Can you transfer side spin to an OB?

How do you explain why carom players using "side' or "english" when nursing balls along the rail - especially when one of the balls on the rail need to be edged forward or remain in place - and I'm sure Brits who play "English Billiards " ( 3 balls on a snooker size table)
are familiar with nursing balls along the rail .
 
Jason Robichaud and the straight on shot

Hey guys, is this argument over or should I post a video?

I just tried this shot:
spin.jpg


And I got enough spin on the OB to hit the outside of my cues. Isn't that the video you requested Mr. Robichaud? Straight on hit, perpendicular to the end rail, OB comes back at a different angle due to spin transfer.

Edit: I'll post a video later tonight (hopefully)
 
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This thread is a great argument that has raged in pool rooms as long as I've been going into them, (and that's a long time), I'm happy to say.

Way back when, on a day, I wasn't sleeping in class, my Physics teacher demonstrated the basic law of Physics, (for every action, there's a reaction), I've lived with this belief as long as I've played pool. A spinning ball if it contacts another ball sitting still will cause the second ball to spin, plain and simple. It has to happen, basic law of Physics.
 
Any of you yahoos who dont believe that there is side spin applied to an OB. I would love to play banks or one pocket with any of you. POST!!
 
=*~* Got the video! *~*=

NEW VIDEO:

Here is the video that was requested: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhAhcjIVWbw

As you can see, the shot is perpendicular to the end rail. Shot #1 is with center ball, so the OB bounces straight back.

Then, the 2nd and 3rd shots are with right english, which significantly changes the direction of the OB.

In the 3rd shot, if it didn't hit the butt of the cue, the ball would have hit 1 diamond over from the center of the head rail, so I think that's a pretty significant effect.

This is what you wanted, right, Mr. Robichaud and Softshot?

This was shot at my school's game room with help from my friend Kyle, who also posts here.

-Tye
 
kingwang said:
NEW VIDEO:

Here is the video that was requested: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhAhcjIVWbw

As you can see, the shot is perpendicular to the end rail. Shot #1 is with center ball, so the OB bounces straight back.

Then, the 2nd and 3rd shots are with right english, which significantly changes the direction of the OB.

In the 3rd shot, if it didn't hit the butt of the cue, the ball would have hit 1 diamond over from the center of the head rail, so I think that's a pretty significant effect.

This is what you wanted, right, Mr. Robichaud and Softshot?

This was shot at my school's game room with help from my friend Kyle, who also posts here.

-Tye
Click to expand...
Cool man. good job.

BVal
 
the first was very little spin and had little affect. the second, when the cues spread apart, allowed for off center hit and more spin. I would like to see it the other way with the tips points at rail instead of butts. Using the tips I can't get any spin to take. very very little amount happens causing the OB to just miss the tips but not enough to create angles for banks. You can't allow off center hits! Thanks for posting the video! Rep sent.
 
Neil said:
Jason, you will not get anywheres near the amount of spin you can get with the cb. But, you CAN get some spin. Just the fact that you can get some spin can make a world of difference on some shots. So, it CAN be transferred, and it Can be useful.

Just the shot that he showed, was very similar to my results. Over a short distance it doesn't look like much. But if you extend that line the length of the table, you are looking at about a diamond difference.
Click to expand...

I completely agree with you, Neil. I am also sure that Jason and the OP knew all along that there can be spin transfer to the OB but have strung this thread out just to amuse themselves and frustrate others. I actually have some evidence of this from a PM, but my lips must remain sealed. :D
 
BillPorter said:
I completely agree with you, Neil. I am also sure that Jason and the OP knew all along that there can be spin transfer to the OB but have strung this thread out just to amuse themselves and frustrate others. I actually have some evidence of this from a PM, but my lips must remain sealed. :D
Click to expand...

The PM wasn't mine! I still don't think it is the transfer that causes the "banks that don't go but do" shots. I think it is the hit on the OB. I have a video coming soon of my transfer attempt.

This is the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77nV5oHzfaI

I don't understand why I cannot get transfer!

I am not dragging anything the thread died and someone else posted. I based all my opinions on this video (I just filmed it 10 min ago, but tried it when the thread first started). I do see off center hits cause spin, like in curling!
 
Hey, I noticed something really weird in your video. The striped ball you are using for your object ball is barely spinning at all. When I apply english, the object ball spins for at least 10 seconds.

There are several explanations: you have slow cloth, your cues are too close to the balls and provide too much friction, or you aren't putting that much spin on the balls.

If the cloth is too slow, then the spin will wear off much too quick.
If the shafts are too close to the ball, then they will stop the ball from spinning.

Also, you are shooting over a really long distance, which doesn't help. Remember, according to Robert Byrne in his books, only 2% of spin is transferred in most cases, which is small, but significant.
 
Jason Robichaud said:
The PM wasn't mine! I still don't think it is the transfer that causes the "banks that don't go but do" shots. I think it is the hit on the OB. I have a video coming soon of my transfer attempt.

This is the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77nV5oHzfaI

I don't understand why I cannot get transfer!

I am not dragging anything the thread died and someone else posted. I based all my opinions on this video (I just filmed it 10 min ago, but tried it when the thread first started). I do see off center hits cause spin, like in curling!
Click to expand...

If you set the same shot up closer to the rail it will transfer. At that speed the object ball has little to no sidespin by the time it contacts the rail.
 
I don't know if it has been suggested, but I don't want to read 14 pages, so how about a slow motion version of it? That would be better to analyze
 
chin0 said:
I don't know if it has been suggested, but I don't want to read 14 pages, so how about a slow motion version of it? That would be better to analyze
Click to expand...

It sounds so simple doesn't it? Show a super slow-motion video of side-spin transfer, and save 14 pages of posts. However....there's been PLENTY of high-speed camera demonstations courtesy of Dr. Dave. Apparently it's still not proof....
 
Jeff G. Martin said:
It sounds so simple doesn't it? Show a super slow-motion video of side-spin transfer, and save 14 pages of posts. However....there's been PLENTY of high-speed camera demonstations courtesy of Dr. Dave. Apparently it's still not proof....
Click to expand...


It didn't show the path of the CB to OB, only the point of contact. The spin transfer in the last two videos posted would not cause the drastic angle created on the OB displayed earlier in the post!
 
BillPorter said:
I completely agree with you, Neil. I am also sure that Jason and the OP knew all along that there can be spin transfer to the OB but have strung this thread out just to amuse themselves and frustrate others. I actually have some evidence of this from a PM, but my lips must remain sealed. :D
Click to expand...

I haven't "strung this thread out" I haven't posted on this thread since I responded to your PM

I didn't do it to amuse myself or frustrate others...

I learned quite a bit from this thread..

My conclusion...

spin is transfered often but lingering side spin can only be transfered sometimes... almost entirely dependent upon table conditions....

and even under perfect conditions it is touchy at best...

it is probably a good thing to know the conditions you can as well as the conditions where you cannot ..

but I feel that under that under the majority of conditions.. attempting these type of shots will surrender the table.. and cost you the game...

I focus on controling what I can reliably control...

and I am not going to spend any more time focusing on unreliable shots that I will almost never even be able to attempt.. unless I get a really dirty table in really humid weather..

I am focusing my training on what wins games..

have a nice day:thumbup:
 
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