US DPEN Time for a little Clarity

cuedoctor

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You guys are funny and a little aggravating as well. Last time for this - There is $75,000 in added money going into the purse, regardless of how many players enter. This has nothing to do with the entry fee money. The free entries are just that - FREE! All paid entry money also goes into the purse. If all the freebies show up and we fill the field, the purse should be $188,000, with $40,000 on top.

We are doing our level best to make this a great event once again, so all the knocking is not appreciated. A little support for me and Pat would be nice to hear. We are the ones putting our necks out for the Open this year. If this doesn't work and the event flops, I don't look for their to be a 41st U.S.Open. Carry on

Thanks Jay
What people don't realize is that all these haters and negative threads drive people away no matter how good it could be. The money the players put up do not decide if the show will go on or be successful it's the vendors and fans who show up or buy the steam that will make or break this show. Sure Barry has screwed things up but for over 35 years he put on a good tournament and between the hurricane ,911,and our economy tanking it's been a miracle he has even had a tournament. The make or break on this tournament depends on our support.
 

watchez

What time is it?
Silver Member
Ok so if I am now understanding from Jay's post

$75,000 added
$113,000 entry fees
15 free roll entrees.
WPA sanctioning fee to be paid separate.

This is with a max field and all previous winners taking advantage of the free roll entry.
 

lfigueroa

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Thanks Jay
What people don't realize is that all these haters and negative threads drive people away no matter how good it could be. The money the players put up do not decide if the show will go on or be successful it's the vendors and fans who show up or buy the steam that will make or break this show. Sure Barry has screwed things up but for over 35 years he put on a good tournament and between the hurricane ,911,and our economy tanking it's been a miracle he has even had a tournament. The make or break on this tournament depends on our support.


The "make or break" on this event is on Barry.

Lou Figueroa
 

Poolplaya9

Tellin' it like it is...
Silver Member
Thanks Jay
What people don't realize is that all these haters and negative threads drive people away no matter how good it could be.

What people like you don't realize is that all these "haters" have made it to where players should actually get paid like they are supposed to this year for a change, and they have also made it to where this event could actually become great again and win back much of the support it has lost (but that is if and only if the escrow arrangement is also used in every single future year of this event as long as Barry is involved, because otherwise we know beyond any and all doubt that Barry WILL screw it up just as sure as we know that the sun will come up tomorrow).

Without those haters this event probably would have died prior to or just after this years open, and now because of them it has the potential to not only continue well into the future, but to be great again. You should be thanking the "haters", not disparaging them.
 

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
Thanks Jay
What people don't realize is that all these haters and negative threads drive people away no matter how good it could be. The money the players put up do not decide if the show will go on or be successful it's the vendors and fans who show up or buy the steam that will make or break this show. Sure Barry has screwed things up but for over 35 years he put on a good tournament and between the hurricane ,911,and our economy tanking it's been a miracle he has even had a tournament. The make or break on this tournament depends on our support.

If you fail to put on the tournament you promise year, after year, after year, you would think you would get it, that it can't be done or you just can't do it. It's not Johnnyt's fault, or any of the others on here questioning a lot of things that look or are wrong. It's all on Barry, who has run the U.S Open 9-ball tournament into the toilet. Johnnyt
 

BeiberLvr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Why does the OP care so much about the Euro's

Not like any of those chumps have a chance.
 

GideonF

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Jay, This is the first we've heard the past champions are "free". Prior press releases, and I believe even statements from either you or Roberta in these threads, indicated that Barry raised 75 k, but that 16k from that 75k would be used for past champions.

Tgsts tge way it's been understood by us in the forums since the very beginning.

If all of the active past champs show up, then it is a distinction without a difference - $16,000 does not go into the prize pool, either because it is "free" entry for the former champs or because Barry pays their entry from the added money. If they don't all show up, then $75k actually added and say 10 free entries is better for the remaining players.

Gideon<---Hoping Pat and Jay can save this tournament
 

Poolplaya9

Tellin' it like it is...
Silver Member
If all of the active past champs show up, then it is a distinction without a difference - $16,000 does not go into the prize pool, either because it is "free" entry for the former champs or because Barry pays their entry from the added money. If they don't all show up, then $75k actually added and say 10 free entries is better for the remaining players.
I'm not sure what you are trying to say in the bolded part above. Perhaps I am missing something. It seems to me that it never makes any difference to the total prize fund whether the "free" past champions are getting a free entry fee, or their entry fee is paid/deducted from the added money, regardless of how many of them are in the tourney whether it be one, or ten, or sixteen. It is always a wash and a distinction without a difference as you said.

And as long as the number of players who are paying their entry fee remains the same, the number of "free" players also doesn't seem to affect the total amount of the prize fund. For example, if you have 100 paid players the prize fund would be $75k added plus $100k in entry fees for a total prize fund of $175k. Whether you have zero, one, ten or sixteen past champions on top of that, the purse still remains $175,000 (whether they are given a free entry or their entry is paid from the added money either one).

The only time the number or "free" past champions could seem to affect the prize fund at all is when you have a full field and a waiting list of paid players who are unable to play due to the full field, because at that point every free guy is taking the place of someone who would have paid his entry and increased the prize fund by another $1k. For example, with a 128 player field, if sixteen of them are free past champions, you have $75k added plus $112k in paid entries for a total purse of $187k (essentially sixteen paying guys had their spots taken by free guys). But if you have a full field and only ten free past champions in it then you have $75k added plus $118k in entry fees for a total purse of $193k since there are six more paying guys in the field this time. But whether the free guys got free entry or had their entry paid from the added money still makes no difference so I am still not sure what you were trying to say?
 

gxman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
What if worse case scenario happens and theres only 75 players, 60 paid entries.

The number of paid entries is 35ish now. All the Chinese/taiwain players have signed up already. Might get 2-3 more Phillipine guys, and 4-5 euros. Then maybe another 15-20 americans.

All the dead money is gone with 1K entry. I really do have a hard time seeing 60 paid entries. Even the U.S open 8b and 10b entry numbers have dropped and thats with a cheap entry.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Ok so if I am now understanding from Jay's post

$75,000 added
$113,000 entry fees
15 free roll entrees.
WPA sanctioning fee to be paid separate.

This is with a max field and all previous winners taking advantage of the free roll entry.

Correct, but there may not be 15 freebies. Some of them may not come so that leaves room for more paid entries. I'm guessing maybe 12 or 13 will play.
 
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jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
What people like you don't realize is that all these "haters" have made it to where players should actually get paid like they are supposed to this year for a change, and they have also made it to where this event could actually become great again and win back much of the support it has lost (but that is if and only if the escrow arrangement is also used in every single future year of this event as long as Barry is involved, because otherwise we know beyond any and all doubt that Barry WILL screw it up just as sure as we know that the sun will come up tomorrow).

Without those haters this event probably would have died prior to or just after this years open, and now because of them it has the potential to not only continue well into the future, but to be great again. You should be thanking the "haters", not disparaging them.


You're giving credit where it doesn't belong. These so called "haters" had little to do with anything happening this year. More credit belongs with several people in the industry and key players who voiced strong disapproval for the wrongdoing of the promoter and threatened to withdraw all support for the U.S. Open, putting the event as structured in jeopardy. This sent a wake up call that Barry responded to, somewhat to our surprise and his credit.

Without Barry's compliance the U.S. Open may not have happened this year. It's that simple.
 

Poolplaya9

Tellin' it like it is...
Silver Member
You're giving credit where it doesn't belong. These so called "haters" had little to do with anything happening this year. More credit belongs with several people in the industry and key players who voiced strong disapproval for the wrongdoing of the promoter and threatened to withdraw all support for the U.S. Open, putting the event as structured in jeopardy. This sent a wake up call that Barry responded to, somewhat to our surprise and his credit.

Without Barry's compliance the U.S. Open may not have happened this year. It's that simple.
I am not negating yours and other people's contributions in the least. Heck, I personally had conversations with the WPA myself that I think helped contribute to where things are today. What I was getting at though, is that what got the ball rolling was the public outcry and activism, some of it on here, that was very significantly stepped up from what it has ever been in years past. People calling you out on here, people telephoning Barry's office and riding his butt about his transgressions and then publicly reporting on it, unpaid players publicly doing the same for the first time, people like myself talking to board members of the WPA, etc.

As a result of that public outcry and activism, some of the people/entities who actually carry some weight in the industry started putting their feet down too, one of them being yourself. But there weren't too many people that mattered who were putting their foot down very firmly with Barry until this year after all the public outcry. Just as one example, you were still willing to work with Barry and were his tournament director just last year even though you fully knew his extensive history. And it is halfway understandable, as you probably figured as one guy your stand couldn't make much difference anyway unless others were willing to make the stand with you, and until the public activism this year there just really weren't enough others willing to make enough of a stand.

So yes, it was some key players in the industry that got the results, but what lit the fire under their butt to do so and to make that stand together was the public activism. Had that not happened it would be business as usual this year with no escrow and nobody significant in the industry making any real stand.
 

watchez

What time is it?
Silver Member
You're giving credit where it doesn't belong. These so called "haters" had little to do with anything happening this year. More credit belongs with several people in the industry and key players who voiced strong disapproval for the wrongdoing of the promoter and threatened to withdraw all support for the U.S. Open, putting the event as structured in jeopardy. This sent a wake up call that Barry responded to, somewhat to our surprise and his credit.

Without Barry's compliance the U.S. Open may not have happened this year. It's that simple.

Funny none of that worked last year. The same people were involved and the same failures happened. Barry was put to the test last year and didn't give a shit. It is only the massive PR nightmare he had after last year that has caused any change (which still remains to be seen).
 

pro9dg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Why does the OP care so much about the Euro's

Not like any of those chumps have a chance.

As I am the original poster I must say that I do like your nice line in sarcasm. When one considers how little of the prize money will actually stay on US soil then there is 'much ado about nothing'.. If you exclude any money that Shane collects then the total could be as little as TEN GRAND with the rest of it winging it's way to Manila, Taipei and Europe.
 

Keith Jawahir

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
People get mad about all the hate on the U.S. Open, but I don't see anyone knocking Mike Zuglan or Turning stone. I wonder why that is? :rolleyes:
 

sonny_burnett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You guys are funny and a little aggravating as well. Last time for this - There is $75,000 in added money going into the purse, regardless of how many players enter. This has nothing to do with the entry fee money. The free entries are just that - FREE! All paid entry money also goes into the purse. If all the freebies show up and we fill the field, the purse should be $188,000, with $40,000 on top.

We are doing our level best to make this a great event once again, so all the knocking is not appreciated. A little support for me and Pat would be nice to hear. We are the ones putting our necks out for the Open this year. If this doesn't work and the event flops, I don't look for their to be a 41st U.S.Open. Carry on
What constitutes a free entry Jay? Kind of like sponsor's exemptions in golf?

Thanks for trying to save the open.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
I am not negating yours and other people's contributions in the least. Heck, I personally had conversations with the WPA myself that I think helped contribute to where things are today. What I was getting at though, is that what got the ball rolling was the public outcry and activism, some of it on here, that was very significantly stepped up from what it has ever been in years past. People calling you out on here, people telephoning Barry's office and riding his butt about his transgressions and then publicly reporting on it, unpaid players publicly doing the same for the first time, people like myself talking to board members of the WPA, etc.

As a result of that public outcry and activism, some of the people/entities who actually carry some weight in the industry started putting their feet down too, one of them being yourself. But there weren't too many people that mattered who were putting their foot down very firmly with Barry until this year after all the public outcry. Just as one example, you were still willing to work with Barry and were his tournament director just last year even though you fully knew his extensive history. And it is halfway understandable, as you probably figured as one guy your stand couldn't make much difference anyway unless others were willing to make the stand with you, and until the public activism this year there just really weren't enough others willing to make enough of a stand.

So yes, it was some key players in the industry that got the results, but what lit the fire under their butt to do so and to make that stand together was the public activism. Had that not happened it would be business as usual this year with no escrow and nobody significant in the industry making any real stand.

I have to agree with you here. It was the totality of things that finally brought Barry to this point, where there is some real security regarding prize money. A few years back Johnny Archer and his friend Art Wiggins handled the prize money in a similar fashion and everyone got paid on time. I feel so much more comfortable with Pat Fleming doing that this year. Last year the aftermath got a little ugly and it was a big distraction for me on the final two days of the tournament, constantly having to intercede on behalf of players.

No Fleming and there would be no Jay this year either. Big props to Pat for taking on this job!
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
What constitutes a free entry Jay? Kind of like sponsor's exemptions in golf?

Thanks for trying to save the open.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

They are all past champions who Barry prefers to invite. Probably a dozen of them who are still active will accept his offer of a free entry fee. This may be the last year for this, with only the defending champion getting a freebie in the future.
 
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pro9dg

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Do they ever put out a flyer for the Open? Johnnyt

That flyer could provide the information that would allow players to make an informed decision about entering. What will the prize money be if only 60 players pay - $135,000?
For 112 payers will it come out at the very original $187,000. Finally if they attract 120 then all these extra $1000s should belong to Barry.
So what is the running total of entries so far? Or why is it a secret?

I am no hater, I would like to turn the clock back to when the US Open was perceived as an honest tournament.
 

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
That flyer could provide the information that would allow players to make an informed decision about entering. What will the prize money be if only 60 players pay - $135,000?
For 112 payers will it come out at the very original $187,000. Finally if they attract 120 then all these extra $1000s should belong to Barry.
So what is the running total of entries so far? Or why is it a secret?

I am no hater, I would like to turn the clock back to when the US Open was perceived as an honest tournament.

http://www.accu-stats.com/40usopen.html
 
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