Bridge Hand Aiming

[Brookeland Bill]

Tried them all At least once or twice. What no one discusses is how important the position of the bridge hand for aiming. The position of the bridge hand really sets up the shot. Think of it as if you were looking down the barrel of a rifle and your hand is the ‘sight‘ that your using to take down your target after you have determined your point of contact with the object ball. of course you have to take into consideration other factors such as throw, squirt, position, etc.

 

[Bob Jewett]

It's obvious from simple geometry that you can't change your aim for a center-ball shot without moving your bridge hand, but you see a lot of beginners just pivoting to change the aim. That's totally broken. To the extent that backhand english works on the shot, pivoting doesn't change the aim at all.

 

[Oikawa]

The way I do aiming is to align the cue to point at the correct overlap on the OB instinctively, so no calculations or fractions, just point it where it looks/feels correct for a given shot.

Now, as Bob mentioned, if you drop down on a slightly wrong cue-OB relationship, and try to adjust by moving the backhand only so that the cue points at the OB correctly, you will no longer be pointing at the correct point on the CB. Any bridgehand movement requires re-adjusting the backhand, and vice versa, but a key insight here is that the amount of re-adjusting needed is always much smaller than the original error.

So if one is down on the shot, points at the CB properly but points 10cm off with the cue in relation to OB target, and adjusts their backhand so theres now no error in cue-OB target, the cue-CB error will be there, but much smaller than 10cm. Now if they fix the cue-CB relationship back to target, the cue-OB error will be much smaller than last time. This process can be repeated a few times back and forth to lock in to both cue-CB and cue-OB lines perfectly.

So, move the bridgehand to fix the cue-CB line, and move the backhand to fix the cue-OB line, a couple times back and forth, until both are correct.

This works well for me at least. And of course you should line up the CB/OB relation as well as you can when standing, this method is suited best for microadjustments, to ensure you are 100% locked in with millimeter precision.

 

[BRKNRUN]

I use a track line from center CB to OB....

I air align my cue above the CB with the tip to my aim point as I am dropping down onto the shot..

What this does is uses the CB as an axis point to square my bridge hand and back hand on the track line ..

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Tried them all At least once or twice. What no one discusses is how important the position of the bridge hand for aiming. The position of the bridge hand really sets up the shot. Think of it as if you were looking down the barrel of a rifle and your hand is the ‘sight‘ that your using to take down your target after you have determined your point of contact with the object ball. of course you have to take into consideration other factors such as throw, squirt, position, etc.

Um, I've mentioned "bridge aim" on quite a few AZ threads. That hand is several FEET closer to the balls than the stroke hand.

With beginners, I show how the thumb/forefinger channel makes a handy aim device for an open hand bridge. Plop down your hand bridge onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.

 

[sparkle84]

Um, I've mentioned "bridge aim" on quite a few AZ threads. That hand is several FEET closer to the balls than the stroke hand.

With beginners, I show how the thumb/forefinger channel makes a handy aim device for an open hand bridge. Plop down your hand bridge onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.

Sorry but I've never heard the term "bridge aim" mentioned by you or anyone else. I'm sure I could have missed it so if you could provide links to these multiple threads it would be appreciated.
Always looking for new aiming methods.

A more thorough explanation of the concepts described in your 2nd paragraph would also be appreciated as I'm having difficulty understanding how what you're advocating will enable beginners to advance their skills.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Sorry but I've never heard the term "bridge aim" mentioned by you or anyone else. I'm sure I could have missed it so if you could provide links to these multiple threads it would be appreciated.
Always looking for new aiming methods.

A more thorough explanation of the concepts described in your 2nd paragraph would also be appreciated as I'm having difficulty understanding how what you're advocating will enable beginners to advance their skills.

I used quotation marks for a reason, it was a paraphrase of what I've described and taught.

With an open hand bridge, If the thumb and forefinger are pressed together, and that line (channel, groove) is atop the shot line, and the thumb is one side of the shotline, the forefinger on the other, the cue stick is of course also on the shot line. Stroke!

https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/bridge-hand-role-in-aiming.542001/page-2#post-7233929 is the first one I found on a search.

 

[sparkle84]

I used quotation marks for a reason, it was a paraphrase of what I've described and taught.

With an open hand bridge, If the thumb and forefinger are pressed together, and that line (channel, groove) is atop the shot line, and the thumb is one side of the shotline, the forefinger on the other, the cue stick is of course also on the shot line. Stroke!

https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/bridge-hand-role-in-aiming.542001/page-2#post-7233929 is the first one I found on a search.

Well, at least you gave a link, something you've never done before. So,even though you're playing a semantics game as usual, I'll let that slide for the moment.

As for the second assertion, the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.

 

[BRKNRUN]

The position of the bridge hand really sets up the shot.

Preface this with.....However you get there....as long as you consistently get there...you are good.

That being said......I use a different philosophy when it comes to set up....(and I used this philosophy in Golf)

"The club (cue) does not set up to you.....You set up to the club (cue)."

The cue must be in a specific place/alignment for each shot.....the cue is a constant.....If the cue shaft is on the shot line...that is all that matters....the bridge hand can be any shape or configuration you want as long as the cue is on the line.

The same concept goes for feet placement, body posture, head alignment, etc. etc....it all sets up to the cue......so I don't see a reason to use the bridge hand for alignment when the cue shaft is right there.....Just seems like an added variable that has more potential for inconsistency and breakdown.....

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Well, at least you gave a link, something you've never done before. So,even though you're playing a semantics game as usual, I'll let that slide for the moment.

As for the second assertion, the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.

I'm here to instruct others and also to learn, not to play semantics or lie--that's your bag.

That's also a goalpost shift from you, to discuss scoring a shot, since we were discussing aim, and you objected to my mentioning hand bridge aim.

Regardless, the entire cue stick is on the shot line, and it will take quite bad "variables" as you wrote to miss the shot.

 

[sparkle84]

I'm here to instruct others and also to learn, not to play semantics or lie--that's your bag.

That's also a goalpost shift from you, to discuss scoring a shot, since we were discussing aim, and you objected to my mentioning hand bridge aim.

Regardless, the entire cue stick is on the shot line, and it will take quite bad "variables" as you wrote to miss the shot.

I wasn't discussing aim or anything else with you.
Nor did I object to you mentioning anything. In the future please attempt to read and understand what I actually wrote, not your interpretation of same.

Here's a news flash. Just because the bridge hand is on the shot line doesn't translate into the entire cue stick being on the line also. Are you disputing that?

 

[BilliardsAbout]

I wasn't discussing aim or anything else with you.
Nor did I object to you mentioning anything. In the future please attempt to read and understand what I actually wrote, not your interpretation of same.

Here's a news flash. Just because the bridge hand is on the shot line doesn't translate into the entire cue stick being on the line also. Are you disputing that?

But you certainly were discussing aim with me, when you asked about what you called "bridge aim" above.

Nor did I write about the whole bridge hand, but the groove or channel made by the thumb and forefinger. Your earlier post recognizes I'm right about aligning the cue stick, and goalpost shifts to discuss body mechanics:

. . . the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.

 

[sparkle84]

But you certainly were discussing aim with me, when you asked about what you called "bridge aim" above.

Nor did I write about the whole bridge hand, but the groove or channel made by the thumb and forefinger. Your earlier post recognizes I'm right about aligning the cue stick, and goalpost shifts to discuss body mechanics:

. . . the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.

Go back to my post #6 and try once again to understand what I wrote. If you're unable to do that it's pointless to have a conversation. End of story.
I talk to various people every day and never have any problem with them understanding, at least in general terms, what it is I'm trying to convey.
With you, the above concept seems to be a hopeless endeavor, despite the fact that you claim to have 3 college degrees.
Pretty obvious English isn't one of them.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Go back to my post #6 and try once again to understand what I wrote. If you're unable to do that it's pointless to have a conversation. End of story.
I talk to various people every day and never have any problem with them understanding, at least in general terms, what it is I'm trying to convey.
With you, the above concept seems to be a hopeless endeavor, despite the fact that you claim to have 3 college degrees.
Pretty obvious English isn't one of them.

No, old chap. All want to see how you "debate" by twisting what others write, since I responded to your Post # 6 with my POST NUMBER 7:


Your Post #6:
Sorry but I've never heard the term "bridge aim" mentioned by you or anyone else. I'm sure I could have missed it so if you could provide links to these multiple threads it would be appreciated. Always looking for new aiming methods.

A more thorough explanation of the concepts described in your 2nd paragraph would also be appreciated as I'm having difficulty understanding how what you're advocating will enable beginners to advance their skills.


My response:
I used quotation marks for a reason, it was a paraphrase of what I've described and taught.

With an open hand bridge, If the thumb and forefinger are pressed together, and that line (channel, groove) is atop the shot line, and the thumb is one side of the shotline, the forefinger on the other, the cue stick is of course also on the shot line. Stroke!

https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/bridge-hand-role-in-aiming.542001/page-2#post-7233929 is the first one I found on a search.


Your response/twist/shift to mechanics from aim: As for the second assertion, the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.


My [partial] response besides calling you out for the goalpost shift:
The entire cue stick is on the shot line, and it will take quite bad "variables" as you wrote to miss the shot.


Another response/twist/shift from you to "whole bridge hand" from "groove between thumb and finger [where the cue sits] for aim and alignment": Just because the bridge hand is on the shot line doesn't translate into the entire cue stick being on the line also. Are you disputing that?


My [partial] response:
. . . Nor did I write about the whole bridge hand, but the groove or channel made by the thumb and forefinger. Your earlier post recognizes I'm right about aligning the cue stick, and goalpost shifts to discuss body mechanics.



Your newest "horse shift" shows you twist others' words, ignore what they write, and make boldface lies:

Go back to my post #6 and try once again to understand what I wrote. If you're unable to do that it's pointless to have a conversation. End of story.
I talk to various people every day and never have any problem with them understanding, at least in general terms, what it is I'm trying to convey.
With you, the above concept seems to be a hopeless endeavor, despite the fact that you claim to have 3 college degrees.
Pretty obvious English isn't one of them.

“Shall we continue?” – James Bond to Gustav Graves, Die Another Day

 

[sparkle84]

No, old chap. All want to see how you "debate" by twisting what others write, since I responded to your Post # 6 with my POST NUMBER 7:


Your Post #6:
Sorry but I've never heard the term "bridge aim" mentioned by you or anyone else. I'm sure I could have missed it so if you could provide links to these multiple threads it would be appreciated. Always looking for new aiming methods.

A more thorough explanation of the concepts described in your 2nd paragraph would also be appreciated as I'm having difficulty understanding how what you're advocating will enable beginners to advance their skills.


My response:
I used quotation marks for a reason, it was a paraphrase of what I've described and taught.

With an open hand bridge, If the thumb and forefinger are pressed together, and that line (channel, groove) is atop the shot line, and the thumb is one side of the shotline, the forefinger on the other, the cue stick is of course also on the shot line. Stroke!

https://forums.azbilliards.com/threads/bridge-hand-role-in-aiming.542001/page-2#post-7233929 is the first one I found on a search.


Your response/twist/shift to mechanics from aim: As for the second assertion, the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot.


My [partial] response besides calling you out for the goalpost shift:
The entire cue stick is on the shot line, and it will take quite bad "variables" as you wrote to miss the shot.


Another response/twist/shift from you to "whole bridge hand" from "groove between thumb and finger [where the cue sits] for aim and alignment": Just because the bridge hand is on the shot line doesn't translate into the entire cue stick being on the line also. Are you disputing that?


My [partial] response:
. . . Nor did I write about the whole bridge hand, but the groove or channel made by the thumb and forefinger. Your earlier post recognizes I'm right about aligning the cue stick, and goalpost shifts to discuss body mechanics.



Your newest "horse shift" shows you twist others' words, ignore what they write, and make boldface lies:







“Shall we continue?” – James Bond to Gustav Graves, Die Another Day

That's an awful lot of words but once again you're missing the point.
My original contention is with this:

With a beginning player, if they just plop that bridge hand down on the shot/aim line and then fire away everything will be hunky dory.

Guess what, it doesn't work that way. It's shortsighted, simplistic and plain everyday wrong. It's hindering, not helping. That's my opinion.

BTW I have your book on the way. Got it on Amazon for $2.36. Hope it's worth that. Stay tuned for my review.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

That's an awful lot of words but once again you're missing the point.
My original contention is with this:

With a beginning player, if they just plop that bridge hand down on the shot/aim line and then fire away everything will be hunky dory.

Guess what, it doesn't work that way. It's shortsighted, simplistic and plain everyday wrong. It's hindering, not helping. That's my opinion.

BTW I have your book on the way. Got it on Amazon for $2.36. Hope it's worth that. Stay tuned for my review.

No, you are lying again as shown in my post #14 just above, for all to read.

I didn't write "put the bridge hand on the shot line".

 

[BRKNRUN]

Another problem with bridge hand aiming is even if you are diligent at getting the bridge hand (including reference to any specific part or formation therof)....that does not guarantee the grip hand or cue is straight on the shot line....

A PSR that drops a straight cue on a straight shot line seems much more efficient effective and relatable.

 

[sparkle84]

No, you are lying again as shown in my post #14 just above, for all to read.

I didn't write "put the bridge hand on the shot line".

Just a quick review of all this nonsense.

You in post 5:
Plop down your bridge hand onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.

Me in post 15:
With a beginning player, if they just plop that bridge hand down on the shot/aim line and then fire away everything will be hunky dory.

You in post 16:
I didn't write "put the bridge hand on the shot line".

To summarize:
As I previously stated, you like to play semantics games.

Can't wait for the book to arrive. Gonna be interesting.

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Just a quick review of all this nonsense.

You in post 5:
Plop down your bridge hand onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.

Me in post 15:
With a beginning player, if they just plop that bridge hand down on the shot/aim line and then fire away everything will be hunky dory.

You in post 16:
I didn't write "put the bridge hand on the shot line".

To summarize:
As I previously stated, you like to play semantics games.

Can't wait for the book to arrive. Gonna be interesting.

You are lying again. We both know I wrote in my Post #5:

Plop down your hand bridge onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.

But anyone actually reading Post #5 sees you snipped the prior sentence:

With beginners, I show how the thumb/forefinger channel makes a handy aim device for an open hand bridge. Plop down your hand bridge onto the shot and shoot without practice strokes.


I'm not near a table and substituted a pen for a cue stick, to illustrate what you claim I wrote:

This is what I actually wrote in Post #5:

My second photo amplifies my original Post #5, which you acknowledged in your Post #8:

"As for the second assertion, the fact that the thumb and forefinger are astride the shot line doesn't do a whole lot to ensure the other variables are in the correct alignment to result in a successful shot," another way of saying:

"Yes, Matt, I know you are putting the cue on the line using the channel where the cue rests on the hand bridge, so I'll first argue that just because the cue is on line doesn't mean the shot can be made, but then I'll keep lying after I lose that argument, to say you said put the hand bridge on the line".

 

[BilliardsAbout]

Another problem with bridge hand aiming is even if you are diligent at getting the bridge hand (including reference to any specific part or formation therof)....that does not guarantee the grip hand or cue is straight on the shot line....

A PSR that drops a straight cue on a straight shot line seems much more efficient effective and relatable.

I appreciate having a straightforward PSR as you wrote. That's good.

However, if only an inch of cue stick is perfectly atop the shot line, atop the thumb/forefinger channel, as in my photo above . . . of course, the entire cue stick is on the shot line. Stroke!