Reverse Slip Stroke / Stroke Slip

[MattPoland]

I’m bringing over a topic from Pool Is Not Dead. Aside from the merits of the technique. I’m curious about its name. It seems a lot of people have different terms for it.

“Reverse Slip Stroke”
From Byrne’s Advanded Techniques in Poom and Billiards (1990)

From George Fels via Billiards Digest (also 1990)

Billiards Digest - Tips & Shafts by George Fels

“Stroke Slip”
From Bob Jewett via 2005

http://www.sfbilliards.com/articles/2005.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1-wgjeoEeZU_hDixREWHPCBhuBbCyii3W4u_QoApxbAP485nhbsBDx9C4

And I’ve run across people calling it “Throwing the Cue”, “Spear Chucking”, Modified Slip Stroke” and “Dart Stroke” (prior to the jumping technique).

I’m just curious if anyone has any other terms for it and historical references to it being described.

It’s interesting because the conversation had so much friction because so many people entered it with different vocabulary for the same thing.

 

[straightline]

Only dumb jocks would argue the terminology per the sequence of motions. Slip stroke is good enough for me. Release stroke might be better but whatever. I use it to varying degrees short of actually tossing the stick.

 

[MattPoland]

Only dumb jocks would argue the terminology per the sequence of motions. Slip stroke is good enough for me. Release stroke might be better but whatever. I use it to varying degrees short of actually tossing the stick.

“Slip Stroke” is a different term and a different technique. Slip Stroke is when you slip your hand backward during the backstroke, snatch the cue, and pull it forward. Nobody is arguing the terminology for that technique.

The different technique being discussed is simply letting the cue slide forward through your hand during final delivery. That’s what people are calling “Reverse Slip Stroke”, “Stroke Slip”, “Throwing the Cue”, “Modified Slip Stroke” and/or “Dart Stroke”.

Granted, someone might even combine the two also.

 

[BasementDweller]

“Slip Stroke” is a different term and a different technique. Slip Stroke is when you slip your hand backward during the backstroke, snatch the cue, and pull it forward. Nobody is arguing the terminology for that technique.

The different technique being discussed is simply letting the cue slide forward through your hand during final delivery. That’s what people are calling “Reverse Slip Stroke”, “Stroke Slip”, “Throwing the Cue”, “Modified Slip Stroke” and/or “Dart Stroke”.

Granted, someone might even combine the two also.

Lol. Pretty humorous your first response was about a "slip-stroke". I know we've been calling the throwing cue technique as a stroke-slip on AZ for quite a long time. I always thought that led to unnecessary confusion but oh well.

 

[nick serdula]

You push forward. Slide back. Just like butter. No pulling involved. If the cue was a rope, it would be pulling. It isn't. It is a push.

 

[MattPoland]

You push forward. Slide back. Just like butter. No pulling involved. If the cue was a rope, it would be pulling. It isn't. It is a push.

Fair enough. I would have been just as happy to say “deliver it forward”

 

[measureman]

Never mind I thought this thread was about watching porn.

 

[straightline]

“Slip Stroke” is a different term and a different technique. Slip Stroke is when you slip your hand backward during the backstroke, snatch the cue, and pull it forward. Nobody is arguing the terminology for that technique.

The different technique being discussed is simply letting the cue slide forward through your hand during final delivery. That’s what people are calling “Reverse Slip Stroke”, “Stroke Slip”, “Throwing the Cue”, “Modified Slip Stroke” and/or “Dart Stroke”.

Granted, someone might even combine the two also.

I know what the "slip stroke" is. This "new" release stroke is also a slip stroke; on the delivery instead of the wind up. Hence still a slip stroke.

 

[MattPoland]

I know what the "slip stroke" is. This "new" release stroke is also a slip stroke; on the delivery instead of the wind up. Hence still a slip stroke.

I see what you’re saying. So you’re saying slip stroke would be the term you apply for both techniques. Whereas I walked into the conversation expecting “slip stroke” to only apply to one technique and expecting a different term to apply to the other technique. That contributes well to this thread in terms of how muddy a conversation can get on this topic due to equivocation.

 

[straightline]

I see what you’re saying. So you’re saying slip stroke would be the term you apply for both techniques. Whereas I walked into the conversation expecting “slip stroke” to only apply to one technique and expecting a different term to apply to the other technique. That contributes well to this thread in terms of how muddy a conversation can get on this topic due to equivocation.

Glad we understand this. I have a raw spot about it. I first became aware of this technique a year or two ago when I came across a J Chua video on the secret to power draw. I immediately lumped it in with <slipstroke> close enough right? Anyway I posted this in the aiming basement and had to duck some shit about it. Pissed me off. What can be more counterproductive than getting your knuckles rapped for it?
Aeeee nyway, I use it in an adapted version. I cradle the cue in my back two fingers and the release is simply opening the hand and backing off the grip pressure. I can now swing comfortably with tip mashing force (big downside IMO) if need be.

 

[ShootingArts]

I see what you’re saying. So you’re saying slip stroke would be the term you apply for both techniques. Whereas I walked into the conversation expecting “slip stroke” to only apply to one technique and expecting a different term to apply to the other technique. That contributes well to this thread in terms of how muddy a conversation can get on this topic due to equivocation.

I was one of the ones introducing or encouraging the use of the "stroke slip" terminology as some people at the time thought all slip strokes involved releasing the stick going forward and slowing the hand so the stick slipped through your grip. I believe the standard slip stroke preceded the forward slip stroke in usage. Needing to distinguish between the two to help people understand, the slip on the forward stroke being kinda the opposite of the slip stroke it was dubbed the stroke-slip. Some people did use both the slip stroke and stroke-slip, seeming to complicate life unduly!

This is the history of the term stroke-slip coming into usage on AZB as I know it. It certainly isn't written in stone or worth getting heated under the collar over. I used it and continue to use it because I do believe the term slip stroke was applied to the release on the back stroke first and of course it comes first in the mechanical motion so it seems to have naming priority. Calling the release on the forward stroke a slip stroke too was causing arguments as some people believed that releasing the stick going forward was the only slip stroke. Kinda funny that a term brought into usage to end old arguments is causing arguments now! It figures I guess. Silly old world!

Hu

 

[straightline]

My first encounter with the old slipstroke was a black guy named Tom. He practice stroked normally and when ready to shoot, slid his hand to the back of the cue and then pulled the trigger. I never saw the point in that but it was cool to watch. Since the toss stroke is on video by Ko and Chua, I figure the term is self explanatory.
Regardless, I can now draw the ball with a firm stroke whereas with my old stroke, I could only draw on fresh cloth and only with a very low slidey hit.

 

[ShootingArts]

My first encounter with the old slipstroke was a black guy named Tom. He practice stroked normally and when ready to shoot, slid his hand to the back of the cue and then pulled the trigger. I never saw the point in that but it was cool to watch. Since the toss stroke is on video by Ko and Chua, I figure the term is self explanatory.
Regardless, I can now draw the ball with a firm stroke whereas with my old stroke, I could only draw on fresh cloth and only with a very low slidey hit.

One advantage of the slip stroke is that you hit the cue ball with your arm in the same range of motion as the practice strokes, can even use the exact same speed. Hard to do with other strokes where you extend past the range of motion of all of the practice strokes to hit the cue ball. The cue ball on the rail or very close to the rail is another place the slip stroke shines, you feel like you are taking a full stroke back even if the cue isn't moving.

One reason I try to practice the slip stroke is simply as an artform that shouldn't be lost too. Not me, but I have seen some with a slip stroke that seems to be magic, seems like an extra joint in their arm or something! The slipstroke isn't necessary, just nice.

Hu

 

[straightline]

No argument there.

 

[bbb]

I know what the "slip stroke" is. This "new" release stroke is also a slip stroke; on the delivery instead of the wind up. Hence still a slip stroke.

i like this term to differentiate it from the traditional slip stroke

 

[straightline]

i like this term to differentiate it from the traditional slip stroke

Prollum there is the other slip stroke is also a release move. Maybe slipcock and slipshoot? lol...

 

[bbb]

Prollum there is the other slip stroke is also a release move. Maybe slipcock and slipshoot? lol...

please explain?

 

[straightline]

please explain?

Original is backward, new is ballward. backslip, front slip ad infinitum...