via Google so PoolVids.com is a supporter! :D) and I began listening to Run Out Radio.

I've listened to every Run Out Radio -- it's a great show -- it's fascinating to listen to Mike and Jerry talk about the state of pool in the US and around the world. As an outsider, at the time I was really surprised and intrigued by how all of these governing agencies conflicted and contradicted each other, and seemingly fell short of their duties in one way or another.

Over the past week or so there have been a number of press releases on the AZB homepage -- one body staking claim to men's rankings, another essentially saying "no it's ours", a player publically denouncing a governing organization, that organization countering the claims -- and all with real heavy rhetoric.

So much drama! Not sure why Press Releases are appropriate; I don't think the fans care to hear it. Let's start with the US -- what are the things these groups are aligned on? That would be more interesting -- it's confusing enough *without* the drama... What are the good things happening that these groups are *not* fighting about??

I guess the observation here is -- it seems there is too much focus on the negative goings-on.

I don't think it is focusing on the negative - it is focusing on what needs to be changed and why.

In short, what you are witnessing is a revolution within the billiard world that has been a long time coming. Most of what you are reading will have a profound impact on other areas of our industry. You will see power struggles, you will all out wars, but in the end, some of these "evil empires" will crumble and fall. That's a good thing - even for you!

Myself and others, such as JAM, Jay Helfert, Mike Janis, we have all been watching and waiting for quite a while. I think we all agree that this is one of the most exciting periods in pool history. So much is happening. So much is going on. There is that level of uncertainty, there is vision and hope with many of us to see something good come out of all of this.

For this to be seen to the end, there have to be some rounds fired. There will be casualties. There will be endless press releases, some right on target, some filled with utter bullshit. Sooner or later, the right people will start to see the amount of press that is being generated within our game. Hopefully by then we'll have our chit together.
 

ironman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Blackjack said:
I don't think it is focusing on the negative - it is focusing on what needs to be changed and why.

In short, what you are witnessing is a revolution within the billiard world that has been a long time coming. Most of what you are reading will have a profound impact on other areas of our industry. You will see power struggles, you will all out wars, but in the end, some of these "evil empires" will crumble and fall. That's a good thing - even for you!

Myself and others, such as JAM, Jay Helfert, Mike Janis, we have all been watching and waiting for quite a while. I think we all agree that this is one of the most exciting periods in pool history. So much is happening. So much is going on. There is that level of uncertainty, there is vision and hope with many of us to see something good come out of all of this.

For this to be seen to the end, there have to be some rounds fired. There will be casualties. There will be endless press releases, some right on target, some filled with utter bullshit. Sooner or later, the right people will start to see the amount of press that is being generated within our game. Hopefully by then we'll have our chit together.

The bullshit won't hurt. Everyone is well conditioned for that. It ususally doesn't come out until one or the other opens their mouths.
 

Str8PoolMan

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Wellllll, doggies!

JAM said:
Here's a black-and-white picture of a dining room which has been converted to a pool room. Notice the drop pockets underneath the table cloth! :D

JAM

Turns out, the Beverly Hillbillies were right. It really is a "fancy eatin' table"!
 

tonmo

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Blackjack said:
I don't think it is focusing on the negative - it is focusing on what needs to be changed and why.

In short, what you are witnessing is a revolution within the billiard world that has been a long time coming. Most of what you are reading will have a profound impact on other areas of our industry. You will see power struggles, you will all out wars, but in the end, some of these "evil empires" will crumble and fall. That's a good thing - even for you!

Myself and others, such as JAM, Jay Helfert, Mike Janis, we have all been watching and waiting for quite a while. I think we all agree that this is one of the most exciting periods in pool history. So much is happening. So much is going on. There is that level of uncertainty, there is vision and hope with many of us to see something good come out of all of this.

For this to be seen to the end, there have to be some rounds fired. There will be casualties. There will be endless press releases, some right on target, some filled with utter bullshit. Sooner or later, the right people will start to see the amount of press that is being generated within our game. Hopefully by then we'll have our chit together.
Thanks, well-stated -- I agree with all that. I suppose it would be hard to argue, though, that for the past week in particular, there has been a lot of public tumult. After a while, it seems absurd (to me anyway), especially by way of front-page press releases filled with disdain. Suffice it to say that a lot needs to be settled before the Brave New World is established (which I agree will be a good thing -- it's gotta be better than this!)....

But I agree with all you say about the significance of this movement and the good it will ultimately bring -- hopefully sooner than later.
 

bandido

Player Power!
Silver Member
Here's an opinion, on the Efren Reyes-Yen Makabenta recent AzB front page articles, posted in matchroom sports forums.

Quote Sputnik:

Not to worry, even the Democrats in the USA have the same problem. Many Democrats say Hillary's quitting from the race is long over-due and further campaigns risk damage to Obama in the ultimate fight against Republicans. Philippine pool players will have one Pro governing body in time. Perhaps very soon, one will emerge because the other will have to cut its losses.

In the last Hillary-like stand of Makabenta, he scorned at Efren Bata saying that Efren did not have the decency to respect him when he (Makabenta) used to feature Bata in many press releases during the time when Efren was still unknown. And Makabenta did not earn a cent from it, according to the statement.

If well thought-out, Efren was the one who helped Makabenta keep his job by allowing himself to be written about. That statement also suggests that Makabenta normally asks money from those people whom he chooses to feature and Efren was spared from paying:

"Documentary records will show, and witnesses can attest, that I championed as a magazine editor, journalist and billiards patron his career as a player in all those years when no manager and no sponsor would recognize him as the real Filipino pool champion. And I did not take or make a single cent off him for my efforts."

Excellent Journalism ethics! All those years, Makabenta had the chance to earn Efren's respect but apparently, he did not. Makabenta is trying to bring Efren down because of Efren's well-deserved loyalty to Putch Puyat. Makabenta claims that Efren is merely being used by BMPAP when it is he who clearly is using the Champ in the desperation to hang on to whatever there is still to hang on to.

Nevertheless, even if it is quite a pathetic statement, it's something to reflect on.

Think about this: among millions of world fans, how many love Efren and place him up there as their idol? Yet one among probably only half a percent of the entire pool world has issues with Efren. Makabenta has been hitting Efren in desperation while the rest of the millions love Efren. That statement clearly shows who has issues within himself. Definitely not the best pool player who ever set foot on this planet - with the humblest of demeanors one can ever find from a world-class star.

Mabuhay ka Bata! You are more intelligent that how Makabenta portrays you as an idiot who allows yourself to be used.

This politicking will have to end soon. Even national icons are being defaced.
 

bandido

Player Power!
Silver Member
Follow-up opinion from Sputnik as posted in Matchroom

Quote Sputnik:

I just can't get over that statement of Makabenta.

"And I did not take or make a single cent off him for my efforts"

So how much does he usually make on the people he champions?!!! Five thousand pesos per article? Ten thousand? Geez, it is just scandalously unbecoming of an editor to come up with that kind of a public admission! This is supposedly from the "Man of the Year" griping that Efren did not give him due respect for free-bee articles that he earmarks as a personal debt in featuring Efren in his writings! This is from a person who is fighting out his position to lead "the governance and direction of billiard sports in our country"!

"I am saddened to see Efren being used -- and allowing himself to be used -- as an instrument to blacken the name of someone who personally helped him rise to the top of Philippine billiards."

Shame on you Makabenta. Efren did not need your help in becoming arguably the best pool player who ever lived - more so the best pool player in the country. Efren is far more noble than you are. Efren is too big for you to even touch with your small journalism even if you edit a statement like that for five thousand times. I would now think that Efren is far more intelligent than you are. As far as I know, Efren never ever publicly implicated himself in any unethical "sin" in trying to earn respect by putting down others. Dragging Efren with you is true to the BSCP habit of shooting your foot with your own pistol. You are the one allowing yourself to be used by your brand of journalism and by your crab mentality. Efren is his own man, and with loyalty, dignity, humility and honor. You? You are far from what Efren is even in ten of your lifetimes... even if you get "Man of the Year" for ten successive years you would not even get near to measuring to an Alex Pagulayan whom you castigated and removed from a tournament that officially welcomed him back as an ambassador of the sport. Go ahead and hit more of our beloved players. Who's the next world champion that you are going to take a cheap shot at? Django? Gomez? Orcullo? Alcano?

"Ferreting out the truth will serve as a cleansing process for Philippine pool. It will make our sport and our billiards community stronger. And we at the BSCP and Raya Sports welcome it."

Big words - truth, cleansing process. How much for it?

I'm sorry Makabenta ("makabenta" in english means "to be able to sell"). I can never get used to feeling Efren's greatness every time I am beside him. I am an avid fan of Efren Bata, and you offended me big time. I do hope that you get out of the Philippine pool scene soon.

This is by far my strongest post in this forum.
 

bandido

Player Power!
Silver Member
The political infommercial barrage that is printed here in AzB is nothing compared to what we, here in the Philippines, have to endure through their, BSCP/RAYA/PBDF/Star text messaging propaganda. These messages get personnal and nasty!

I'm with BlackJack though, I'd rather know of what goes on than not. I'd rather be actively helping the sport than just talking about it or shunning news and info about it. And yes this is the turning point and can even be the shot fired to finally cause the revolution needed to wake up our sport. This movement need to spread worldwide if we desire the changes to transpire and we cannot achieve these changes if we are just to sit back and complain about the revolution that's happening.

The current leadership or non-leadership, as in the case of worldwide professional pool, has had its chance to implement their ideas. Well we see/saw/living in the results of their ideas maybe its time that the new blood with new ideas take over the reins. Thank you for showing us all the mistakes to avoid.
 
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av84fun

Banned
JAM said:
Here's a black-and-white picture of a dining room which has been converted to a pool room. Notice the drop pockets underneath the table cloth! :D

JAM

Looks like a pool room converted to a dining room to me!!!

Kinda sums up the current state of affairs doesn't it!

(-:
 

av84fun

Banned
tonmo said:
Anyone else find this "bickering through PR" to be absurd? After playing casually in college (nearly 20 years ago now) I got the "pool bug" about a year ago, when I got a home table. I started researching, reading, buying DVDs, DVR'ing matches, (I even put up a user-contributed home-video website FWIW, which now runs ads on AZB via Google so PoolVids.com is a supporter! :D) and I began listening to Run Out Radio.

I've listened to every Run Out Radio -- it's a great show -- it's fascinating to listen to Mike and Jerry talk about the state of pool in the US and around the world. As an outsider, at the time I was really surprised and intrigued by how all of these governing agencies conflicted and contradicted each other, and seemingly fell short of their duties in one way or another.

Over the past week or so there have been a number of press releases on the AZB homepage -- one body staking claim to men's rankings, another essentially saying "no it's ours", a player publically denouncing a governing organization, that organization countering the claims -- and all with real heavy rhetoric.

So much drama! Not sure why Press Releases are appropriate; I don't think the fans care to hear it. Let's start with the US -- what are the things these groups are aligned on? That would be more interesting -- it's confusing enough *without* the drama... What are the good things happening that these groups are *not* fighting about??

I guess the observation here is -- it seems there is too much focus on the negative goings-on.

Not absurd really. Many industries go through phases of something between dislocation and chaos. Pro pool in the U.S. is in a rather chaotic state right now which certainly is frustrating in many ways...but interesting in others.

With the help of AZ, we get almost immediate and broad based insights into what's going on...and not going on...so it's sort of like watching an experiment as it is being conducted.

Admittedly, though I am much happier being a spectator than a participant!

It will all shake out one way or the other...because there will always be a "pro tour" of SOME sort...even if by "tour" we just get back to the day when gambling and/or hustling was about the only way to make any serious money.

Regards,
Jim
 

bandido

Player Power!
Silver Member
Originally posted by decafblack in matchroomsportforums
[br]BTW, i also noticed that in all this discussion, nobody has posted the full statement by makabenta. I came across this in a blog which carried the efren story. pasting it here:

A Sad Misuse of a Pool Legend


Statement of Yen Makabenta
BSCP Chairman
9 May 2008

It is fortunate that the Philippine Senate will be conducting its inquiry very soon because it will finally bring out the truth about the billiards situation in our country, and throw light on the shadowy practices and sinister forces that are tarnishing our sport and endangering its future.

Ferreting out the truth will serve as a cleansing process for Philippine pool. It will make our sport and our billiards community stronger. And we at the BSCP and Raya Sports welcome it.

This article could've been dissected and contradicted at each and every sentence but its conclusion already did it in.

The Senate inquiry is very much welcome to the BMPAP. This inquiry too should have already occured since to the Senate this is a no-brainer. How can "GAB vs BSCP" need much thought and deliberation? The truth is clear and smacks you in the face. GAB is an INCOME-GENERATING GOVERNMENT AGENCY while BSCP is a Private Entity AFFILIATED with a government agency,PSC & POC, as an NSA (a liability).

GAB pours in money to government coffers while BSCP takes money from government!

Secondly, how can the signatory senators stand for such a complaint?
Should they risk principle or constituent following knowing the above points stated and that BMPAP fully backs the GAB. Sen. Lito Lapid is from where, Pampanga, Efren is from, right? How about Senator Enrile who Yen wrote a book for? Hey Yen, this Senator already returned the favor for that book so many times over now. NoyNoy? He got stung when he did you a favor remember? He called the GAB for you only to be shocked and embarassed after finding out that the problem was that you refused to pay the 800 Pesos/day permit fee for your event! And Senator Lacson? I don't think he'll put his career on the line for somebody who just invites him to parties (am being nice here so be careful when you reply to this).

From what I've heard, these Senators too have been made aware of the organizational structure and composition of the entities involved namely GAB, BMPAP, BSCP, RAYA, PBDF and Star. GAB, well, it's a government agency, just that, nevermind that it's directly under the Office of the President of the Republic. Nevermind that the GAB Chair is the son-in-law of the Executive Secretary of this country.

Looking too at the organizational compositions of BMPAP vs RAYA (and its branch the BSCP) PBDF and Star. BMPAP has 4 legitimate Billionaires, yes that's with a "B", in their membership. 5 if you count the recent one who just jumped on board, Senator Villar who is the published richest Senator. What does RAYA and its branch BSCP, PBDF and Star have? Any LEGITIMATE Billionaire?

Just goes to prove that BMPAP doesn't need the peanuts that pool events can, if these events could, generate unlike Yen who stated that he can make millions in pool. Yen, Ernie, Tony, JP... you also have laid down and used up all your cards and can't use some other for knowledge that they've been equalized. The BMPAP has not even laid down a card.

Pondering on the above, who really helps/has the capacity to help promote Pool here and takes care of its participants? The reality is, our BMPAP members are the ones who've been promoting the sport and helping its participants for DECADES now!
 
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