Why different shaft diameters for different games?
- Thread starter Rocket354
- Start date
oscargrouch
Member
What's the shape and size of the surface area of the contact between tip and cue ball for each tip shape with a center ball hit?
oscargrouch
Member
No, I mean shape. For the same shape, the area of contact should be the same no matter the tip/shaft diameter (at least until the extreme point where the diameter is smaller than the contact area could be with that tip shape but then we're talking tiny tiny tip). A 13mm diameter in the shape of a nickel should have the same contact area as an 11mm diameter in the same shape.
As someone who plays both snooker and pool (and all other billiard games apart from Pyramid), let me tell you why tip size matters.
A snooker cue generally has a thin walled brass ferrule. It's thin in order to limit deflection somewhat. Unfortunately, when you strike a heavy ball hard, the ferrule tends to dig into the cue "shoulder" on which it rests, thus chipping off wood or breaking the cue. Even thin cues with plastic ferrules, which do exist, can be damaged by the heavier balls. It can work, and I do know someone who uses a snooker cue for pool, but its a gamble and he is very careful with it. English bar billiards games (like blackball) uses an even smaller cue tip size than snooker. Sometimes they can get down to 7mm, more commonly 8mm. These cues are not good for snooker. They tend not to have a strong enough spine. Also they tend to put unintended english on the ball.
As for the opposite, like using a 13mm cue for snooker, it tends to get in the way when putting extreme draw on the ball. Also it's tough when you're up against the cushion. In addition, using too stiff of a shaft tends to take away feedback to the hand. It's tough to be delicate with it. I played in a top level tournament of blackball with a snooker cue, and I actually did think the cue held me back a bit. I lacked the final finesse needed against the best players. So I bought a blackball cue and it did help my touch a bit. Deflection can also be an issue, because a bigger tip tends to be heavier and give more deflection.
It's easier to see the point of impact with a smaller shaft. I also think it is a bit easier to aim certain shots. But when the shaft becomes too small, it's harder to visualize center ball, IMO. It will cause you to put english on the ball when you don't intend to, and miss shots. Also, cues made for smaller cue ball games can be too weak to get the power into the ball sometimes.
As for Chinese 8 ball, many players who play it have a background in snooker. They're used to conical shafts and chevrons on the shaft (arrow shaped wood figuring), so that's where the speciality cue comes from. Chevrons assist with aiming and also in orienting your shaft consistently. This is also helped by the "flat" on the cue butt. Having this flat spot tends to help orient the cue consistently, but also is a matter of being used to it, as opposed to an entirely round cue butt section. It's essentially a stronger snooker cue, that's built to withstand the heavier balls and harder shots of pool.
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I've used a 9.5-10.0mm tip playing pool for 30+ years, playing just like I would with a bigger tip, with never a problem. I don't think there's a tip size issue.
pj
chgo
Do you have a thin brass ferrule? Because with a hard enough shot, it WILL dig into the shoulder of the cue. I've seen it several times.
Nope - my ferrule is ~1/4" long, made of plastic, not as thin as a brass ferrule.
Of course, that's not a tip size issue.
pj
chgo
Pierre Shakes
Registered
Thick cues are stiffer than thinner cues and so cause more ‘deflection’ of the ball off its straight path when hit to the side of cente . Carbon fibre in the shaft allows the cue to give way - be weaker - when hit off center reducing ball deflection.
Deflection from shooting lower than centerball is called bottom spin. Thin cues are weaker than thick cues; they bend more and that is a loss of power. Being weaker means less draw.
Besides needing a playing cue, a break cue, and a jump cue, do we now need a bottom cue as well?
DeeDeeCues
Well-known member
Nope. Cf, even as thin as it is, is stiffer than maple, by a lot.
/nitpicking/
They are generally stiffer and cause more squirt, but it's their added mass that does it, not their stiffness.
/nitpicking/
pj
chgo
i've played pool lots with a snooker cue (because of laziness, i have this cue stored in the snooker hall, which also has 5 9ft pool tables) and never considered this. it's a junk cue anyway. would it be the same with titanium/thicker ferrule?
snooker player gary wilson would be in trouble with the hard way he shoots. looks like he plans to play both pro pool and pro snooker for the foreseeable future. mark williams too, with c8b
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