Statement from The Legends of Pocket Billiards

garczar

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
We’ve got a 10 foot table with 4 1/4 inch pockets, 143° angles in our room – brutally tough table. I’ve thought about offering a challenge for any player to put up $10k and have a week, 7 days, 12 hours a day maximum, to try to run 20 consecutive 14.1 racks – 280 balls, in which case I would pay out $10k, so it would be even odds.

To me, on this table, that would be harder to accomplish than the 714 run by Jason on that table.
Why so tough? Can't be much fun.
 

fjk

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well, then, I'll continue to the next logical sentence from your statement, better players prefer tighter pockets because, to them, it makes the game more pure, less slop, more skill, which, then ,logically is just saying that the tighter pocket is one factor that makes the better player a favorite. Unless someone has a different definition of what makes a player "better" than another player.
I know I'm going against conventional wisdom but here's a couple of points to think about:

You're playing Jason Shaw. He's spotting you 200 to 50 (huge spot). Who's likely going to be at the table more to take advantage of loose pocket? Who's ever at the table more has the greater advantage, right?

Second scenerio - you need to play Shane a race to 9 even. Would you feel you would have a better chance playing on a snooker table? I think the answer would be yes.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Why so tough? Can't be much fun.
To quote a line from a movie, Jim Carry in Liar Liar, he's in the bathroom beating his head, body, arms and legs to death....guy walks in, sees that going on, and asks, "What are you doing"????

Jim replies, "I'M KICKING MY ASS, WHAT'S IT LOOK LIKE"!!!!
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
I know I'm going against conventional wisdom but here's a couple of points to think about:

You're playing Jason Shaw. He's spotting you 200 to 50 (huge spot). Who's likely going to be at the table more to take advantage of loose pocket? Who's ever at the table more has the greater advantage, right?

Second scenerio - you need to play Shane a race to 9 even. Would you feel you would have a better chance playing on a snooker table? I think the answer would be yes.
Typical, you don't know how to match up with someone playing 14.1 that can run 714 balls😅🤣😂 getting 175 balls going to 200 you might just be pulling your money out and throwing it on the table if the bets high enough.

I'd play Jayson 14.1 race to a 100 for a $100 a game if the spot was right😅🤣😂

This is how you play a high ball runner 14.1 he plays 7 balls and stops, I play 10 balls and stop. Then its down to who wins the safety battles, not who can run a 100 and out😉
 

Dead Money

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
I watched an earlier rack on another run where he had maybe 5 balls in the spot area that only needed one or two balls cleared but he ignored that and went another way. I forget what he did but he got out of that rack anyway. I'd like to see the winning run - especially the epiphany and transition. Genius in action.
He improved a lot in a short period...as if he had relearned or finally unpacked his 14.1 brain-mindset! The change in and his improvement in his "end game" each rack over his time there was the biggest change I noticed. That along with getting comfortable on the table led to a pretty epic finishing performance. Not to mention he had been hot leading up to this anyway and is a bulldog with a lot of fight in him. Amazing.
 

Dead Money

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
Typical, you don't know how to match up with someone playing 14.1 that can run 714 balls😅🤣😂 getting 175 balls going to 200 you might just be pulling your money out and throwing it on the table if the bets high enough.

I'd play Jayson 14.1 race to a 100 for a $100 a game if the spot was right😅🤣😂

This is how you play a high ball runner 14.1 he plays 7 balls and stops, I play 10 balls and stop. Then its down to who wins the safety battles, not who can run a 100 and out😉
I would do it for sport even up as a "thank you" for the great show he put on this week. I might ask for the first shot however! o_O
 

Dead Money

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
What do you want to bet its the same distance for a runner to run the bases requardless of which Professional base all field they're playing at? Just saying....
No bet-standard is 90 feet though some guys go so fast they are covering more than 90 feet between each base! :eek: o_O 🤣
 

Shuddy

Diamond Dave’s babysitter
Silver Member
Some may find this surprising, given that I’ve written so many posts about Legends not being obliged to share any details of their table with us, and that whatever standards the BCA apply are all that matter, but I think all pocket ball games should be played on a maximum of 4.25” pockets with a defined pocket angle +/-1 degree, including straight pool high runs. Talk of table variety across the world, amateur vs pro is silly. Any professional event or world record run can meet defined standards if they wish to be considered professional.
 

Shuddy

Diamond Dave’s babysitter
Silver Member
I didn't! Maybe, being a 3C player, I'll set up a 3C table and try to break the high-run record, (in practice) on a 5'x10' table of 32 consecutive points! If the MONEY is RIGHT!
Sure, find someone to pay you, I don’t care or need to know how much, and I’d love to see a 32+ 3C run. I’d probably pay you 10 bucks for a digital copy.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Some may find this surprising, given that I’ve written so many posts about Legends not being obliged to share any details of their table with us, and that whatever standards the BCA apply are all that matter, but I think all pocket ball games should be played on a maximum of 4.25” pockets with a defined pocket angle +/-1 degree, including straight pool high runs. Talk of table variety across the world, amateur vs pro is silly. Any professional event or world record run can meet defined standards if they wish to be considered professional.
4 1/4" pockets will send 95% of the amateurs packing, and without them, there is no sport of pool.
 

Shuddy

Diamond Dave’s babysitter
Silver Member
4 1/4" pockets will send 95% of the amateurs packing, and without them, there is no sport of pool.
Yeah, I guess. I was more thinking about pro events, etc. Regular snooker clubs usually have tables with pockets more generous than pro tables, but they’ll have a couple of tables that meet pro requirements. Once players start considering turning pro or at least trying to qualify, they seek out venues that allow them to practice on pro equipment.

This is probably the path pro rotation events will take as Matchroom begins to dictate the professional side of the sport.

Also, as it goes in the gaming world, “Get GUD!!!”
 

fjk

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
4 1/4" pockets will send 95% of the amateurs packing, and without them, there is no sport of pool.
From a spectator perspective, I think the pros should have the pockets tightened until they miss an average of once a rack. I want to watch them take chances for tight position. I want to be able to see the difference between the best player and 200th best player. There's nothing more boring than watching a top pro run an open rack of 9 ball. Slow the cloth way down too so I can see them let their best stroke out to move whitey around the table. I want to be impressed with a 2 pack.
 

Shuddy

Diamond Dave’s babysitter
Silver Member
From a spectator perspective, I think the pros should have the pockets tightened until they miss an average of once a rack. I want to watch them take chances for tight position. I want to be able to see the difference between the best player and 200th best player. There's nothing more boring than watching a top pro run an open rack of 9 ball. Slow the cloth way down too so I can see them let their best stroke out to move whitey around the table. I want to be impressed with a 2 pack.
Yeah, though not so sure about the cloth :)

I find it kind of amusing for years the solution to stopping people running 8 packs was to try 300 different variations of break rules and racking locations, when tightening the pockets would be a step towards making everything more challenging, including the break.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
From a spectator perspective, I think the pros should have the pockets tightened until they miss an average of once a rack. I want to watch them take chances for tight position. I want to be able to see the difference between the best player and 200th best player. There's nothing more boring than watching a top pro run an open rack of 9 ball. Slow the cloth way down too so I can see them let their best stroke out to move whitey around the table. I want to be impressed with a 2 pack.
You want separation between Pros, then make the matches longer races to 21.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Yeah, though not so sure about the cloth :)

I find it kind of amusing for years the solution to stopping people running 8 packs was to try 300 different variations of break rules and racking locations, when tightening the pockets would be a step towards making everything more challenging, including the break.
Make it harder for the pros to play, with tighter pockets, kiss the viewers goodbye!
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
From a spectator perspective, I think the pros should have the pockets tightened until they miss an average of once a rack. I want to watch them take chances for tight position. I want to be able to see the difference between the best player and 200th best player. There's nothing more boring than watching a top pro run an open rack of 9 ball. Slow the cloth way down too so I can see them let their best stroke out to move whitey around the table. I want to be impressed with a 2 pack.
When TAR streaming switched the rails on the 9ft ProAm to 4 1/8" pockets, they LOST the paying viewers, think about that. TAR shut down not long after that.
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
Yeah, though not so sure about the cloth :)

I find it kind of amusing for years the solution to stopping people running 8 packs was to try 300 different variations of break rules and racking locations, when tightening the pockets would be a step towards making everything more challenging, including the break.
You don't need to tighten the pockets to put more pressure on the Pros, just raise the prize money payouts and they'll be playing a lot more serious!!!
 

realkingcobra

Well-known member
Silver Member
From a spectator perspective, I think the pros should have the pockets tightened until they miss an average of once a rack. I want to watch them take chances for tight position. I want to be able to see the difference between the best player and 200th best player. There's nothing more boring than watching a top pro run an open rack of 9 ball. Slow the cloth way down too so I can see them let their best stroke out to move whitey around the table. I want to be impressed with a 2 pack.
Now that i think about it, this industry has tightened the pocket up from 5" to 4 1/2" Because of Diamond making that move, Brunswick followed with the GC5 tournament edition. So let me ask you, how has the tighter pockets helped pool out over the last 20+ years? Has pool gotten better? Or have MORE 9fts disappeared from pool rooms around the country, only to be replaced with 7fts!! You people beating the drums daily for tighter pockets won't have any DAMN 9FTS LEFT before long, all replaced by 7fts. Whats next, 7fts with stupid damn 4" pockets to make you happy?????
 
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