Lost Meucci Cues Found on Ebay

[Blue Hog ridr]

I sent him a message. If he checks my profile, he will see that I am in Canada and most likely won't make a connection that I know. I played innocent.

Hi Buddy. I was watching the Meucci Pool Cues that you had and somehow they disappeared. I don't know if that was something that I messed up in my watch list or not. I am from Canada and collect and play with Meucci cues.

The ones that you had are rather nice. I am currently looking for a Gambler.
If you get any more, I would appreciate a heads up.

All my best.
Terry.

Hope that I didn't screw anything up for you. Being from Canada mat not set off an alarm. He will probably think it is an innocent inquiry. Just to see if he still has them.
If he does, I will purchase them if you like.

JC. I noticed that he has a lot of rather obscure car parts for sale. Small packages that are easy to conceal if they are coming off a conveyor belt as you said. How would a person, or rather, why would a person want to come in contact with so many goofy little parts.

To me, they would seem like a long shot and a hard sell for many people.

 

[banditgrrr]

All you have to do is bid on one of his items. You can then do a "contact seller" and it will show you their name, email address and phone number.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Wow. I got an answer rather quick. here it is. Notice that he didn't say they were sold.

So, I send him one back asking if he were planning on putting them back up in the future. I told him that finding a decent gambler is tough and that I was specifically looking for one. We will see. Hopefully he doesn't suspect, otherwise he may have ignored my message.

Dear twostep30,

Hello,
Sorry, I had to remove them due to a guy harassing me and telling me that they were stolen. I am sorry for the inconvenience. Thank you for your interest.

- hoponn

 

[Thomas McKane]

We know his name, email, address, etc. I have to wait till Monday to file an official police report with an investigator so they can start the formal investigation. Ebay also is aware and won't let them be listed again. I have to say, UPS has by far been the worst piece of this entire saga, I have never seen such incompetence. I will never use UPS for anything again, EVER.

 

[Thomas McKane]

Wow. I got an answer rather quick. here it is. Notice that he didn't say they were sold.

So, I send him one back asking if he were planning on putting them back up in the future. I told him that finding a decent gambler is tough and that I was specifically looking for one. We will see. Hopefully he doesn't suspect, otherwise he may have ignored my message.

Thanks, he's just digging a deeper hole and I will absolutely prosecute everyone involved in this theft. He was warned immediately that the items were stolen, UPS has confirmed that the minimum wait on lost goods is 30 days so he's got no leg to stand on.

 

[cueaddicts]

Unreal....hope you get your stuff back. Hate thieves!!!

 

[terryhanna]

possessing stolen property in and of itself is not a crime
they would have to prove he was the one that stole them
or prove that he knew that they were stolen when he got them and that is almost impossible
good luck i sure hope you get your cues back and they catch the people that did it

 

[SJDinPHX]

duplicate post

 

[cuesblues]

I'm glad you found your cues but seriously..if the fbi wastes there time on a couple inexpensive stolen cues I'd be stunned. I would think They have bigger fish to fry lol

The last thing the FBI agent said to the OP was "I'll get your Meucci's back"
There is always a chance that the special agent assigned to the case is a
poolplayer

 

[SJDinPHX]

The seller is in Buckner MO, near a hub where the cues went through. The minimum time for a lost item at UPS to be sold as a lost item is 30 days, and all items are sold from one location...and it's NOT this location. It's 100% a stolen item situation.

The seller first said that I should leave him alone since I would get the insurance $ and that's just how it works (I haven't got any check from UPS yet so, no, I don't have the insurance $). Then he said that he pulled them off Ebay and sold them locally this morning since he didn't want them around anymore, knowing they were stolen he did it anyway so he really broke the law for sure now.

I am gearing up for seeing this through to the end and prosecuting all individuals involved. I'm also prepared to keep bugging the FBI until they look into this entire situation as it smells very fishy.

Mr. Mc Kane..You are taking this way beyond accusing UPS of wrong doing, or thievery !..Please read my post from your original thread... If you are wise, you will pursue some other options that may be available to you.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=5004082&postcount=38

You are out of line, in making all these accusations, without ironclad proof !.. I hope you get your cues back, or financial restitution, but, you are certainly not going about it the right way..YOU may wind up in court, for defamation, (or worse) and you will most certainly lose.

UPS has a full time battery of the highest end lawyers in the world, that can very easily make you look like a silly disgruntled fool, over a few hundred dollars worth of cues..They are used to defending UPS drivers, who drive millions of miles a day, who may accidently run over and kill someone, several times a year !...This is childs play to them !

PS..If you think fighting 'City Hall' is tough, try taking on a huge well respected company, like UPS..You will need
some VERY deep pockets.. :sorry: Good Luck !

 

[Scott Lee]

Actually it is, in PA. I had a Ginacue that was stolen in Idaho in the early 90's. By sheer luck it showed up in Billiards Digest (March 2005), in an article about refinishing cues. Through the magazine and another stroke of luck, I found the cue in possession of a big collector. He said he had purchased the cue many years ago...turns out it was less than 3 months after it was stolen! When it was proven that it was mine, the person who had it was told by the police that he would be taken into custody after the court hearing we were both attending (the police were representing me & he had his own attorney), to be photographed and fingerprinted, for possession of stolen property!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

possessing stolen property in and of itself is not a crime

 

[Thomas McKane]

I'm not accusing the guy who has the cues now of anything, other than he has MY property. I have plenty of photo evidence to show those are my cues. They were packaged extremely well, better than I would package most anything else as I wanted to protect them. I am not accusing the entire UPS corporate of stealing either, I'm simply pointing out that somehow MY cues got removed from a sealed package while in UPS' hands and ended up on Ebay 1 week later.

 

[terryhanna]

Actually it is, in PA. I had a Ginacue that was stolen in Idaho in the early 90's. By sheer luck it showed up in Billiards Digest (March 2005), in an article about refinishing cues. Through the magazine and another stroke of luck, I found the cue in possession of a big collector. He said he had purchased the cue many years ago...turns out it was less than 3 months after it was stolen! When it was proven that it was mine, the person who had it was told by the police that he would be taken into custody after the court hearing we were both attending (the police were representing me & he had his own attorney), to be photographed and fingerprinted, for possession of stolen property!

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Why does the law require us to prove a knowledge or reasonable belief of the property being stolen? There are many reasons someone may unwittingly have possession of stolen property. For example, a woman may receive stolen jewelry as a gift. A man could purchase stolen electronics at a pawn shop or second-hand store.That is why possessing stolen property in and of itself is not a crime
better check you laws

 

[Thomas McKane]

maybe a ton of azers should log into their ebay account and ask hoponn to why he is holding stolen goods and why not return them. You think at this point he would have went down to the buckner mo police department and turned them in if he got them legit in his mind, or of course........ I sold them as they were stolen ??? duh.

I don't recommend this approach at all, sorry. I think the police will handle this along with UPS starting Monday. Even though I admit it isn't a bad idea, just not sure if it's ok to do that.

 

[Thomas McKane]

Why does the law require us to prove a knowledge or reasonable belief of the property being stolen? There are many reasons someone may unwittingly have possession of stolen property. For example, a woman may receive stolen jewelry as a gift. A man could purchase stolen electronics at a pawn shop or second-hand store.That is why possessing stolen property in and of itself is not a crime
better check you laws

Agreed: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_of_stolen_goods

 

[Manoman2444]

Why does the law require us to prove a knowledge or reasonable belief of the property being stolen? There are many reasons someone may unwittingly have possession of stolen property. For example, a woman may receive stolen jewelry as a gift. A man could purchase stolen electronics at a pawn shop or second-hand store.That is why possessing stolen property in and of itself is not a crime
better check you laws

"Knowingly receiving" are the key words in the law.

 

[Thomas McKane]

Mr. Mc Kane..You are taking this way beyond accusing UPS of wrong doing, or thievery !..Please read my post from your original thread... If you are wise, you will pursue some other options that may be available to you.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=5004082&postcount=38

You are out of line, in making all these accusations, without ironclad proof !.. I hope you get your cues back, or financial restitution, but, you are certainly not going about it the right way..YOU may wind up in court, for defamation, (or worse) and you will most certainly lose.

UPS has a full time battery of the highest end lawyers in the world, that can very easily make you look like a silly disgruntled fool, over a few hundred dollars worth of cues..They are used to defending UPS drivers, who drive millions of miles a day, who may accidently run over and kill someone, several times a year !...This is childs play to them !

PS..If you think fighting 'City Hall' is tough, try taking on a huge well respected company, like UPS..You will need
some VERY deep pockets.. :sorry: Good Luck !

Thanks for the advice, I very much understand that UPS is a large corporation and has many capable employees (and capable legal teams), however, that's not my point in all of this. I'm just recording for the record what happened to me personally. These cues mean a lot to me, I've had them most of my adult life (20+ years). Parting with them at all was a big deal for me, and then to find them on Ebay 1 week later is just too much. This is NOT how a shipping company should operate. I also want everyone on AZ to learn from this if possible. I'll be honest, it's really difficult to know what avenue to take.

 

[SJDinPHX]

Thanks for the advice, I very much understand that UPS is a large corporation and has many capable employees (and capable legal teams), however, that's not my point in all of this. I'm just recording for the record what happened to me personally. These cues mean a lot to me, I've had them most of my adult life (20+ years). Parting with them at all was a big deal for me, and then to find them on Ebay 1 week later is just too much. This is NOT how a shipping company should operate. I also want everyone on AZ to learn from this if possible. I'll be honest, it's really difficult to know what avenue to take.

As I said, I do hope you get your cues back somehow, and soon !..I know I have had a few stolen over the years, and I know how livid I was !..You have every right to be upset, at the way yours were stolen. Especially as it was not a result of your carelessness, but by something beyond your control.. I certainly did not mean to imply you don't have a right to be mad as hell, and I sure hope all works out well for you..Hope the cops can scare that guy into giving up who he sold them to. (if he did actually sell them)...Good Luck !

SJD

PS..I am a former road player, and a few of the cues I had stolen were pretty high end. Of course I am older than dirt..I paid less than $150 for my first Balabushka (that included shipping)...I see now, why all these younger players, won't let them
off their shoulder for 10 seconds.....It wasn't always that bad, otherwise I'd have lost 50 of 'em !..I used to leave 'em with
the nearest good looking barmaid.

 

[I Got Lucky]

We know his name, email, address, etc. I have to wait till Monday to file an official police report with an investigator so they can start the formal investigation. Ebay also is aware and won't let them be listed again. I have to say, UPS has by far been the worst piece of this entire saga, I have never seen such incompetence. I will never use UPS for anything again, EVER.

If u want to get the attention of UPS, start a UPS sux webpage, facebook page and other social media to lambast the UPS muckity mucks. One they start getting embarrassed you might get some action from them.

 

[ridewiththewind]

For the keyboard lawyers that rely on Wikipedia for information, here is the Missouri Statute concerning possession of stolen property:


570.080. 1. A person commits the crime of receiving stolen property if for the purpose of depriving the owner of a lawful interest therein, he or she receives, retains or disposes of property of another knowing that it has been stolen, or believing that it has been stolen.

2. Evidence of the following is admissible in any criminal prosecution pursuant to this section to prove the requisite knowledge or belief of the alleged receiver:

(1) That he or she was found in possession or control of other property stolen on separate occasions from two or more persons;

(2) That he or she received other stolen property in another transaction within the year preceding the transaction charged;

(3) That he or she acquired the stolen property for a consideration which he or she knew was far below its reasonable value;

(4) That he or she obtained control over stolen property knowing the property to have been stolen or under such circumstances as would reasonably induce a person to believe the property was stolen.

3. Receiving stolen property is a class A misdemeanor unless the property involved has a value of five hundred dollars or more, or the person receiving the property is a dealer in goods of the type in question, in which cases receiving stolen property is a class C felony.

(L. 1977 S.B. 60, A.L. 2002 H.B. 1888, A.L. 2005 H.B. 353)


Took me all of 5 minutes to look up.