yeah, I'm sure a few of them could cash. The top 96 cash. But none of them would have a chance at winning. You could not convince me otherwise.
Should women be allowed to compete in US Open 9 Ball Championship?
- Thread starter sunnyday
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yeah, I'm sure a few of them could cash. The top 96 cash. But none of them would have a chance at winning. You could not convince me otherwise.
When you are wanting to let the women pros play in the men's tournaments, you can't have it both ways. Do you think they would let the men enter their tournaments (not). It should be named Men's US Open 9 Ball Invitational and then US Open 9 Ball Invitational and then if they want to compete with the men it would be fine. With all the great male players there are, if the men were allowed to play in the female tournaments, they would win all the tournaments. I know, I know, there are some great female pros, but there are so many more great male Pros, it would not even be close.
jdlough
Jim
It's a game of finesse, skill, touch, intelligence, imagination, nerve.
Most guys have a reach advantage over the girls. (Sorry, Parica)
And, according to Earl S., most of the guys break like girls anyway, so what's there to lose?
And the "they won't let us play in theirs, so they can't play in ours" argument is wussy...
What are you so afraid of?
Most guys have a reach advantage over the girls. (Sorry, Parica)
And, according to Earl S., most of the guys break like girls anyway, so what's there to lose?
And the "they won't let us play in theirs, so they can't play in ours" argument is wussy...
What are you so afraid of?
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Joe T
New member
I say some could win but for a some weird reasons.
#1 they can get out and pick up the pieces when offered as good as anyone can & #2 I feel they'll get more opportunities to pick up those pieces because when the women play with the men I feel they are in an underdog position and 99% of the men they play will feel more pressure or worry more about losing than they normally would and we all know that mindset is not when we play our best.
True this kind of thinking and playing is a weakness and I feel if there were more mixed events the men and the women would be the better for it in the long run but that's just where I feel we're at now.
In the meantime it's a biotch of a question.
I remember the ipt featured Allison & Karen playing Johnny & Earl and while I try my best to treat all pool players equally (I have a lot of experience training and treating women players just like anyone else and that helps me do this) I just kinda felt bad for those guys in those matches, the girls played great and the guys just couldn't bring it.
I could see that happening quite a bit at the beginning but then seeing subside after some years.
Ego is imagined but real.
Wouldn't mind seeing a nice top 32 Women & Mens Tour? Think it would be great for the game.
#1 they can get out and pick up the pieces when offered as good as anyone can & #2 I feel they'll get more opportunities to pick up those pieces because when the women play with the men I feel they are in an underdog position and 99% of the men they play will feel more pressure or worry more about losing than they normally would and we all know that mindset is not when we play our best.
True this kind of thinking and playing is a weakness and I feel if there were more mixed events the men and the women would be the better for it in the long run but that's just where I feel we're at now.
In the meantime it's a biotch of a question.
I remember the ipt featured Allison & Karen playing Johnny & Earl and while I try my best to treat all pool players equally (I have a lot of experience training and treating women players just like anyone else and that helps me do this) I just kinda felt bad for those guys in those matches, the girls played great and the guys just couldn't bring it.
I could see that happening quite a bit at the beginning but then seeing subside after some years.
Ego is imagined but real.
Wouldn't mind seeing a nice top 32 Women & Mens Tour? Think it would be great for the game.
Personally, I have felt for a long time that the future of pool rests with truly open events where women compete on equal terms against the men. Pool is one of the few sports where this is possible, and still very competitive. I have seen the biggest crowds at matches pitting a top woman pro against a male pro. And yes, the top women are all capable of beating any man on a given day.
Regardless of how any of us feel though, this is Barry Behrman's tournament. He puts up all the money (70K added this year) and makes all the other arrangements necessary to produce it. Ultimately it remains his choice whether to allow women to compete. The other factor (and it's a big one) is the WPBA position on allowing their players to compete in another U.S. Open besides their own. I suspect they would not allow it. That makes this entire conversation a moot point.
Regardless of how any of us feel though, this is Barry Behrman's tournament. He puts up all the money (70K added this year) and makes all the other arrangements necessary to produce it. Ultimately it remains his choice whether to allow women to compete. The other factor (and it's a big one) is the WPBA position on allowing their players to compete in another U.S. Open besides their own. I suspect they would not allow it. That makes this entire conversation a moot point.
I agree with Corvette1340
the women have theirs, we have ours. so if the girls are allowed to play in ours, will they in turn let Lee Van and Mika go play in theirs.............didnt think so.
I VOTE NO
the women have theirs, we have ours. so if the girls are allowed to play in ours, will they in turn let Lee Van and Mika go play in theirs.............didnt think so.
I VOTE NO
So, honest opinion here Jay. Do you feel like a woman could WIN the US Open? Im not talking about a couple of matches, or cashing, or having a woman pull some big upsets for a few rounds. I'm talking about actually winning the tournament. I'm also not talking about 1,000,000-1 odds because that is the same as no chance. And this is RIGHT NOW, not in 10 years.
exactly
But I still ahve to vote NO. This has been a Mens OPEN event since the inception. Some things in life just need to remain the same. It's nothing personal against women, I love them and respect their ability to compete. I just think this has to be kept a Men only event. JMO
But I still ahve to vote NO. This has been a Mens OPEN event since the inception. Some things in life just need to remain the same. It's nothing personal against women, I love them and respect their ability to compete. I just think this has to be kept a Men only event. JMO
I guarantee you, if they were to open up the women tournaments to men, the really good male players who can not compete with the men pros would swoop down on those tournaments and that would be the end of Women Pro events. Then Mitch Lawerence would be working at Mickey D's, where he belongs.
A women could win the U.S Open! A long shot definitely but certainly not impossible. It's more like 100-1 if all the top women were to play.
While it may be a long shot for a woman to win the U.S. Open, they certainly are capable of beating anyone.
During the IPT in 8-ball, there were quite a few upsets...with Gerdie beating Earl being one of the more memorable matches. If the ladies are capable of beating the men in 8-ball, they certainly are capable of beating any of the top men players in 9-ball.
Women as a class of pool player have a lower average level of play than the professional men do. So do handicapped players, league players, and your average ball bangers.
Here is how the US Open is discriminatory.
Any male can enter the open regardless of whether they have a chance in hell of winning it. The Tri-State league in New York has A B C and D divisions which are segregated. However any C can play in an A tournament if they desire to. By the same token any MALE player who is a C player in the Tri-State league can put up $600 and play in the US Open.
Handicapped players have their own events. Able bodied players are obviously not allowed. But any MALE player who is in a wheelchair is allowed to put up $600 and play in the US Open.
Barry Behrman struck some sort of deal for the professional women of the WPBA to have ownership of the title "US OPEN" in return for not being allowed to play in the men's US Open.
A bad trade in my opinion but if the WPBA agreed to it then it means that THEIR players are barred from the "men's" US Open. But what about all the women who aren't members of the WPBA? Why should they be barred from competing with the best in the world?
It's a sad world that allows discrimination like this to continue. Especially in pool which ought to be genderless.
A truly OPEN tournament would do so much for the game.
Other than being barred by contract through membership to another group I think that the US OPEN in POOL should be truly OPEN. I also feel that the WPBA US OPEN for women should also be truly open to any woman regardless of their status or affiliation.
I think that Barry Behrman should consider allowing any woman not barred by contract to play. While it's doubtful that many would show up don't close the door just because they happen to have been born the "wrong" sex.
Here is how the US Open is discriminatory.
Any male can enter the open regardless of whether they have a chance in hell of winning it. The Tri-State league in New York has A B C and D divisions which are segregated. However any C can play in an A tournament if they desire to. By the same token any MALE player who is a C player in the Tri-State league can put up $600 and play in the US Open.
Handicapped players have their own events. Able bodied players are obviously not allowed. But any MALE player who is in a wheelchair is allowed to put up $600 and play in the US Open.
Barry Behrman struck some sort of deal for the professional women of the WPBA to have ownership of the title "US OPEN" in return for not being allowed to play in the men's US Open.
A bad trade in my opinion but if the WPBA agreed to it then it means that THEIR players are barred from the "men's" US Open. But what about all the women who aren't members of the WPBA? Why should they be barred from competing with the best in the world?
It's a sad world that allows discrimination like this to continue. Especially in pool which ought to be genderless.
A truly OPEN tournament would do so much for the game.
Other than being barred by contract through membership to another group I think that the US OPEN in POOL should be truly OPEN. I also feel that the WPBA US OPEN for women should also be truly open to any woman regardless of their status or affiliation.
I think that Barry Behrman should consider allowing any woman not barred by contract to play. While it's doubtful that many would show up don't close the door just because they happen to have been born the "wrong" sex.
You can in fact have it both ways.
The men represent the top of the food chain in pool. Johnny Archer is not allowed to play in the BCAPL's open division in Las Vegas. Yet any male player who is allowed to play in that amateur league's open division is allowed to play in the US Open.
If we agree that the WPBA is a league of players whose skills on average are inferior to the men then it's clear why the top male professionals are not allowed to play in their events. Their mandate is to foster professional class play by women and having men in the events doesn't crown the best woman play it just crowns the best player of those who entered.
And this what the US Open in pool should be about - crowning the best player no matter what sex or ability level. No one has to qualify. Travis Trotter can play in Mr. Berhman's US Open but Allison Fisher cannot. This is a travesty.
And Loree Jon Jones beat Thorsten Hohmann by running a five pack if memory serves.
Recently of course we have the great comeback victory of Yu Ram Cha against Shane Van Boening at the 10 ball tournament in Las Vegas.
It is clear that there are women capable of beating any given male pro in any given single tournament set.
Beating a field full of them is battling incredible odds. What kind of odds are given up if you like any given male pro to beat the field and win the event?
Adding ladies to the event allows them a chance to prove how good they are or aren't against the world's best. It also adds prestige to the event and sets pool on a higher plane than most other sports. In a sport where strength isn't the deciding factor there is no reason to bar players because of their sex from an OPEN event.
Why not
Why not. Top 5 women would have 20:1 shot at best (as a group). Having said that as they say in poker...anyone with a chip and a chair. Got $600 bucks knock yourself out. I've played guys my speed who have gone and played both US Open and DCC. I feel I have zero chance but but who am I to tell someone else how to spend their vacation money.
No the men can't play in the female tour. The two are mutually different.
PS I also believe that the pressure not to lose to a girl stigma does exist. I can't see any of the top 5 girls run the gauntlet through the B-Side like Mika did. Practice up ladies and show the boys what you can do.
Why not. Top 5 women would have 20:1 shot at best (as a group). Having said that as they say in poker...anyone with a chip and a chair. Got $600 bucks knock yourself out. I've played guys my speed who have gone and played both US Open and DCC. I feel I have zero chance but but who am I to tell someone else how to spend their vacation money.
No the men can't play in the female tour. The two are mutually different.
PS I also believe that the pressure not to lose to a girl stigma does exist. I can't see any of the top 5 girls run the gauntlet through the B-Side like Mika did. Practice up ladies and show the boys what you can do.
Yes
It should be about the pool...not about gender. I don't care what a person is: man, woman, or HERMAPHRODITE! It would be smart to allow anyone to play in any event that is open to the best.
There are a handful of women that look to test themselves and take their game to the next level and it can't hapen playing in women's tournaments. They need to play the best. They deserve to play the best. I think it is in everyone's best interest for the open tournaments to be open to the women.
I felt for Jean Balukas years ago. She only wanted to compete with the best and step her game up. She did not care if her opponent was a man or woman.
All that being said: It is Barry Behrman's event and he can do what he wants. It is his right. That should be recognized.
It should be about the pool...not about gender. I don't care what a person is: man, woman, or HERMAPHRODITE! It would be smart to allow anyone to play in any event that is open to the best.
There are a handful of women that look to test themselves and take their game to the next level and it can't hapen playing in women's tournaments. They need to play the best. They deserve to play the best. I think it is in everyone's best interest for the open tournaments to be open to the women.
I felt for Jean Balukas years ago. She only wanted to compete with the best and step her game up. She did not care if her opponent was a man or woman.
All that being said: It is Barry Behrman's event and he can do what he wants. It is his right. That should be recognized.
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Letting women play in the US Open would be good for the Open and good for pool in general. As of now you probably have 100 players that have no chance at making the final 50, much less win the thing. Most have $600+ travel, hotel, food, and more to throw away. For some it's just a "hey look at me I'm playing in the US Open". Some feel they are good enough because their the best in "small town USA".
My point is the good players that have a chance have no problem with these "dead money players" playing. In fact if they didn't play the US Open wouldn't be any where as big. So if a women player that has $600+ to enter and is "dead money" also and has no chance to cash high (I don't believe this) why not let her play? Because she is female? Give me a break. This is 2010, not 1950. It's just childish to ban them from the Open.
I can remember some bars back in the 1950's that still wouldn't let women sit at the bar...they had to sit at tables and get waited on or have a man go up to the bar to get their drinks. I thought that was wrong then as I think not letting them play in the Open is now. And I came from a tough NY waterfront area and most of my friends felt the same way about it. The ones that aren't dead are still up in Attica.:frown: Johnnyt
My point is the good players that have a chance have no problem with these "dead money players" playing. In fact if they didn't play the US Open wouldn't be any where as big. So if a women player that has $600+ to enter and is "dead money" also and has no chance to cash high (I don't believe this) why not let her play? Because she is female? Give me a break. This is 2010, not 1950. It's just childish to ban them from the Open.
I can remember some bars back in the 1950's that still wouldn't let women sit at the bar...they had to sit at tables and get waited on or have a man go up to the bar to get their drinks. I thought that was wrong then as I think not letting them play in the Open is now. And I came from a tough NY waterfront area and most of my friends felt the same way about it. The ones that aren't dead are still up in Attica.:frown: Johnnyt