Secrets!

[ENGLISH!]

The way I describe it for me, "let the cue do the work", is to not force the shot. Stroke smoothly, and the cue will do the rest.

The more I try to impose my will on it, the worse it ends up. If I let the cue do the work, I get better results.

Hi Bruce,

I just deleted a bit of a long post as I realized that I was starting to vent on you for those that have proposed the philosophy of that phrase.

If that is what you have to do to play your best then that is what you have to do.

But I would suggest that when you are playing for nothing or practicing that you try to impose your will on the cue ball & the only way that you can do that is through the cue stick. You have to control the cue stick to truly control the cue ball.

The test of one's stroke is how much one can put on the ball without loosing precision. If one HAS to let the cue do the work, then in all probability there is a flaw somewhere in one's stroke.

All of the above are just my opinions & 'I might be wrong'.

Regards, Shoot Well, & Best Wishes,
Rick

 

[CJ Wiley]

Buddy Hall used to say that technique was like "throwing your cue at it"

Not to argue with a Champion.... :grin:

I think we are in different lanes on this highway.

I'm not expecting my cue to decide what to do and how to do it. I'm letting the cue do what it is supposed to do once I put it in motion....and I am not trying to force it. That relates to being relaxed versus gripping too tightly.

Does that make more sense, Sensei? :smile:

There's two schools of thought on this.....Buddy Hall used to say that technique was like "throwing your cue at it".....referring to Efren and how he "appears" to play.

I'm not knocking that way of playing, I just think it's more difficult to maintain without a LOT of practice. I also believe it has a lot to do with personality, everyone has their own speed and "pressure" in doing things, whether it's holding a fork and knife or playing pool.

There's really no "wrong" way, however, there's always ways to improve your current style......improvement is a journey, not a destination when it comes to subjects like this. I do recommend you continue as you are, just be open to modifying or adjusting things if it seems appropriate. 'The Game is the Teacher'

 

[naji]

There's two schools of thought on this.....Buddy Hall used to say that technique was like "throwing your cue at it".....referring to Efren and how he "appears" to play.

I'm not knocking that way of playing, I just think it's more difficult to maintain without a LOT of practice. I also believe it has a lot to do with personality, everyone has their own speed and "pressure" in doing things, whether it's holding a fork and knife or playing pool.

There's really no "wrong" way, however, there's always ways to improve your current style......improvement is a journey, not a destination when it comes to subjects like this. I do recommend you continue as you are, just be open to modifying or adjusting things if it seems appropriate. 'The Game is the Teacher'

Discovering all pool secrets is like trying to find a cure for cancer; you almost think you got it, but it fades away when you try the cure on patients (players)!! or after another theory pops up. But the longer you live with pool and the luxury of having your own table and most importantly finding Patient (players) to test new findings!! is the key.
Even if all the mechanics and techniques are flawless your thought process (position and pattern play) could be impaired due to so many factors that body chemistry has a lot to do with it; the unfortunate thing is body chemistry effects is not synchronized event; in another words, it could be that your match loss or win, what you ate, your feelings, mode a day before could effect your match a day later go figure! Knowing what effect your game/thought process is one of the biggest secrets that takes years to try to get it to be close to perfect if "luck" prevails. I consider Shane, Dennis, DAS, Lee Van, and most Chinese are good at it.

 

[(((Satori)))]

There are 3 kinds of people when it comes to pool players; disinterested, interested, and passionate. Only the passionate players make it to the top. Whats the difference?

The disinterested would only play if there was basically nothing else to do.

The interested players like the game, maybe even like it a lot. They will go play with their friends, they will study the game, they will look for easy ways to improve and will try to practice as long as its pleasant but the interested still lack the dedication it takes to reach the top.

The passionate is another breed though. They are the players who are dead set on reaching the top. They will climb through the clouds to reach the summit. Practice for hrs and hrs is not work to them it is enjoyment. That doesn't mean it will always be pleasurable and not inconvenient at times, but to the passionate player it is worth it.

Here is a secret. To be great you need the passion. I'm not sure if it is something you are born with or nurtured into your life but I am sure that you will never reach the top without passion and dedication. With that passion and dedication you need to practice. Practice, practice, practice and the knowledge will be provided, and again I will say this, the knowledge comes in many ways through God, new dvd's, books, other players, instruction, whatever. But without the dedication to practice and the passion to reach the top you will never get there.

 

[West Point 1987]

In the Infantry, we focus on the last 100 meters of the attack...that's where it's at. You need to know how to get to the last 100 meters, and you can lose if you get there wrong; but it's won or lost in the last 100 meters.

Pool mechanics are most important in the last 2-3 inches of the stroke. How you get there is irrelevant as long as you're delivering the cue straight through the intended contact point with the intended angle. I think if you start there and work backwards, you figure out where to go. Did you make the shot and did the CB do what you intended? Then regardless of your mechanics, they work. Too many folks worry about elbow drop, piston vs. pendulum, grip pressure, elevation, etc. It all happens where the tip contacts the CB. There are infinite ways to deliver the cue to that spot...that's why you see top players with all kinds of strokes that no instructor would ever endorse.

 

[Tony_in_MD]

Secret 1: play within yourself using your given set of abilities.

Secret 2: when you discover a weakness in your game correct it through focused practice until it becomes a strength.

Rinse and repeat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.

 

[sfleinen]

Secret 1: play within yourself using your given set of abilities.

Secret 2: when you discover a weakness in your game correct it through focused practice until it becomes a strength.

Rinse and repeat.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.

Other than the "letdown" that this was sent from an iPhone ( ), this is probably the post of the thread.

Player says, "I suck at banks." I counter, "so, WTF are you doing about it?" -- as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I hate 8-ball -- I just don't play it well," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I wish I could play consistently enough to be able to play 14.1 decently," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

<sigh> <shakes head>,
-Sean

 

[West Point 1987]

Other than the "letdown" that this was sent from an iPhone ( ), this is probably the post of the thread.

Player says, "I suck at banks." I counter, "so, WTF are you doing about it?" -- as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I hate 8-ball -- I just don't play it well," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I wish I could play consistently enough to be able to play 14.1 decently," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

<sigh> <shakes head>,
-Sean

It's funny...I see guys all the time who are really phenomenal players, usually rotation games, can run 3-4-5 packs fairly regularly, but can't bank to save their life...or they have some other astonishing weakness that doesn't seem logical based on how well they play in general. Guys that can jump anything and make it, get shape, but if they have to kick at an open ball, they're toast.

It's fun to practice what you're good at, but a pain in the a$$ to bear down on a weak point. Human nature.......

 

[justadub]

There's two schools of thought on this.....Buddy Hall used to say that technique was like "throwing your cue at it".....referring to Efren and how he "appears" to play.

I'm not knocking that way of playing, I just think it's more difficult to maintain without a LOT of practice. I also believe it has a lot to do with personality, everyone has their own speed and "pressure" in doing things, whether it's holding a fork and knife or playing pool.

There's really no "wrong" way, however, there's always ways to improve your current style......improvement is a journey, not a destination when it comes to subjects like this. I do recommend you continue as you are, just be open to modifying or adjusting things if it seems appropriate. 'The Game is the Teacher'

I realize now that I'm not expressing what I mean very well, so I will back away from discussing "letting the cue do the work".

It's not what you and Rick are suggesting.

As always, I appreciate your participation on the forum.

 

[JoeyA]

Other than the "letdown" that this was sent from an iPhone ( ), this is probably the post of the thread.

Player says, "I suck at banks." I counter, "so, WTF are you doing about it?" -- as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I hate 8-ball -- I just don't play it well," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

Player says, "I wish I could play consistently enough to be able to play 14.1 decently," as I watch them continuously throw balls 1 through 9 up on the table and pocketing them in rotation, under the guise of "practice."

<sigh> <shakes head>,
-Sean

The definition of INSANITY!
JoeyA

 

[JoeyA]

I realize now that I'm not expressing what I mean very well, so I will back away from discussing "letting the cue do the work".

It's not what you and Rick are suggesting.

As always, I appreciate your participation on the forum.

Actually, I do understand what you were trying to say, at least I think I do.

I too believe in letting the cue do the work but by those words, I actually mean that I try not to use more muscle than is needed to move the cue stick in the manner that is needed.

Even John Schmidt suggested that you feel the cue's gravity in your hand when you are stroking. If you over muscle the cue, you will not likely feel the gravity of the cue in your hand.

Cue sticks have a certain amount of mass and I think that over muscling the cue can lead to different results than what is expected. In some cases, a firm grip like in CJ's case, it may provide his expected results.

Each to his own. That's why instructors need to learn different ways to express themselves. Not everyone understands "letting the cue stick do the work", which is a saying that is as old as the hills. :wink:

JoeyA

 

[justadub]

Actually, I do understand what you were trying to say, at least I think I do.

I too believe in letting the cue do the work but by those words, I actually mean that I try not to use more muscle than is needed to move the cue stick in the manner that is needed.

Even John Schmidt suggested that you feel the cue's gravity in your hand when you are stroking. If you over muscle the cue, you will not likely feel the gravity of the cue in your hand.

Cue sticks have a certain amount of mass and I think that over muscling the cue can lead to different results than what is expected. In some cases, a firm grip like in CJ's case, it may provide his expected results.

Each to his own. That's why instructors need to learn different ways to express themselves. Not everyone understands "letting the cue stick do the work", which is a saying that is as old as the hills. :wink:

JoeyA

Thank you.

It was the "muscling of the cue" that I wasn't expressing very well.

 

[CJ Wiley]

"WOW, I never thought about the Game quite like that before".

I realize now that I'm not expressing what I mean very well, so I will back away from discussing "letting the cue do the work".

It's not what you and Rick are suggesting.

As always, I appreciate your participation on the forum.

I appreciate your participation, because if it wasn't for players like yourself I'd be long gone back into the martial arts world. I can tell you're still curious about how you can improve and sometimes my methods are simply to make you stop and think for a moment.....of your game in a slightly different way.

At the "end of the day" some of the greatest improvements don't come physically by "letting the cue do the work or not, or if I use the Hammer or TOI Technique," they come by a mental "WOW, I never thought about the Game quite like that before"......and this leads to a shift in perception that creates a chain of reactions leading to "revelations" about the game.....and even about life.

Thanks again for your input, it actually led me to a topic in last night's discussion with Joe Tucker.....after all, life's either completely connected, or it's not connected at all. 'The Game is the Teacher'

 

[sunnyone]

Shh ... Don't Tell Anyone This Secret!

This little tidbit may sound silly, but it might work. It has for me, anyway.

When I make a ball, but screw up on the shape big time, here’s a mental exercise that I’ve used:

I tell myself that my opponent has just missed an extremely easy shot. I shouldn’t even be at the table. I’m lucky to be out of my chair.

So the position isn’t that good. So what? I’m shooting and she has to sit. The shot doesn’t look so difficult to me now that I ‘know’ how badly she messed up.

Admittedly, this requires a dose of self-delusion, an art I’ve mastered over the years.

Spreading the gospel a la Sunny is my life,

Sunny

 

[West Point 1987]

This little tidbit may sound silly, but it might work. It has for me, anyway.

When I make a ball, but screw up on the shape big time, here’s a mental exercise that I’ve used:

I tell myself that my opponent has just missed an extremely easy shot. I shouldn’t even be at the table. I’m lucky to be out of my chair.

So the position isn’t that good. So what? I’m shooting and she has to sit. The shot doesn’t look so difficult to me now that I ‘know’ how badly she messed up.

Admittedly, this requires a dose of self-delusion, an art I’ve mastered over the years.

Spreading the gospel a la Sunny is my life,

Sunny

I do this too! You have to put the miss or missed leave behind you as soon as the ball stops rolling...this is one mental image (your opponent missed and that's what you're left with) is one way of doing it. I try and always look forward...the makes and misses before really have nothing to do with the task at hand. When I'm in gear and I run out a rack, I really couldn't tell you at the end whether or not I ran out...I've already dumped all the short term memory...it's also why I have to use a coin or beads to keep score, even in a race to 3 or 5.

 

[justadub]

This little tidbit may sound silly, but it might work. It has for me, anyway.

When I make a ball, but screw up on the shape big time, here’s a mental exercise that I’ve used:

I tell myself that my opponent has just missed an extremely easy shot. I shouldn’t even be at the table. I’m lucky to be out of my chair.

So the position isn’t that good. So what? I’m shooting and she has to sit. The shot doesn’t look so difficult to me now that I ‘know’ how badly she messed up.

Admittedly, this requires a dose of self-delusion, an art I’ve mastered over the years.

Spreading the gospel a la Sunny is my life,

Sunny

I like it.

Of course, I'll have to get good at it, as I always seem to be leaving myself on the wrong side...

Seriously, realizing that I've screwed up position often puts me in a bad attitude, so your method has a lot of merit for me. Thanks

 

[ENGLISH!]

Personally I don't like delusions.

I 'real eyes' when I mess up & then I just deal with it.

But like Kirk said in the Star Trek Movie, The Last Frontier, 'I need my pain...I want my pain'.

No pain...no gain.

 

[chilli dipper]

Personally I don't like delusions.

I 'real eyes' when I mess up & then I just deal with it.

But like Kirk said in the Star Trek Movie, The Last Frontier, 'I need my pain...I want my pain'.

No pain...no gain.

You must have some good snooker secrets you can share here Mr English? What part of the UK are you from sir?

 

[ENGLISH!]

You must have some good snooker secrets you can share here Mr English? What part of the UK are you from sir?

Sorry. No. Read down & you'll see that I'm from New Orleans.

I have not played Snooker in nearly 40 years.

Best Wishes,
Rick