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- Thread starter Paul_#_
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
Some training balls don’t help find where to hit cue ball to add spin
The miscue limit is the distance from cue-ball center that a player can hit without miscuing. The distance is generally accepted to be one-half a billiard-ball radius, 9/16" (14.3mm) or 0.5R. Some billiard-ball stripes are that width. For beginners, a more practical maximum may be 0.4 to 0.45R. DrDave found a maximum miscue limit of 0.55R.
The Rempe training ball shows an area to apply spin that has a miscue limit of 0.7R. It instructs players hit the Rempe ball and to note chalk marks to determine where spin was applied. That's a disaster, though, for beginners who would miscue hitting the ball at about 0.5R length and for experienced players above 0.55R. Rempe's instructions should state that miscues are likely cue hits ball and smudges ball at markings above 3.2 (that is 0.5R).
The CueSight Training ball instructs players to “stay inside the white circle and you will not miscue”. That white circle can mean hitting the cue ball at 0.61R — impossible to reach for beginners or DrDave. It should state that players should hit the ball within 0.5R --- that is about 3mm inside the white circle (this is the outer-most small circle --- see photo below).
The Elephant training ball is fine --- it has a red circle that corresponds to a 0.5R. Its' area for applying spin is much smaller than CueSight's or Rempe's. I, a beginner, miscued hitting its red circle, but that’s me and not Elephant Ball's fault.
Experienced players --- not beginners --- know some of this. DrDave has videos of miscues and used a Rempe ball showing a miscue occurred at a Rempe marking of 4 (0.6R; see photo below). When YouTuber Ron the Pool Student indicates where to hit on a Rempe ball, he advises, for example, to hit low right spin at a Rempe 3 marking (0.5R; figuring contact would occur at one side of cue tip; see photo below).
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The miscue limit is the distance from cue-ball center that a player can hit without miscuing. The distance is generally accepted to be one-half a billiard-ball radius, 9/16" (14.3mm) or 0.5R. Some billiard-ball stripes are that width. For beginners, a more practical maximum may be 0.4 to 0.45R. DrDave found a maximum miscue limit of 0.55R.
The Rempe training ball shows an area to apply spin that has a miscue limit of 0.7R. It instructs players hit the Rempe ball and to note chalk marks to determine where spin was applied. That's a disaster, though, for beginners who would miscue hitting the ball at about 0.5R length and for experienced players above 0.55R. Rempe's instructions should state that miscues are likely cue hits ball and smudges ball at markings above 3.2 (that is 0.5R).
The CueSight Training ball instructs players to “stay inside the white circle and you will not miscue”. That white circle can mean hitting the cue ball at 0.61R — impossible to reach for beginners or DrDave. It should state that players should hit the ball within 0.5R --- that is about 3mm inside the white circle (this is the outer-most small circle --- see photo below).
The Elephant training ball is fine --- it has a red circle that corresponds to a 0.5R. Its' area for applying spin is much smaller than CueSight's or Rempe's. I, a beginner, miscued hitting its red circle, but that’s me and not Elephant Ball's fault.
Experienced players --- not beginners --- know some of this. DrDave has videos of miscues and used a Rempe ball showing a miscue occurred at a Rempe marking of 4 (0.6R; see photo below). When YouTuber Ron the Pool Student indicates where to hit on a Rempe ball, he advises, for example, to hit low right spin at a Rempe 3 marking (0.5R; figuring contact would occur at one side of cue tip; see photo below).
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
Nice vintage Dufferin Phantom Green Leaf. 58 inches, 12.2mm tip, 19.50 oz. in very nice condition as the pictures show. Has a slight ding in the shaft 9.5 inches from the top and some very minor scratches here and there, but far better than expected for its age. This is a vintage Phantom, made in Canada. I'm not sure why the green leaf is so much harder to find, but this is a nice one to have if you appreciate these cues and like the wood-to-wood hit. Has some taper roll but nothing that affects play. Tried to get the ding in the second to last picture. If interested, I also have a vintage Valley Supreme II sneaky that I will list separately.
$old shipped CONUS.
Paul_#_
Well-known member
Visiting Ron Vitello this weekend, I learned of something I did not believe at first. Can an object ball be thrown? I've always assumed "of course", as just about any book you read explains how to throw a ball. You put spin on the cueball, it strikes the object ball, transferring the spin and the object ball moves off its natural course. However, Ron claims it is impossible to throw an object ball. 
Firstly, we are not talking about frozen balls, they can be thrown all day. What we are talking about specifically: a cueball striking an object ball, forcing/throwing the object...
Firstly, we are not talking about frozen balls, they can be thrown all day. What we are talking about specifically: a cueball striking an object ball, forcing/throwing the object...
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Vintage Valley Supreme II, made in the USA bar beater with some taper roll and cracking in the finish but still a good hit. Nice cue if you need something that you can bang around and like the old Valley cues. 12.7mm, pro taper, 15.65 butt, 3.85 shaft, .89" joint, and 1.3" butt. $old shipped CONUS.
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
From Becue's website:
Becue's is a wood & CF butt. As far as wood &CF shafts: Wood/CF bunch follows
Wood applied to carbon as a natural veneer, a real layer of timber wrapped around the monolithic carbon fiber structure that defines every Becue cue.
This is not a wood cue with a carbon core.
The carbon structure is intact, uninterrupted, carrying every vibration, every impact exactly as our other cues do.
The wood is real — a genuine wood veneer, not a print, not a texture — but it carries no mechanical role. It does something more subtle: it breathes warmth into your hands.
This is not a wood cue with a carbon core.
The carbon structure is intact, uninterrupted, carrying every vibration, every impact exactly as our other cues do.
The wood is real — a genuine wood veneer, not a print, not a texture — but it carries no mechanical role. It does something more subtle: it breathes warmth into your hands.
Becue's is a wood & CF butt. As far as wood &CF shafts: Wood/CF bunch follows
Predator Centro and C8; Mezz EX Pro; McDermott G-Core, i-Pro, i-Pro Slim, i-1 Big Boy, i-2, i-3; Pure X FUZE Kielwood Carbon Fiber InFUZED Solid Shaft; Lucasi Pro Carbon InFUZED 10S; Bear RB-1; Fury LC series, Fury ST2 Hybrid series, Fury Merlin; CueLees EX Solid (combo extraordinaire with CF-only on bottom few inches and wood/CF for rest of shaft), CT-1 & CT-2; OB Cues Fusion (no longer available); Predator BK3 Sport Break cue and its BK3CF shaft (not available on Predator website); Predator BK2 break shaft; Cuetec R360 (note its fiberglass ---not CF--- inside; JFlowers SMO-W; Fiberglass exterior/Wood inside shafts: Cuetec Avid
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Paul_#_
Well-known member
Four one-piece cues about 100-years old for sale — $400 shipped
Cues by O.L. Briggs & Son company of Boston MA made sometime between 64 and 125 years ago during that business's existence (it had been O.L. Briggs since 1870).
The 16 and 17 ounce cues appear to be made of mahogany and maple, while the 18 and 19 ounce cues, purple heart and maple.
Cue lengths 57" to end of tenon. No ferrules on the cues but buffalo-horn ferrules included for installation.
Butt diameters at bottom for the 16, 17, 18, and 19 ounce cues: 1.35", 1.37", 1.39", and 1.39" diameter, respectively.
Butt diameters about twelve inches from the first splice near butt end are 1.22" for all cues.
Diameters below ferrule bottom (if a ferrule was on cue): 12.1, 12.3, 12.6, 12.5 mm, resp.
Tenon diameters: 6.5 diam.x14.6mm length, 6.5x11mm, 6.2x13.1mm, 6.6x14mm, resp.
Also included are parts likely used a hundred years ago: i) six buffalo horn ferrules (four 17x27mm with 6mm tenon & air holes and two 17x33mm undrilled ferrules from Cue Components); and ii) five Champion 13mm cue tips.
Some wobble to the cues.
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Cues by O.L. Briggs & Son company of Boston MA made sometime between 64 and 125 years ago during that business's existence (it had been O.L. Briggs since 1870).
The 16 and 17 ounce cues appear to be made of mahogany and maple, while the 18 and 19 ounce cues, purple heart and maple.
Cue lengths 57" to end of tenon. No ferrules on the cues but buffalo-horn ferrules included for installation.
Butt diameters at bottom for the 16, 17, 18, and 19 ounce cues: 1.35", 1.37", 1.39", and 1.39" diameter, respectively.
Butt diameters about twelve inches from the first splice near butt end are 1.22" for all cues.
Diameters below ferrule bottom (if a ferrule was on cue): 12.1, 12.3, 12.6, 12.5 mm, resp.
Tenon diameters: 6.5 diam.x14.6mm length, 6.5x11mm, 6.2x13.1mm, 6.6x14mm, resp.
Also included are parts likely used a hundred years ago: i) six buffalo horn ferrules (four 17x27mm with 6mm tenon & air holes and two 17x33mm undrilled ferrules from Cue Components); and ii) five Champion 13mm cue tips.
Some wobble to the cues.
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