Carbon Fiber Shafts should be Banned

garczar said:
You wanna go back to shitty balls and cloth too?? Look, things evolve. Its the way it is. Use whatever you like. Based on all you've whined about you might as well quit 'cause pool ain't going backwards. BTW, a player with superior game can win with a house cue against anyone with any shaft. Good luck with the 'Luddite Pool Tour'.
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A buddy of mine has 25 years playing experience on me. The Predator BKRush break cue has leveled the playing field on breaking but even with the other new Predator cue w/Revo CF shaft I'm still choking on the 8 ball and scratching and can't buy a side pocket cut. (face palm)
 
Fatboy said:
Same as ivory. Had to shoot the jumbo at least 20 years ago for the ivory to be any good. Green ivory is as bad as green wood. Moves all over the place, cracks etc. has to age 20+ years to be usable in cues.

Jus sayin’

Fatboy
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Get ready for roasted Maple shafts. Heat treating Maple to stabilize and plasticize the wood has already hit the guitar manufacturing industry to keep guitar necks from twisting, bowing, expanding/shrinking. We'll forget all about this CF thread when the roasted Maple shaft thread starts.
 
coolidge said:
Get ready for roasted Maple shafts. Heat treating Maple to stabilize and plasticize the wood has already hit the guitar manufacturing industry to keep guitar necks from twisting, bowing, expanding/shrinking. We'll forget all about this CF thread when the roasted Maple shaft thread starts.
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Roasted maple, sounds like a new marketing idea.

High pressure vacuum roasted maple impregnated with microscopic hypoallergenic silicone beads. So you can play your best game while your competitors watch

Or some like of BS like that. Yeah I can see that coming. The league players with 26 tip tools, and 14 shafts and 6 butts in their nylon cases will be all over it.

Seems like the next new fad to me.

Best
Fatboy 😂😂
 
coolidge said:
Get ready for roasted Maple shafts. Heat treating Maple to stabilize and plasticize the wood has already hit the guitar manufacturing industry to keep guitar necks from twisting, bowing, expanding/shrinking. We'll forget all about this CF thread when the roasted Maple shaft thread starts.
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Kielwood. I don't know if you were joking, but these are definitely a thing. I was a rock hard maple fan for shafts for 25 years. Tried a guy's CF, didn't care for it. Got kielwood. Great playing shafts (obviously depends on construction on how LD it is). Great sound, has some "soul" to it instead of dead clinical CF.

The other neat part is it can make today's shit maple play like the good older stuff.
 
boogieman said:
Kielwood. I don't know if you were joking, but these are definitely a thing. I was a rock hard maple fan for shafts for 25 years. Tried a guy's CF, didn't care for it. Got kielwood. Great playing shafts (obviously depends on construction on how LD it is). Great sound, has some "soul" to it instead of dead clinical CF.

The other neat part is it can make today's shit maple play like the good older stuff.
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Wasn't joking and there you have it, these shafts are already available.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
My objections to CF are: 1) I hate the way they look and the way they sound, 2) I love the way that wooden shafts look and sound, and 3) I dislike that pool is arguably becoming an elitist sport, since large investments of $$$ are now necessary to compete on an even playing field.
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1. Do you ride around saying "I hate that car", "I hate that house"? Why do you care if you're not using one?
2. Ok, great. Then use one and leave everyone else alone.
3. Wait. You say CF has absolutely no advantage over wood, but now say you can't compete without having to shell out $$'s for one? This makes absolutely zero sense.
 
coolidge said:
Your new nickname is John McEnroe. Back when tennis was transitioning from wood rackets to larger composite rackets John McEnroe had an absolute meltdown over it. lol

With my new Predator cue and Revo CF shaft costing only $919 people are not being priced out of the sport.
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From what I understand, the large racquets fundamentally changed the game of tennis. It's not a good look, but If I clawed my way to the top of my field and the skills and strengths I worked so hard to develop were rendered obsolete by the new racquets, I'd be pretty unhappy about it, too. I don't believe CF/LD is anywhere near that large of a change for the game of pool. It's probably more comparable to changing the strings of your racquet.

$919 isn't cheap by my standards. Especially when many of us don't have a chance to try something out before we drop the cash. Some places have a good return/exchange policy but you are still spending a not insignificant amount of money without being sure of what you are really getting. "Go ahead and send me a week's pay and eventually we'll find something you like" isn't the most enticing sales pitch.

Honestly, I think cues are way more expensive than they need to be. I guess it's a smaller market so there may not be the economies of scale, but it seems like a cue shaft should be a small fraction of the price of a guitar neck. Or maybe guitars are underpriced.
 
tomatoshooter said:
From what I understand, the large racquets fundamentally changed the game of tennis. It's not a good look, but If I clawed my way to the top of my field and the skills and strengths I worked so hard to develop were rendered obsolete by the new racquets, I'd be pretty unhappy about it, too. I don't believe CF/LD is anywhere near that large of a change for the game of pool. It's probably more comparable to changing the strings of your racquet.

$919 isn't cheap by my standards. Especially when many of us don't have a chance to try something out before we drop the cash. Some places have a good return/exchange policy but you are still spending a not insignificant amount of money without being sure of what you are really getting. "Go ahead and send me a week's pay and eventually we'll find something you like" isn't the most enticing sales pitch.

Honestly, I think cues are way more expensive than they need to be. I guess it's a smaller market so there may not be the economies of scale, but it seems like a cue shaft should be a small fraction of the price of a guitar neck. Or maybe guitars are underpriced.
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Yes they did. Ditto for golf, bowling, skiing, skating and many sports. Made in USA guitars have become ridiculously expensive. Fenders you could purchase for $750 are now pushing $3,000. The used prices have climbed in tandem. Hell I picked up a Turkey breast in the supermarket last fall, saw the nearly $29 price and put it back down. :oops: The junker $300 car I owned as a teenager now sells for $9000 :oops:
 
Minnesota Phat said:
Excellent and interesting idea. Maybe not "purchased," because that seems a little predatory, but they could make cues available for competition (for free), and not allow competitors to use their own cues.

Buckshotshoey accused us of being the same person, and CocoboloCowboy suggested that maybe he should report us as being the same person. Are you laughing too? Because I know I am.
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If the tournament entry came with. $200 voucher for a tournament sponsored cue or pay for a cue permit, its less predatory.

Its free advertising for cue companies, but if they need to show the cue pay extra.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
The other day I got a chance to shoot with one of these pieces of crap, and all I can say is: UGLY.

I always knew that they looked ugly, but they also sound truly awful. My pool-loving soul recoiled at the very first impact of the cue against the cue ball, and that horrendous hollow "plink" sound.

Carbon fiber shafts and phenolic break tips are the aluminum baseball bats of pool - sure, they perform well, but they look like crap, they sound like crap, and they are a sign of everything wrong with billiards in America.

In England they have respect for tradition, and great snooker players make a lot of $$$ using snooker cues made out of real wood - no gimmicks, no B.S., no eyesores, and no plinking pieces of carbon fiber garbage.

I'd rather shoot with a broomstick than with a carbon fiber shaft.

Carbon fiber shafts should be banned from every money game - agree or disagree?
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I think Fat Old guys should be banned. They are ugly and should be banned from Pool. This makes more sense than your post.
 
Let's go yet another way...

You say a carbon fiber shaft gives an unfair advantage and cost too much for a low-income person to obtain.

Does that mean you condone banning people from taking professional lessons? They are rather expensive. They give an advantage far beyond what you claim a carbon fiber shaft can give.

So are you going to try to tell us that because a low-income person can't afford to take lessons that none of the rest of us should either? I will argue, and be absolutely coerect, the professional lessons will give you a far greater advantage than a carbon fiber shaft EVER will.
 
coolidge said:
Your new nickname is John McEnroe. Back when tennis was transitioning from wood rackets to larger composite rackets John McEnroe had an absolute meltdown over it. lol

With my new Predator cue and Revo CF shaft costing only $919 people are not being priced out of the sport.
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I'll take it! I like John McEnroe.

I prefer watching women's tennis over men's tennis, because there isn't much volleying in men's tennis, so each game tends to be settled on the serve or the return. I agree with McEnroe that the racket change made tennis more boring by increasing ball speeds.

The median weekly salary for someone 25-34 is about $1,000 before taxes. Younger people make much less, and most college students can barely afford room and board. I don't think many people 34 or younger can afford to spend more than a week's paycheck on a pool cue.
 
coolidge said:
Get ready for roasted Maple shafts. Heat treating Maple to stabilize and plasticize the wood has already hit the guitar manufacturing industry to keep guitar necks from twisting, bowing, expanding/shrinking. We'll forget all about this CF thread when the roasted Maple shaft thread starts.
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Heh - I own one of these. Worse still, it's an LD shaft. I would still prefer that LD shafts like mine be banned from at least some competitions, since they most definitely change the game of pool, and for other reasons that I've already mentioned.

That said, I suspect my OB Phoenix III is a very good shaft, since playing with it has illustrated to me the vast difference between solid shafts and LD shafts. I bought it because I realized that if I ever want to be competitive, an LD shaft provides a big advantage over a solid maple shaft. I don't particularly like shopping, so it was not pleasant to discover that LD shafts are a thing, since that meant that I had to do a bunch of research to find one I might like, and spend money on equipment that I'd prefer to spend on table time and/or lessons.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
Heh - I own one of these. Worse still, it's an LD shaft. I would still prefer that LD shafts like mine be banned from at least some competitions, since they most definitely change the game of pool, and for other reasons that I've already mentioned.

That said, I suspect my OB Phoenix III is a very good shaft, since playing with it has illustrated to me the vast difference between solid shafts and LD shafts. I bought it because I realized that if I ever want to be competitive, an LD shaft provides a big advantage over a solid maple shaft. I don't particularly like shopping, so it was not pleasant to discover that LD shafts are a thing, since that meant that I had to do a bunch of research to find one I might like, and spend money on equipment that I'd prefer to spend on table time and/or lessons.
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Waaaaaaaaaaaaaa. quit whining or quit playing. Pick one.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
Oh, I've spent quite a bit of money on pool cues. If I wanted a CF shaft, I'd have one.

My objections to CF are: 1) I hate the way they look and the way they sound, 2) I love the way that wooden shafts look and sound, and 3) I dislike that pool is arguably becoming an elitist sport, since large investments of $$$ are now necessary to compete on an even playing field.

Honestly, I dislike LD in general. Yes, I can play pretty well with my LD shaft, but if I play anyone who doesn't have one, I feel like I'm cheating.

I think wood has vibrance and heart, whereas I think CF shafts are cold and heartless.

Not everyone has to agree with me - some people like New Coke, and I prefer Coke Classic - but I'd like those people who do agree with me to think about how we can have tournaments and competitions that use the same equipment available to Minnesota Fats and Willie Mosconi, rather than "space age technology" that does provide an advantage, but at a cost to the beauty and fairness of the game.
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Your premise is false. Large amounts of money are not required to compete. I've never spent more than $450 on a cue. I played some of my best pool with an old, warped Adam.

The table time required to get very good at pool is way more expensive than any 'technology' in the equipment.
 
Minnesota Phat said:
Shoo - I'm not going to date you, no matter how many times you shoot spitballs at me.

I bet you miss middle school.
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All you've done this entire thread is bitched-n-whined about how you don't like certain equipment and based on your misguided beliefs it/they should be banned. Like i said, quit whining or find another game because what you're fantasizing about is NEVER going to happen.
 
DeeDeeCues said:
Your premise is false. Large amounts of money are not required to compete. I've never spent more than $450 on a cue. I played some of my best pool with an old, warped Adam.

The table time required to get very good at pool is way more expensive than any 'technology' in the equipment.
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Table time is expensive. A lot of people can just barely afford the table time, if they can afford it at all, and they don't have money beyond that to buy a high tech shaft.

Or else they buy the shaft, and then can't afford table time for awhile.

Do you play with a warped Adam now? If not, why not?
 
garczar said:
All you've done this entire thread is bitched-n-whined about how you don't like certain equipment and based on your misguided beliefs it/they should be banned. Like i said, quit whining or find another game because what you're fantasizing about is NEVER going to happen.
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The only people Ihave ever heard complain about an equipment advantage are guys I could beat with a crooked house cue.
 
garczar said:
All you've done this entire thread is bitched-n-whined about how you don't like certain equipment and based on your misguided beliefs it/they should be banned. Like i said, quit whining or find another game because what you're fantasizing about is NEVER going to happen.
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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

I'm sorry you're so easily triggered. Try weed - that might help.
 
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