Steve Davis' future in nine ball

sniper

AzB Silver Member
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Tonight I had the pleasure to watch the Mosconi Cup start to finish and payed specific attention to Steve Davis' performance. To say I was saddened by the way he played would be a harsh understatement, this six time world snooker champion, and still a fine snooker player might I add has lost the ability to play pool at the same level we saw from him say 3 or 4 years ago. He consistently makes simple mistakes, fails to get out, and most importantly his break hasn't improved much if any since he started, his safety play is still superb which is great in snooker but in nine ball it's not enough to compete with the likes of Wu, Hohmann, Archer, etc.

He was very lucky to advance past the group stages at the WPC, I actually don't think he's ever won a nine ball tournament IIRC which makes him very overrated IMO. He has already confirmed he won't be playing in this years Mosconi Cup due to a conflicting snooker tournament. I hope he goes out and proves me wrong, he'll get his chance right away at the upcoming WPM but after watching his performances in his last few tournaments I don't see him having much success in the world of nine ball pool.

What does everyone else think? Does anyone think he'll win a tournament or maybe even a world championship?
 

LastTwo

AzB Silver Member
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Snooker players have never been able to make successful transitions to 9-ball, the game requires a different stroke.
 

Bob Jewett

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LastTwo said:
Snooker players have never been able to make successful transitions to 9-ball, the game requires a different stroke.
Having watched Davis come back from 2-8 down against Efren going to 9 in the WPC, I'd say that his stroke is fine for nine ball. Are there any particular shots that you feel require a "nine ball" stroke? How does that stroke differ, in practical terms?
 

LastTwo

AzB Silver Member
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Bob Jewett said:
Having watched Davis come back from 2-8 down against Efren going to 9 in the WPC, I'd say that his stroke is fine for nine ball. Are there any particular shots that you feel require a "nine ball" stroke? How does that stroke differ, in practical terms?

A stroke that can spin the ball around the table. He doesn't use much sidespin like all snooker players, and when they do it's like 1/2 a tip. Snooker players have powerful centerball strokes but I don't think they are that great at using sidespin like top 9-ball players.
 

predator

AzB Silver Member
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LastTwo said:
A stroke that can spin the ball around the table. He doesn't use much sidespin like all snooker players, and when they do it's like 1/2 a tip. Snooker players have powerful centerball strokes but I don't think they are that great at using sidespin like top 9-ball players.

It seems you're talking about spin/speed control, not one's (in)ability to spin the ball.
 

Boro Nut

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sniper said:
this six time world snooker champion, and still a fine snooker player might I add has lost the ability to play pool at the same level we saw from him say 3 or 4 years ago.

You want to see him play snooker. I can't believe you came up with the nickname Romford Slim. The Shadow would have been more appropriate. On the plus side his commentating is coming along nicely.

Boro Nut
 

LastTwo

AzB Silver Member
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predator said:
It seems you're talking about spin/speed control, not one's (in)ability to spin the ball.

The ability to use alot of sidespin and still make the ball.
 

Hal

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LastTwo said:
Snooker players have never been able to make successful transitions to 9-ball, the game requires a different stroke.
Allison Fisher might have somethig to say about that.
 

LastTwo

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Hal said:
Allison Fisher might have somethig to say about that.

You are right, I was thinking of male players and Allison and Karen didn't even cross my mind. The level of play on the men's tour is much higher than the women's, which is probably why I forgot to think of them. Don't get me wrong, the women play great but I'm just stating common knowledge about the difference in level of play.
 

kenl

New member
Alex Pagulayan and Marlon Manalo are two top players who have played snooker competitively before. The reason that not many top snooker players would even consider making a transition to pool is the big difference in the prize money. Age is catching up with Steve Davis, in fact I think he switched to pool in his late thirties/early forties?
 

Colin Colenso

<-- My Kids
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sniper said:
What does everyone else think? Does anyone think he'll win a tournament or maybe even a world championship?

Steve would need to get very lucky to win a pool event. His style is not even suited to the game, but he can still put up a good show due to his years of experience in front of the cameras and his solid cueing. But he makes the game look harder than it should be for someone of his cueing skills. He just lacks experience, and frankly there are many better potters than him.

If we see 8-ball events worth 1 million and they open this up to UK players you could well see a flood new players who are semi-pro level in snooker and with strong experience in English 8 ball that could make the conversion to the game quite quickly.

Tony Drago won the World Pool Masters and was a semi-finalist in the WPC and anyone who watches him can see has has little idea about how to play 9-ball. He says he practices a bit, but it must be like a hobby to him. He and 100 snooker players like him would be a chance to win the WPC playing the game as their second sport.
 
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bruin70

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Hal said:
Allison Fisher might have somethig to say about that.

the disparaty between fisher/korr and the US women is HUGE,,,and good enough to trounce anyone in the wpba without a thought given to altering their game. this is not the case on the men's side.
 

sniper

AzB Silver Member
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Bob Jewett said:
Are there any particular shots that you feel require a "nine ball" stroke?


The BREAK shot and the JUMP shot come to mind. Jumping is illegal in snooker and it doesn't require a powerful break like in nine ball.
 
F

Fred Agnir

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Bob Jewett said:
Having watched Davis come back from 2-8 down against Efren going to 9 in the WPC, I'd say that his stroke is fine for nine ball. Are there any particular shots that you feel require a "nine ball" stroke? How does that stroke differ, in practical terms?

The power shots, Bob. Anyone can run tables when the balls lay runable. But, in 9-ball, there are many times when you have to come with the power shots. And unless you've honed your stroke for power shots, it will not be a pleasant result.

In the previously-mentionied early World Team Championships, it was clear where the difference was between the European Players vs. the Filipinos/American/Puerto Rican teams: the power shots. They came up over and over, and the Europeans (especially the snooker contingent) simply couldn't execute them. Today, most of the cross-over players who do very well at 9-ball can execute power strokes.

Fred
 

Colin Colenso

<-- My Kids
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Fred Agnir said:
The power shots, Bob. Anyone can run tables when the balls lay runable. But, in 9-ball, there are many times when you have to come with the power shots. And unless you've honed your stroke for power shots, it will not be a pleasant result.

In the previously-mentionied early World Team Championships, it was clear where the difference was between the European Players vs. the Filipinos/American/Puerto Rican teams: the power shots. They came up over and over, and the Europeans (especially the snooker contingent) simply couldn't execute them. Today, most of the cross-over players who do very well at 9-ball can execute power strokes.

Fred
Steve certainly isn't known for lairing up as we say. He rarely loads up with side and looks uncomfortable when he has to slam a ball. This is true for a lot of snooker players who can become very careful in their play, but there are some who excel at power shots and loading up with side. Players like O'Sullivan, Williams and Drago come to mind.

I do think these big shots can make a big difference in sorting the players at the top level.
 

TheOne

www.MetroPool.club
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Colin Colenso said:
Steve certainly isn't known for lairing up as we say. He rarely loads up with side and looks uncomfortable when he has to slam a ball. This is true for a lot of snooker players who can become very careful in their play, but there are some who excel at power shots and loading up with side. Players like O'Sullivan, Williams and Drago come to mind.

I do think these big shots can make a big difference in sorting the players at the top level.

Apart from the break I would say the deep screw (draw) shot and breaking into the reds off the blue, or more off the black require much more power than any other shot I can think of in 9 ball? For one thing the tables are bigger and 9 ball napless clothes are probably quicker under tournmanet conditions, maybe. As for snooker players rarely using side, not sure where that came from? Isn't it called "English" in America?

I saw some shots that he made in the WPC that where still fabulous technique and many of the top pool players would have struggled to make or played differently. Still he seems to make the simple look hard and the hard look difficult. This probably means he's thinking too much and just doesn't have the knowledge that some of the pool players have.

BTW
Considering Earl is supposed to be one of the greatest shot makers in pool it was sad to see him miss so many easy balls on the tight pockets.
 
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Fred Agnir

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whitewolf said:
I totally disagree with you on this. Totally.

Since you know next to nothing about actually playing this game, and have been proven wrong on virtually every one of your asinine opinions and posts, why do you bother? Maybe for once, you should simply STFU and let the experience players actually post. And "experience" means that we've actually been there and done that, away from their little pond. Swim away, little fish.

Fred
 

sniper

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
TheOne said:
BTW
Considering Earl is supposed to be one of the greatest shot makers in pool it was sad to see him miss so many easy balls on the tight pockets.


I was amazed at how much the Americans missed on the tighter pockets at the WPC. I guess that's what happens when your used to playing on tables with buckets for pockets. In his group match vs Chang Pei-Wei Gabe Owen missed 3-4 balls and scratched 3 times on top of that, they weren't terribly difficult shots definitely shots that a player of Gabe's calibre should make no problem. Amazingly, I believe Gabe actually went on to win this match.
 
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