Centerball...haters gonna hate

[ktrepal85]

Ever since I've been playing pool most of the instructional material states that you should try to play shape so that you can hit centerball on every shot and float into position.

What's so great about hitting centerball? Is it just that you can see the tangent line easily? Anyone that has been playing this game for a while can just as easily see the follow line and draw line of the cue ball to predict it's path so that point is moot.

I think hitting centerball makes you more likely to miss the shot. If you try to hit centerball and miss by half a tip to the left or right you are throwing the shit out of the ball. And if you hit centerball on a 20 - 30 degree cut shot you are maximizing the cut induced throw effects which makes aiming more difficult.

I think Tor Lowry started the whole centerball craze and I just don't see what all the hype is about.

Playing position for you to use follow or draw seems much more effective.

So why does everyone like centerball so much?

 

[george canon]

Snooker players are the greatest potter of the ball, and play on 6x12, and they live, using center ball. The problem with using English, is the throw, making the pot more difficult. Center ball, less throw, the pot is easier to make, as long as you account for the cling in a cut shot.

As long as you maintain, playing angle to angle, it works fine. But get out of line, then you have to use English to get back in line. So both methods must be used, and perfected. English and Women are the same, cant live with them, cant live, without them. :wink:

 

[Keith Jawahir]

Ever since I've been playing pool most of the instructional material states that you should try to play shape so that you can hit centerball on every shot and float into position.

What's so great about hitting centerball? Is it just that you can see the tangent line easily? Anyone that has been playing this game for a while can just as easily see the follow line and draw line of the cue ball to predict it's path so that point is moot.

I think hitting centerball makes you more likely to miss the shot. If you try to hit centerball and miss by half a tip to the left or right you are throwing the shit out of the ball. And if you hit centerball on a 20 - 30 degree cut shot you are maximizing the cut induced throw effects which makes aiming more difficult.

I think Tor Lowry started the whole centerball craze and I just don't see what all the hype is about.

Playing position for you to use follow or draw seems much more effective.

So why does everyone like centerball so much?

centerball includes stop, follow, and draw, basically just the vertical axis. once you start deviating to either side, you start having to compensate for throw, deflection, etc. I try not to use more than maybe 1/2 tip to 1 tip of side unless absolutely necessary.

 

[DaveM]

I'm thinking that you want to learn centerball and tangent line behavior as a baseline. If you don't know how a ball would behave with centerball, how would you know what adjustments to make? Wouldn't everything be guesswork without a reference line?

 

[ktrepal85]

centerball includes stop, follow, and draw, basically just the vertical axis. once you start deviating to either side, you start having to compensate for throw, deflection, etc. I try not to use more than maybe 1/2 tip to 1 tip of side unless absolutely necessary.

I don't think so. I think when people are referring to centerball they are actually talking about the center of the ball, not just the vertical axis.

 

[ktrepal85]

I'm thinking that you want to learn centerball and tangent line behavior as a baseline. If you don't know how a ball would behave with centerball, how would you know what adjustments to make? Wouldn't everything be guesswork without a reference line?

I agree that a reference line is important but you can use anything as a reference line. You can use the shot line as a reference line if you want. There is nothing that proves that the centerball reference line is better than any other reference line.

 

[336Robin]

Baseline Knowledge

I'm thinking that you want to learn centerball and tangent line behavior as a baseline. If you don't know how a ball would behave with centerball, how would you know what adjustments to make? Wouldn't everything be guesswork without a reference line?

A few months back I decided to run some racks using just center ball, follow and draw and play for tangent line position.

I recommend that for anyone who wants to understand a baseline for their game. Its an invaluable exercise. What is great about is when you get just a little out of line because your shot pressure is pretty close it takes just a touch of English many times to get back in line and when you start getting out this way you start understanding how you can make moves with a high percentage of completion. Isnt that in itself what pool is about? Execution to a high percentage of completion.

Surely as you suggest center ball isn't everything but is sure is something.

 

[Neil]

centerball includes stop, follow, and draw, basically just the vertical axis. once you start deviating to either side, you start having to compensate for throw, deflection, etc. I try not to use more than maybe 1/2 tip to 1 tip of side unless absolutely necessary.

Totally agree. Actual dead center of the cb is rarely hit. Most of the time center cb is referenced, it is implying the vertical axis of the center cb. Using no english. (english is only right or left of the vertical centerline)

 

[Neil]

I agree that a reference line is important but you can use anything as a reference line. You can use the shot line as a reference line if you want. There is nothing that proves that the centerball reference line is better than any other reference line.

Actually, there are things that prove the centerball reference line is better than other reference lines. Knowledge is a good thing, but that has become unwanted on here for some reason.

 

[george canon]

One said this.
I agree that a reference line is important but you can use anything as a reference line. You can use the shot line as a reference line if you want. There is nothing that proves that the centerball reference line is better than any other reference line.

Center ball, is the center line, does not matter if its low, center or high. You want proof, find read an study, the Wagon wheel book, there it is. :grin:

 

[TATE]

Ever since I've been playing pool most of the instructional material states that you should try to play shape so that you can hit centerball on every shot and float into position.


Playing position for you to use follow or draw seems much more effective.

So why does everyone like centerball so much?

It's obvious you've misunderstood this suggestion. Nobody can play well minimizing draw and follow.

I've never seen a top player who doesn't use left and right English and I don't expect to. English adds a layer of difficulty to a shot for various reasons. The idea is to minimize the extremes of English. All players in every cue game use left and right spin.

 

[Wheels33]

I agree that a reference line is important but you can use anything as a reference line. You can use the shot line as a reference line if you want. There is nothing that proves that the centerball reference line is better than any other reference line.

what would be your reference point on the cue ball if it's not center ball?

 

[prad]

why center ball ?

Ever since I've been playing pool most of the instructional material states that you should try to play shape so that you can hit centerball on every shot and float into position.

What's so great about hitting centerball? Is it just that you can see the tangent line easily? Anyone that has been playing this game for a while can just as easily see the follow line and draw line of the cue ball to predict it's path so that point is moot.

I think hitting centerball makes you more likely to miss the shot. If you try to hit centerball and miss by half a tip to the left or right you are throwing the shit out of the ball. And if you hit centerball on a 20 - 30 degree cut shot you are maximizing the cut induced throw effects which makes aiming more difficult.

I think Tor Lowry started the whole centerball craze and I just don't see what all the hype is about.

Playing position for you to use follow or draw seems much more effective.

So why does everyone like centerball so much?

There is one other benefit to practicing center ball hit that a lot of players don't realize, and that is once you are able to hit center ball about 70 % to 80 % you can be sure of your ability to hit the cue ball at what ever spot you aim.

If you can hit center ball when you "want" it then you can pretty much hit the cue ball with any spin at the spot when you "want" it. A lot of players when putting spin on ball actually don't really hit their desired spot on the cue ball which gives them different results.

 

[DaveM]

Maybe we should all use TOI....(another version of Godwin's law, or would that have to be CTE?)

 

[ktrepal85]

what would be your reference point on the cue ball if it's not center ball?

We are talking about reference lines, not reference points on the cue ball.

For example, I can think of a follow shot as going 60 degrees above the tangent line(tangent line reference). Alternatively, I can think of a follow shot as 30 degrees away from the shot line(shot line reference). Both ways are equally as effective and give the same results. It's just a matter of choice.

 

[ElCorazonFrio]

We are talking about reference lines, not reference points on the cue ball.

For example, I can think of a follow shot as going 60 degrees above the tangent line(tangent line reference). Alternatively, I can think of a follow shot as 30 degrees away from the shot line(shot line reference). Both ways are equally as effective and give the same results. It's just a matter of choice.

You can think of it that way, but you'd be an idiot for doing it.

On every shot the cueball follows the tangent line.

Let me repeat that: On every shot the cueball follows the tangent line.

The follow or draw affects the path of the cueball after the cueball stops sliding from the impact. This happens sooner or later depending on the speed of the hit and the amount of english (and friction of the cloth and how humid it is, how dirty the balls are...etc..).

 

[Jimbojim]

I believe that to be very precise in your position, you have to use sidespin(no more than necessary). I actually almost never hit TRUE center ball.

 

[DaveM]

It's obvious you've misunderstood this suggestion. Nobody can play well minimizing draw and follow.

I've never seen a top player who doesn't use left and right English and I don't expect to. English adds a layer of difficulty to a shot for various reasons. The idea is to minimize the extremes of English. All players in every cue game use left and right spin.

I agree....the instructional material is there to get newer players back to basics and better aware of CB behavior. Many people start out playing pool in the bar or hall and fall in love with left and right, as well as draw and follow, without knowing what the CB does naturally. Sometimes you have to take one step back to take two steps forward.....

 

[ktrepal85]

You can think of it that way, but you'd be an idiot for doing it.

On every shot the cueball follows the tangent line.

Let me repeat that: On every shot the cueball follows the tangent line.

The follow or draw affects the path of the cueball after the cueball stops sliding from the impact. This happens sooner or later depending on the speed of the hit and the amount of english (and friction of the cloth and how humid it is, how dirty the balls are...etc..).

By the same logic:

On every shot the cue ball starts off on the shot line.

Let me repeat that: On every shot the cue ball starts off on the shot line.

It's all relative, no need to call anyone stupid.

 

[throne4]

The Tangent line is based off of a sliding cue ball. Depending on the shot distance will determine where you hit the cue ball. That said I play alot of stun shots rather than rolling balls in and this is done using ceter ball and tangent lines. That is the base information for all pool players. Then you work with english to change your path from the tangent line to achieve the result you want.