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Should a pro player call a foul on themselves?
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JoeyA
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Should a pro player call a foul on themselves? - 07-11-2013, 04:36 PM

This is really a question for the pro players out there.

It's not really for us.

We don't have to pay our bills with short money earned by playing pool.

We've all seen many of our pool champions foul without their opponent seeing the foul and they haven't called the foul on themselves, when they clearly knew they fouled. Personally, I don't think they should be vilified for not calling a foul on themselves, except for the following:

If the answer is yes, then it should clearly be part of the rules; that each player is indeed required to call a foul on themselves.

If the answer is no, then I think the rules should clearly state that each player is not required to call a foul on themselves.

What do you think about the "If yes"/If no" then statements?

JoeyA


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07-11-2013, 04:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyA View Post
This is really a question for the pro players out there.

It's not really for us.

We don't have to pay our bills with short money earned by playing pool.

We've all seen many of our pool champions foul without their opponent seeing the foul and they haven't called the foul on themselves, when they clearly knew they fouled. Personally, I don't think they should be vilified for not calling a foul on themselves, except for the following:

If the answer is yes, then it should clearly be part of the rules; that each player is indeed required to call a foul on themselves.

If the answer is no, then I think the rules should clearly state that each player is not required to call a foul on themselves.

What do you think about the "If yes"/If no" then statements?

JoeyA
Without reading the entire post. YES. I have even overruled a bad call by a referree before. If you feel you fouled then you should call it on yourself regardless of the situ.


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Now having read the post
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Now having read the post - 07-11-2013, 04:45 PM

I am by no means a professional but when I was much younger I did play pool for a living. It wasnt much of a life but it was a living nonetheless. I would never call someone out for not calling a foul on themselves in a match I have nothing to do with but I do think it hurts their overall character IMO. The only exception being in very very long sessions when both players are obviously wiped out and could honestly just plain overlook a kick not getting to the rail or something.

My answer is still yes. I hate to bring up other games because I know I'll get flamed for it or told how I'm an idiot or something but in golf you are expected to be honest in all situations that you KNOW you have done something outside of the rules. Why should pool be any different?


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07-11-2013, 05:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyA View Post
This is really a question for the pro players out there.

It's not really for us.

We don't have to pay our bills with short money earned by playing pool.

We've all seen many of our pool champions foul without their opponent seeing the foul and they haven't called the foul on themselves, when they clearly knew they fouled. Personally, I don't think they should be vilified for not calling a foul on themselves, except for the following:

If the answer is yes, then it should clearly be part of the rules; that each player is indeed required to call a foul on themselves.

If the answer is no, then I think the rules should clearly state that each player is not required to call a foul on themselves.

What do you think about the "If yes"/If no" then statements?

JoeyA
Well, [should] has little to do with reality. The way we express [shoulds] is by saying, if you don't then there's a penalty. So then you get in to the did-they-knowingly-not-call-a-foul or did they ignorantly not call it...

If you want people to trust you, you should. And if you don't mind that people think you're sly, you can omit, and if you want to be regarded as a turd, you can pretend it wasn't a foul even when someone calls you on it.

While on that subject, you may as well discuss how people pull shenanigans when you tell them to be more respectful/still when you're shooting... "I just needed water! I wanted to get out your way so I moved right as you were shooting! I was getting your money out!" You know... the standard crap that people do. Personally, if I do something that boarders on sharking someone, I concede the game in a lot of cases just to make sure they know I wasn't intending to get in their head.
  
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07-11-2013, 05:10 PM

I'm about as far from a pro as it gets, but I think I see what you are getting at here.

Leaving all ethics, and moral conversations about not being able to sleep at night, aside...

I believe that YES, a player should have to call a foul on themselves... and YES, it should be clearly stated in the rules that they are responsible for calling the foul.

Unfortunately, there just aren't enough referees to go around. In tournaments like the Ultimate 10-Ball, where there is a referee at every table, the fouls should be called by the referee. However, a shooting player should be able to call a foul on themselves if there is something that a referee misses (but that leads back into the ethics and morals discussion).

In tournaments where there are a few roaming referees (like most of them), the players should be calling fouls on themselves and have the option to call a referee over to watch a certain occurrence. If that tournament gets down to the finals, and they would like to designate a referee for that particular match, then that would be up to them.


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you may end up on Wall Street
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Talking you may end up on Wall Street - 07-11-2013, 05:20 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeyA View Post
This is really a question for the pro players out there.

It's not really for us.

We don't have to pay our bills with short money earned by playing pool.

We've all seen many of our pool champions foul without their opponent seeing the foul and they haven't called the foul on themselves, when they clearly knew they fouled. Personally, I don't think they should be vilified for not calling a foul on themselves, except for the following:

If the answer is yes, then it should clearly be part of the rules; that each player is indeed required to call a foul on themselves.

If the answer is no, then I think the rules should clearly state that each player is not required to call a foul on themselves.

What do you think about the "If yes"/If no" then statements?

JoeyA
I've called fouls on myself at various times in my career unless it was forbidden. I called one on myself in Tunica that I doubt anyone could see. I want to win, but you can't put winning in front of honestly or who know$......you may end up on Wall Street before it's over.

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07-11-2013, 05:26 PM

If you have a shread of integrity, then yes, if not dont worry about it
  
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07-11-2013, 05:39 PM

I have never heard or saw a basketball, football, baseball, boxer, tennis player calling a foul on themselves. That's my answer. If there is money involved.......Johnnyt


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07-11-2013, 05:54 PM

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Originally Posted by Johnnyt View Post
I have never heard or saw a basketball, football, baseball, boxer, tennis player calling a foul on themselves. That's my answer. If there is money involved.......Johnnyt
i came in to type that, beat me to it.
and those are pro millionaires.

integrity shmintegrity


  
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07-11-2013, 06:02 PM

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Originally Posted by Johnnyt View Post
I have never heard or saw a basketball, football, baseball, boxer, tennis player calling a foul on themselves. That's my answer. If there is money involved.......Johnnyt
And when there is enough money involved... you are able to pay qualified (for the most part) referees to call the fouls for you.

Until that happens for pool, call the fouls on yourself.


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07-11-2013, 06:08 PM

JoeyA asks;
Should a pro player call a foul on themselves? - Today, 06:36 PM

First I have a question that should be the first one.

If a player does not call a foul on himself would you call him a pro ?????

btw my answer to JoeyA's question is absolutely !

imo you shouldn't be called a pro if you can't !!!




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07-11-2013, 06:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by oldzilla View Post
JoeyA asks;
Should a pro player call a foul on themselves? - Today, 06:36 PM

First I have a question that should be the first one.

If a player does not call a foul on himself would you call him a pro ?????

btw my answer to JoeyA's question is absolutely !

imo you shouldn't be called a pro if you can't !!!
I wouldnt call him a pro , i'd call him an asshole
  
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07-11-2013, 06:15 PM

I can just imagine a pro football player running up to the referee after a play and saying "hey man, I held that guy and you didn't call it".

He would get the crap beat out of him by his teammates.

Pros have referees, referees make the calls.

Now if it is a pro playing in a private money game, then yeah, he should call it on himself. But in a situation where there is a referee, I honestly think it should be stated that ONLY the referee can call a foul. This would also prevent the opponent from bellyaching about a perceived foul.
  
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07-11-2013, 06:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnyt View Post
I have never heard or saw a basketball, football, baseball, boxer, tennis player calling a foul on themselves. That's my answer. If there is money involved.......Johnnyt
If a pro golfer fouls and doesn't call it on himself, he risks being totally ostracized from the sport.

The pool players I know who do call fouls on themselves seem to be a lot classier people in general than the ones who don't.
  
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07-11-2013, 06:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulieB View Post
I can just imagine a pro football player running up to the referee after a play and saying "hey man, I held that guy and you didn't call it".

He would get the crap beat out of him by his teammates.

Pros have referees, referees make the calls.

Now if it is a pro playing in a private money game, then yeah, he should call it on himself. But in a situation where there is a referee, I honestly think it should be stated that ONLY the referee can call a foul. This would also prevent the opponent from bellyaching about a perceived foul.
I hear ya Unc but you're in the apples and oranges area !

Football foots a big expense for referees. Pool can't !!!!

I decided long ago the only type I would wager with are ones that are responsible for themselves.

ttyl




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