how would ya hit it?

[The_JV]

pat and JV, I can see sliding the ob down the long rail on this shot- I can also visualize hitting the pocket point and missing it in the process
my understanding is that the "bigger" part of the pocket on this shot is the left side, on the short rail side- is that correct?
if that's the case, would you aim for that side while shooting this shot? thanks y'all-

Patrick already responded, but since you asked us both.... For this shot, regardless of CB position, I would aim to miss the long rail point.

I know, I know... "Aim to miss...?" If all other considerations are removed, (namely CB position for the next shot) I always pick the spot that allows the greatest room for error. In this case it's the long rail point. I know I can hit the long rail at correct speed and still drop the ball. The same can't be said for the short rail point. Only time this doesn't work very well is when the table has very deep shelves and worn cloth. Much like the room local to me...lol.

I follow the same practice if I'm attempting a side pocket shot from extreme angles, which make the pocket play small. Aim to clip the point and throw it in with spin induced throw.

 

[Dunnn51]

Patrick already responded, but since you asked us both.... For this shot, regardless of CB position, I would aim to miss the long rail point.

I know, I know... "Aim to miss...?" If all other considerations are removed, (namely CB position for the next shot) I always pick the spot that allows the greatest room for error. In this case it's the long rail point. I know I can hit the long rail at correct speed and still drop the ball. The same can't be said for the short rail point. Only time this doesn't work very well is when the table has very deep shelves and worn cloth. Much like the room local to me...lol.

I follow the same practice if I'm attempting a side pocket shot from extreme angles, which make the pocket play small. Aim to clip the point and throw it in with spin induced throw.

Ok, so now you all should give the OP the knowledge that "point of aim", and "point of contact" are not one in the same when shooting cut shots.
(Go ahead PJ,...... have a field day!)

 

[jokrswylde]

Just before my opponent gets down over a similarity difficult shot that will win him the tourney or the set...
I like to say contemptuously from behind my opponent just loud enough so that he can hear me...

“It’s missable.”

"It don't HAVE to go"

 

[Straightpool_99]

A little above center for a rolling CB, just over pocket speed.

Can’t imagine why you’d add any side or low.

pj
chgo

To avoid a game losing skid?

 

[Patrick Johnson]

To avoid a game losing skid?

By introducing squirt/swerve/throw variables? I'll take my chances reducing the (already small) chances of a skid by rolling the CB.

pj
chgo

 

[Straightpool_99]

By introducing squirt/swerve/throw variables? I'll take my chances reducing the (already small) chances of a skid by rolling the CB.

pj
chgo

It may be small, but the way you are trying to hit it is really closing in on maximizing the chance of it. I guess it could be worse if you really slow rolled it with inside or something stupid like that, but that's about it.

Squirt/swerve on a shot like this is really a non-factor to a competent player. If you miss it, likely it will happen because of faulty set up or trying to really crank it in hard (which there is no reason to, without needing fancy position). Lets face it, you're going to make almost every one of these shots if you can run a rack or 3, especially cinching it. Even though skidding is a rare occurence, it is not rare relative to the other reasons for missing a simple shot like this, with no stated position requirements. The significance of the skid rises with the competence of the player.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

It may be small, but the way you are trying to hit it is really closing in on maximizing the chance of it.

Rolling the CB reduces the chance of a skid. Cut angle's the same either way. What else?

Even though skidding is a rare occurence, it is not rare relative to the other reasons for missing a simple shot like this

We disagree, but I'm willing to listen to any actual data.

pj
chgo

 

[Bob Jewett]

I think the correct way to play cut shots in general depends on the player and the conditions, as has already been mentioned above.

The weaker the player, the more the use of side will be a problem. For some such players, the use of sidespin on this shot would be madness.

For very strong players, the use of outside spin to avoid skids/kicks/bad contacts makes sense but only because they have squirt/swerve/throw dialed in. They are going to miss fewer shots for those reasons than they would for skids.

Also, if the table has new, slippery cloth that the player has not developed a feel for yet, outside will be risky for good players.

One other possibility for the shot shown is a stun shot. A stun cannot have skid for this shot because the cut angle is so small the balls will be gearing by the end of contact. If you have gearing at the end of the shot, extra friction makes no difference.

 

[dendweller]

your out ball. lot of different ways to make it..aim and speed, how'd ya?

roll it with an touch of left just to make sure I don't screw up and hit a touch of right.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

A stun cannot have skid for this shot because the cut angle is so small the balls will be gearing by the end of contact. If you have gearing at the end of the shot, extra friction makes no difference.

Hmm... that's counterintuitive. Does it apply to any shot with no sidespin?

pj
chgo

 

[justnum]

A kick shot into the side pocket is a high percentage shot. I argue its a better chance because there is more margin for error.

Would beginners play the shot as a kick?

Kick shot I can aim center ball and hit the rail at a speed that cue ball just dies after contacting OB.

 

[Fatboy]

Doesn't the forward roll create a skid at slow speed?
Top on cueball putting the reverse spin on the object ball causing it to slide a little.

That’s shot as it lays can skid in dry conditions. That’s the only real issue with the shot. Shoot it in a way that reduces the skid chances-lots of ways to do that.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Doesn't the forward roll create a skid at slow speed?
Top on cueball putting the reverse spin on the object ball causing it to slide a little.

Top on the CB reduces the amount of sideways friction, which should reduce throw and skid. The CB sliding in the cut direction isn't a problem.

pj
chgo

 

[Patrick Johnson]

Would beginners play the shot as a kick?

Not if they're in their right minds.

pj
chgo

 

[Bob Jewett]

Hmm... that's counterintuitive. Does it apply to any shot with no sidespin?

pj
chgo

It applies to any shot. If the balls would be gearing by the end of contact with normal surface conditions, they will also be gearing at the end of contact with skid/cling. Gearing will just be achieved earlier in the contact. Once you have gearing, the direction and spins are set.

In a sense this is like chalk and cue tips. As long as the tip doesn't slip, the actual quantity of friction doesn't matter. You either have a miscue or you don't.

 

[jasonlaus]

From behind.

Wait, what was the question?

 

[Fatboy]

From behind.

Wait, what was the question?

That’s a statement of fact

 

[justnum]

Not if they're in their right minds.

pj
chgo

That is why pool culture needs aptitude tests. It provides a creative outlet the technical demands do not.

 

[Patrick Johnson]

...pool culture needs aptitude tests.

Careful what you wish for.

pj
chgo

 

[justnum]

Careful what you wish for.

pj
chgo

Social and creative aptitude is important.
Today's players are teaching more than past generations.

A smart player today is way different than those of decades ago.

If they were more intentional it could be attractive to sponsors.