VNEA Rules Question

[BRussell]

I may or may not agree with that LOL. It would be similar to someone walking up to the table as you are shooting but you shoot anyway and miss. Yes you missed, but the game was over when the other player got up. In this case the shot was hit but is not over till the cueball stops rolling. Now I am in a grey area. The shot was started when the player was sitting so not conceding, then the player got up to shake hands which IS conceding the game. Ah... you got me in a spot here LOL.

I may need to make a ruling based on the skill and overall knowledge of the player. If the opponent is a newer player or only plays in leagues in bars, with more limited knowledge of sportsmanship rules, I am likely to make the call for the opponent, meaning he just made an honest move to say nice job without any intent to concede the game. Since that happened after the shot was made.

If the sitting player is a seasoned vet of tournaments, plays with pros in Joss tour, etc.., I may rule that they knew shaking hands before the game was over was a concession and rule the game over then even if the shot was not. They should know better if the cueball is running around the table than to call it a loss or a win till it stops.

Hopefully that logic makes sense when read like it did in my head LOL.

I think it's a problem when someone starts to put away their cue before the last ball is down. I'd consider that a concession. But there's no sharking here. There's no incentive to pretend like you're conceding the game. But then again, this is the league that requires marking the pocket...

This reminds me of an issue that came up once - one guy tried to claim that, since the 8-ball dropped in the pocket BEFORE the cue ball scratched, he won the game. lol he didn't get away with that.

 

[JohnnyOzone]

I may or may not agree with that LOL. It would be similar to someone walking up to the table as you are shooting but you shoot anyway and miss. Yes you missed, but the game was over when the other player got up. In this case the shot was hit but is not over till the cueball stops rolling. Now I am in a grey area. The shot was started when the player was sitting so not conceding, then the player got up to shake hands which IS conceding the game. Ah... you got me in a spot here LOL.

I may need to make a ruling based on the skill and overall knowledge of the player. If the opponent is a newer player or only plays in leagues in bars, with more limited knowledge of sportsmanship rules, I am likely to make the call for the opponent, meaning he just made an honest move to say nice job without any intent to concede the game. Since that happened after the shot was made.

If the sitting player is a seasoned vet of tournaments, plays with pros in Joss tour, etc.., I may rule that they knew shaking hands before the game was over was a concession and rule the game over then even if the shot was not. They should know better if the cueball is running around the table than to call it a loss or a win till it stops.

Hopefully that logic makes sense when read like it did in my head LOL.

So......
The rules are different for different payers?
Yeah, that's logical

If you make the 8 and scratch, you lose.......no ifs, ands or buts.


And BTW, rule 7 is obsolete as hell, VNEA hasn't used that in years

 

[fastone371]

LOSS OF GAME

1. Pocketing the 8-ball when it is not the legal object ball except on an opening break.

2. Pocketing the 8-ball on the same stroke as the last of his group of balls.

3. Jumping or knocking the 8-ball off the table at any time.

4. Pocketing the 8-ball in a pocket other than the one designated.

5. Fouling while (pocketing) the 8-ball in the designated pocket.

6. Third infraction of the slow play rule.

7. Pocketing the 8-ball and the cue ball on the break stroke. (This varies, if your league considers an 8-ball break a win.)

8. Not correctly marking the pocket while pocketing the 8-ball.

Note: All infractions above must be called before the next shot is taken. Only the players involved may call an infraction.


See rule #5. Player B wins the game, the player not at the table. Player A scratched on the 8, clearly a violation of rule #5

 

[Blaine B.]

So who got up and went for the handshake first, the player that made the shot or the player sitting? If it's the player that made the shot, it does not matter. The other player just shook hands as a reflex not as a concession accidental or not. If the opponent got up from his seat to shake hands before the shot finished, then it may be ruled a concession of game. I don't think I have seen this happen AFTER someone makes the ball, usually what happens is that someone is about to shoot the game winner and the opponent stands up or approaches the table before the shot happens. Then it's a clean concession and anything that happens after is moot.

There should be no unwritten rules about conceding games, they need to be in the book.

Player A turned after he made the 8 to shake player B's hand. Player B was seated behind Player A.
We are in agreement about unwritten rules.

 

[Blaine B.]

lol I love it. Doesn't this league make you mark pockets too?




Come on, does that really matter?

Yes you must patch the 8 in Vegas and Super Vegas divisions which are VNEA sanctioned in my city, Premier, Super Premier and Open players are dual sanctioned by BCA and VNEA.
Now that I think of it I should clarify which rule set takes precedence in the higher divisions.

 

[Blaine B.]

Like the unwritten rule that if a player tries what player A apparently did he is banned for life from the league.

But seriously, I think either the ref wasn't paying attention during the course or the VNEA has some real bad rules problems.

I'm giving the benefit of the doubt that BCA rules were applied in a VNEA division, but the ref is still standing by their decision which they seem to have pulled freshly from their rectum.
It's been escalated,.i have an email in to VNEA other refs have messaged me to indicate that it was a bad call.

 

[Blaine B.]

I may or may not agree with that LOL. It would be similar to someone walking up to the table as you are shooting but you shoot anyway and miss. Yes you missed, but the game was over when the other player got up. In this case the shot was hit but is not over till the cueball stops rolling. Now I am in a grey area. The shot was started when the player was sitting so not conceding, then the player got up to shake hands which IS conceding the game. Ah... you got me in a spot here LOL.

I may need to make a ruling based on the skill and overall knowledge of the player. If the opponent is a newer player or only plays in leagues in bars, with more limited knowledge of sportsmanship rules, I am likely to make the call for the opponent, meaning he just made an honest move to say nice job without any intent to concede the game. Since that happened after the shot was made.

If the sitting player is a seasoned vet of tournaments, plays with pros in Joss tour, etc.., I may rule that they knew shaking hands before the game was over was a concession and rule the game over then even if the shot was not. They should know better if the cueball is running around the table than to call it a loss or a win till it stops.

Hopefully that logic makes sense when read like it did in my head LOL.

Not sure of player A's experience but this is Player B's rookie season in Vegas division which is the lowest division.