I just read this article about the Moscow Chess Championships, and I was astounded by the payouts: $1.5 million to the winner, $1 million to the runner up! With chess catering to a much smaller audience and being much more boring to watch IMO, how can they afford to pay this much to the winner? What's pool missing? :shrug:
If Pool can be a Chess Game, Why are Chess Players Better Off?
- Thread starter TheSneak
- Start date
Yikes
Wow; there are probably 10x as many people all over the world that know the outcome of this match as opposed to the pool world championship; yes 10x
That chess has? Is that your question? A couple of big ones are about a 1500-1600yrs of development and a reputation as a cerebral, wholesome, dignified and honorable game to play for all ages ALL OVER THE WORLD; that is a good start. It is also a lot easier and cheaper to carry around.
That’s just a saying pool can’t really be a chess game; it can involve chess like thinking, that’s why you have so many that are good at both. But the number of responses to a particular move are so much larger than responses to a particular shot that it would blow your mind.
Not to be insulting; but man this is a big world.
Wow; there are probably 10x as many people all over the world that know the outcome of this match as opposed to the pool world championship; yes 10x
That chess has? Is that your question? A couple of big ones are about a 1500-1600yrs of development and a reputation as a cerebral, wholesome, dignified and honorable game to play for all ages ALL OVER THE WORLD; that is a good start. It is also a lot easier and cheaper to carry around.
That’s just a saying pool can’t really be a chess game; it can involve chess like thinking, that’s why you have so many that are good at both. But the number of responses to a particular move are so much larger than responses to a particular shot that it would blow your mind.
Not to be insulting; but man this is a big world.
I love pool, but when people compare any pool game to chess... they're mostly being cute.
In terms of depth of thinking, pool and chess aren't on the same planet. But pool has execution and chess does not
Even though it's apples and oranges, I'm gonna say chess is harder to master. But there's no doubt pool could have more money in the sport if it's being run properly. I dunno why people pay big purses in chess. Maybe it's exciting to watch if you're high-level enough to understand what you're seeing. Maybe the sort of people who like chess and sponsor it... have deeper pockets than the sort who enjoy pool.
In terms of depth of thinking, pool and chess aren't on the same planet. But pool has execution and chess does not
Even though it's apples and oranges, I'm gonna say chess is harder to master. But there's no doubt pool could have more money in the sport if it's being run properly. I dunno why people pay big purses in chess. Maybe it's exciting to watch if you're high-level enough to understand what you're seeing. Maybe the sort of people who like chess and sponsor it... have deeper pockets than the sort who enjoy pool.
The bottom line to answer your question is that pool lacks a culture of appreciation. That's about it. Pool is one of many games (sport???? - we can debate that in another thread - ha ha) that involves putting a sphere through a ring or into a hole.
The thing that makes folks open up their wallet and spend on most recreation is not just entertainment, but social interaction. In my basketball obsessed corner of the world, I know many a basketball "fan" that don't care at all about the actual activity of the sport itself. They just use it as an excuse to gather and to enjoy each other's company with something common to root for or at least pay attention to. I think that pool lacks this commonality. There is no pervasive culture surrounding pool. In fact, the opposite is true. Pool, I would argue is somewhat subversive and is a subspecies of counter culture. Any time you are examining a counter culture, you are dealing with a group that does not ever want to be mainstream, thus no mainstream $. That's it in a nutshell, if you ask me.
Note: I play both chess and pool and love each. That's why onepocket is one of the most enjoyable games to play.
Cheers...
The thing that makes folks open up their wallet and spend on most recreation is not just entertainment, but social interaction. In my basketball obsessed corner of the world, I know many a basketball "fan" that don't care at all about the actual activity of the sport itself. They just use it as an excuse to gather and to enjoy each other's company with something common to root for or at least pay attention to. I think that pool lacks this commonality. There is no pervasive culture surrounding pool. In fact, the opposite is true. Pool, I would argue is somewhat subversive and is a subspecies of counter culture. Any time you are examining a counter culture, you are dealing with a group that does not ever want to be mainstream, thus no mainstream $. That's it in a nutshell, if you ask me.
Note: I play both chess and pool and love each. That's why onepocket is one of the most enjoyable games to play.
Cheers...
Chess is WAY bigger than pool.
Its easy!
I tought myself to play chess when I saw a cute little girl playing in a class room down the hall from me when I was 11yrs old...., I later got into the chess club, chess has a grade school program, a high school program and a college and professional program. Chess develops its young, not eats them!
I do though disagree with Jalapus Logan on one thing: "I think that pool lacks this commonality". "There is no pervasive culture surrounding pool."
The APA does a good job with creating a enviorment for people to come together. I just left the BCA bar table tourny in Vegas..., 600+ teams of 5 plus plenty of spectators, not bad.
I tought myself to play chess when I saw a cute little girl playing in a class room down the hall from me when I was 11yrs old...., I later got into the chess club, chess has a grade school program, a high school program and a college and professional program. Chess develops its young, not eats them!
I do though disagree with Jalapus Logan on one thing: "I think that pool lacks this commonality". "There is no pervasive culture surrounding pool."
The APA does a good job with creating a enviorment for people to come together. I just left the BCA bar table tourny in Vegas..., 600+ teams of 5 plus plenty of spectators, not bad.
Pretty simple IMHO. A cheap chess board can be purchased for $20 or less. What options are there for cheap pool, particularly for younger people (under 18 or 21 depending on local law). Bottom line, for most people, pool simply isn't readily accessible. If you take bars out of the equation, the available table time per capita is miniscule. The vast majority of people don't have the room in their house to have their own pool table even if they could afford it.
Aside from private or corporate sponsors, the big money is going to come from television. Television people make their decision based upon paying advertisers which base their decision upon the size and demographics of the viewing audience.
Just as an aside, I think too many people in the US have the perception of pool being in a smoky, low rent pool hall where low life hustlers attempt to take money from the poor unsuspecting sucker instead of seeing it as a gentleman's game of billiards. I'm not saying this is the correct perception simply that it is a perception and certainly doesn't help perpetuate the growth of the game.
Aside from private or corporate sponsors, the big money is going to come from television. Television people make their decision based upon paying advertisers which base their decision upon the size and demographics of the viewing audience.
Just as an aside, I think too many people in the US have the perception of pool being in a smoky, low rent pool hall where low life hustlers attempt to take money from the poor unsuspecting sucker instead of seeing it as a gentleman's game of billiards. I'm not saying this is the correct perception simply that it is a perception and certainly doesn't help perpetuate the growth of the game.
This ^^^:thumbup:
Ah.., your right!
"Just as an aside, I think too many people in the US have the perception of pool being in a smoky, low rent pool hall where low life hustlers attempt to take money from the poor unsuspecting sucker instead of seeing it as a gentleman's game of billiards. I'm not saying this is the correct perception simply that it is a perception and certainly doesn't help perpetuate the growth of the game."
I didnt say it, but its right..., I love this game, but it is filled with the above mentioned!! Its keeping the game down, no matter how much we like to hear the stories, watch the action or just man up around the tables, it aint good for the game on the big stage..., TV = cash!
"Just as an aside, I think too many people in the US have the perception of pool being in a smoky, low rent pool hall where low life hustlers attempt to take money from the poor unsuspecting sucker instead of seeing it as a gentleman's game of billiards. I'm not saying this is the correct perception simply that it is a perception and certainly doesn't help perpetuate the growth of the game."
I didnt say it, but its right..., I love this game, but it is filled with the above mentioned!! Its keeping the game down, no matter how much we like to hear the stories, watch the action or just man up around the tables, it aint good for the game on the big stage..., TV = cash!
If all pool players at major tournaments wore shapr attire (business suits or formal attire); played with absolutely no sharking, complete dignity and complete honesty; and carried on after a major loss as if they were actually congradulating the winner and cheering on the crowd, progress could be made.
I agree. I believe you are right on target.
You're right. That's how John McEnroe ruined tennis and it never recovered.
Why is worldwide chess a smaller audience. It may be the most played, downloaded, analysed stratagem, ubiquitous game on the planet(in it's regional forms). But it IS boring to watch and that's why it's not televised.
If it makes you feel better, a scruffy pool player placing in a local tourney will probably make more money in that tourney than a scruffy chess player. However, what you're talking about are anomalous or yearly chess events that have some rich mofo who believes in chess enough or feels there is prestige in backing such a tournament.
Pool doesn't offer the same "reward' to a benefactor.
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Another article
"the games are being screened on a national sports channel and large sections of the sports pages are devoted to it."
And like American pool
"Chess players gets a lot of respect from their colleagues, but you cannot make a living out of it."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18074307
"the games are being screened on a national sports channel and large sections of the sports pages are devoted to it."
And like American pool
"Chess players gets a lot of respect from their colleagues, but you cannot make a living out of it."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18074307
Actually Chess has a following and since computers its really pushed the envelope.There are a lot of cash chess sites out there right now. Your more experienced chess players have a problem though ,Computer programs have become a issue to the online chess world so things are pushing back to the "face to face" form .
As for spectators the chess rooms I play at we have many watchers with the games between members especially when a Grand master vs another Grand master.
I can not see any way to compare the 2 games what so ever .
I started this thread yesterday and got really busy and forgot about it. :embarrassed2: To clarify: by audience I mean people watching a given match, not the following behind the activity. Obviously chess has a larger following; I mean duh. In the article it mentions only like 200 people in attendance, whereas you think of the mosconi cup or the finals of the U.S. Open 9 Ball and there is standing room only plus all the live streamers.
Also, I wasn't trying to compare the two disciplines more than in the typical "cute" way. I was just commenting on what shocked me: the prize purse for the top chess players vs. the prize purse for the top pool players. It doesn't seem right.
Oh well, maybe pool will break through one of these days.
In the article it mentions only like 200 people in attendance, whereas you think of the mosconi cup or the finals of the U.S. Open 9 Ball and there is standing room only plus all the live streamers.Also, I wasn't trying to compare the two disciplines more than in the typical "cute" way. I was just commenting on what shocked me: the prize purse for the top chess players vs. the prize purse for the top pool players. It doesn't seem right.
Oh well, maybe pool will break through one of these days.
Pool is not Chess
Chess is played by more people than Pool and thus there is more money.
There is a misnomer in pool that One Pocket is like playing Chess, this is false?
To be good in Chess you have to study and memorize many games?
I watched Efren play Chess at Hardtimes Bellflower recently.
There are 5 year olds at the Kolty Chess club in Cambell California that would destroy him.
Your "Out Of Book", Barney :smile:
Chess is played by more people than Pool and thus there is more money.
There is a misnomer in pool that One Pocket is like playing Chess, this is false?
To be good in Chess you have to study and memorize many games?
I watched Efren play Chess at Hardtimes Bellflower recently.
There are 5 year olds at the Kolty Chess club in Cambell California that would destroy him.
Your "Out Of Book", Barney :smile:
Probably because your original supposition is wrong. According to known figures there are more then 1/4 billion players playing chess on line now and an estimated 2/3 of a billion players world wide playing. It is played in most every country in the world regardless of culture. Rich poor all that is needed is a board and pieces that can be even home made. Pool by comparison is almost non existent.
I do play pool, and even my perception of pool culture is bad !
But I'm not sure the "culture" is to blame for all of pool's problems.
For example, what's the culture of Nascar? Basketball? Mixed Martial Arts? poker? I can think of many "lower-end culture" sports that do very well, and many high-end sports that do not (who watches lacross? or polo?)
Regarding chess, which I play a little, doesnt really compare to pool, apples and oranges.