Spray Automotive clear coat?

Arnot Wadsworth

Senior Cuemaker
Silver Member
Mr. Wadsworth:

I understand your position, and I have been patient until now to not disrespect you, in spite of your constant disrespect and attacks on me personally because I am not a full-time cue maker.

Yes, the forum section is entitled "ask the cue maker" I do not argue that point. Please also note the name of the specific thread entitled "Spray Automotive Clear Coat?" Maybe if the exact same topic was in the general forum you would be OK with my answer to the question? (Which, by the way, would have been exactly the same.)

I have a great deal of experience spraying Automotive Clear Coats on cars, trucks, motorcycles, guitars, bicycles and even a cue. That is what was asked and I felt that the forum could benefit from my experience in this area.

I am merely passing on that experience with the product directly related to the topic at hand- I am not jumping down the throat of another poster do discredit them and let the world know their opinion on the true subject at hand is invalid because "You Sir Are Not A Cue maker yet you keep on implying that you are." I am someone who has made a cue, and in process of another which I have posted here step-by-step for the world to see.

Water based clear coats was a derailment of the thread that you embraced in an attempt to discredit me. And my experience with water based clear, when I used it, was not a positive one, and I therefore relayed that information to the forum. I am pleased you have had good results with the product(s) you have chosen to use on your cues. Both pieces of information are an opinion, and the wise reader will collect all the comments and opinions and move forward on their own accord.

I respect you as a cue maker, and I also have respect for the quality of the work you do. However, do not use the fact that I am not an established, full-time cue maker to discredit the useful information I provide to the other members of this forum. You also had a first and second cue. Just like everyone else who has ever made, or currently makes, cues full time or otherwise.

I think I have been tolerant to your attacks and respectful to you and the other members of this forum throughout this but enough is enough. If you do not appreciate my replies to questions then do not read them. You can put me on your ignore list as well if you prefer. Or, PM me any time for my e-mail and phone number and we can discuss this like proper gentlemen.

Thank you Mr. Wadsworth for taking the time to read this, and my deepest apologies to other members of this forum for this outburst. I sincerely hope this is the first and last time this happens.

Mr. CueGuru:

Perhaps my tone was a little harsh. I admit I could have been more tactful.

My point about this forum being "Ask the Cuemaker" was that if experienced
cuemakers answer the questions the reader can expect to get good information
from those of us who have build hundreds or thousands of cues. The word
CueGuru implys that you have much more knowledge and experience in
cuemaking than you have shown to have. As I understand it you have only
build one cue. I don't think that qualifies you to lend advise to someone
has more experience than you do. At this stage you should be asking
questions - not answering them.

While you have experience in finishing other objects it does not necessarily
extend to finishing cues. I have found that finishing cues to be the most
difficult part of cuemaking. It has taken me years to perfect my finish. You
stated quite strongly that water based finishes were no good. That simply
is not true. I know this for a fact because I have used it for a number of
years. A number of other cuemakers here in Florida have seen my finish
and been quite impressed. If other cuemakers like it then I know it is OK.

As to having once built only one or two cues you are correct. At that point
in my career I was listening instead of offering advise.

I wish you success in your endeavors.
 

Cue Guru

Close, but no roll...
Silver Member
Mr. CueGuru:

My point about this forum being "Ask the Cuemaker" was that if experienced cuemakers answer the questions the reader can expect to get good information from those of us who have build hundreds or thousands of cues. The word CueGuru implys that you have much more knowledge and experience in cuemaking than you have shown to have.

As I stated last time you brought this up, the 'Cue Guru' name is the the name of my billiard products web site. There is a link to it at the bottom of every one of my posts. You have seen the site, so I know you know this is the case.

Lets look at another angle. Let's say there is an experienced cue maker out there having trouble with his or her finish. That person has built 100 or more cues and suddenly is having a problem, or perhaps has never been truly satisfied with the finish they are achieving. Don't you think that person might appreciate the knowledge of an 'outsider' to possibly shed some light on their problem? I know I appreciate it when I have a problem, even if that information does not prove to be the ultimate solution to the problem. when you hit a wall, having a ray of hope is sometimes all you need to move forward.

As I understand it you have only
build one cue. I don't think that qualifies you to lend advise to someone
has more experience than you do. At this stage you should be asking
questions - not answering them.

That is correct. I have one complete cue as of now, and a second is currently in-process. That second one is being shown step-by-step for anyone who cares to see how and why I do things the way I do them. When it is time to apply the finish, that will similarly be shown step by step, and the results will speak for themselves as they do now on my first cue.

While you have experience in finishing other objects it does not necessarily extend to finishing cues. I have found that finishing cues to be the most difficult part of cuemaking. It has taken me years to perfect my finish.

On the contrary, based on my 'unrelated' finishing experience, I have found the finishing of the cue to be the most simple of all the cue making tasks myself. Properly constructing a full splice is what I find to be the most challenging task currently... And yes, it takes years of experience to get a nice finish. Experience I already posses because finishing wood is finishing wood. Finishing non-porous surfaces is quite different, and if you are a good car painter, that does not make you a good wood finisher, regardless of the particular wooden object you wish to finish.

You stated quite strongly that water based finishes were no good. That simply is not true. I know this for a fact because I have used it for a number of years. A number of other cuemakers here in Florida have seen my finish and been quite impressed. If other cuemakers like it then I know it is OK.

This is exactly what I said (well, typed actually):
"Uggh.. That water-based finish (well, the one I tried anyway) was HORRIBLE! Slower than Lacquers to dry; very soft, not a good enough gloss (not for a guitar anyway) that was a big waste of money for us, but we did try it."
That is the factual information from the particular product I used when I used it. (and thinking back the clarity was less than stellar as well) I relayed my personal experience with it, and backed that up with specific reasons WHY I did not care for it; not simply stating "It is not good", which would be of no use to anyone. As I said before, if the reader looks at your post, he (or she) sees that you have had good luck with it. and when they read mine, they see that I did not have good luck with it. They make their own decision to use it or not from there. That is the point of an open forum for these discussions.

As to having once built only one or two cues you are correct. At that point in my career I was listening instead of offering advise.

You have no idea how much information I have collected by reading current and past posts on this forum, but suffice it to say, it is a great deal. I typically PM the person when I have a specific question, or need clarification. Occasionally, I will post a reply to dig for more information.

When I started my first cue blank, I didn't even own a computer, let alone have access to the Internet. I had to read what ever material I could get my hands on (which wasn't much) and talk with any cue maker and cue dealer who would talk with me to get that first blank (and eventual complete cue) completed. "the hard way" so to speak... Before I even started it, I made a lot of test scrap pieces and I listened- A LOT, and I continue to do so. I was using one method to cut the forearm and then got a tiny piece of insight from a very famous cue maker who mentioned the radial arm saw and I ran with it. The Radial Arm saw is what I used to cut my forearm for my first blank. Once you shut your mind and stop learning, you might as well give it all up.

I also have current off-forum relationships with other cue makers to bounce ideas off of. I like to get a good spread of opinions, ideas and just plain crazy ideas to throw into the mix and decide from there which direction I want to go in (and I keep notes in my book). My shop is currently down (moving house VERY soon I hope...) but the first order of business (after the electrical up-grade) is to get my shop back up so I can try some of the ideas and concepts I have logged in my book and rattling around my brain. In the mean time, I can use the equipment at my disposal to turn the cues down, so I use pre-made full-splice blanks at the moment. I don't believe myself to be better than any other person on here, just contributing my experience where I can.

Off topic a bit but I wrote an invention disclosure (pre-patent document) for nozzle coatings of (something) in place of hard chromium plating. The idea struck me from a wrist watch perspective- totally left field for the purpose I wrote the disclosure for, but through additional research on my own I found (something) to be harder, slicker and have a better thermal transfer than Chrome, so it is a better choice for the purpose. The point is, I took information I gained from a completely unrelated source to come up with a new and unique idea. THAT is the spirit we need to foster here if we are to flourish as a community.

Again, the idea is to share knowledge between people here. I feel that I do my very best to share the experiences I have gained to those who wish to hear it. Those who do not, can simply ignore my posts. I don't know why this is such a problem; however when I feel I have useful information to contribute, I do so. If I don't, I don't.

I wish you success in your endeavors.

Thank you. And I you.

Best regards.

PS By the way, the name is Jim if you prefer.
 

MVPCues

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Let me make a post for Joey to save him the trouble...:wink:


Joey loves lamp.

Kelly
 

jtrombetta

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I have been building cues off and on for over 13 years and learned a lot about cue building over the years and have done or tried just about everything I have seen on this forum at some time. Two things in cuemaking seem to be more difficult and done differently by a lot of us. Number one is how we do points and number two is how and what we use for finish. I had a guy on my pool team years ago that owned a body shop as a profession. His name is UCH, one of the best people you will ever meet and an excellent painter. I moved my shop in with his and sprayed all my cues with a show car finish which they now have discontinued. Since then I have also moved to another state to be a manager of a pool hall and have been diagnosed with bladder cancer, which I am recovering from. I for one like advise and opinions from others experienced in the auto painting industry who love pool and goof around building cues like Jim indicated he does and am open to his opinion. :smile:
 

Mr Hoppe

Sawdust maker
Silver Member
More importantly, where did Cue Guru go??? I enjoyed reading his posts. I hope he wasn't chased off by . . . others who communicate less effectively.
Mr H
 

63Kcode

AKA Larry Vigus
Silver Member
More importantly, where did Cue Guru go??? I enjoyed reading his posts. I hope he wasn't chased off by . . . others who communicate less effectively.
Mr H

I PMed him about a month ago when I noticed he wasen't posting anymore. He has gotten married bought a house and is working more than before was his answer. If I remember correctly.

He still gets time to play pool but not much time for AZ. He does check in from time to time.

Larry
 

Mr Hoppe

Sawdust maker
Silver Member
I PMed him about a month ago when I noticed he wasen't posting anymore. He has gotten married bought a house and is working more than before was his answer. If I remember correctly.

He still gets time to play pool but not much time for AZ. He does check in from time to time.

Larry

That's good to hear. Thanks for the update!
Mr H
 

ComptonCustomCues

Quality Handcrafted Cues
Silver Member
I know this is an old thread....I try to never get involved but I can't resist....The best finish I have ever seen on a cue was done by a paint and body man whom has 20 years in the buisness......when you work with something like paint you learn things....most cue makers can't scratch the surfface of the things average paint and body guys know about finish....as a guitar player.....I have been since the age of 12.....lol...and I have been around high end guitars for awhile.....those guys know an unbelivable amount about finishing wood......how can you attack someone on a subject they are an expert in because they are new to another subject ??????????.....I am learning how to make cues.....just learning......but I dare you to tell me I don't know about woodworking........I have more opinions but I will keep them to myself.....sorry for the rant everyone
 

Cue Guru

Close, but no roll...
Silver Member
Good morning everyone!

It sure is nice to be missed!

As was mentioned a few posts back, that's pretty much it: Working my tail off to restore a house before my Wife is there full time. She will be here in a week or two, so the clock's ticking!

I also appreciate the support of the others in this thread. I try to be open, honest and giving back to the community- there are only a few secrets in this industry now.

Anyway, I'm alive and well! The finish is applied to my Davis cue, but I have not had time to sand and buff yet.

So, not much new to report, other than the finish on my red oak floor is a lot better than the "professional" floor finishes I have seen...:thumbup:
 

63Kcode

AKA Larry Vigus
Silver Member
Welcome back, but how does being a guitar builder qualify you to refinish floors?

Larry
 

Cue Guru

Close, but no roll...
Silver Member
Making guitars does not qualify me for finishing floors (or cues).

It was sheer luck that it came out well.:wink:


Thanks for the welcome Mr. Hoppe; however there are few stranger than me I'm afraid...:eek:
 

amarillonarrow

Registered
Cue Guru: Have a question and hope it's not a dumb one.

I just started making custom pool cues, just for myself, and love it. It seems that getting a good clear coat is one of the hardest things for me to do when making a cue. I am using a two part automotive clear coat, but here is my question. To get an even coat should I turn the pool cue slowly on a lathe when I paint? I have a second Mickey Mouse lathe I can use and not mess up my better lathe, which isn't that great anyway. Someday when get pretty good at making pool cues I will treat myself to a better lathe.

Anyway, any tips on painting the clear coat would be very helpful. Thanks.
 

BHQ

we'll miss you
Silver Member
deleted.......................................
 
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