sportsmanship question.

lorider

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
You are playing in a team tournament.

Your team wins the first match in a best 2 out of 3. Your opponent then throws a 7 for the second match. While you are deciding who to throw against the 7 you find out their 7 has just been thrown in a match on another team he plays on. The 7 has the option of which team to olay for and decides to play for the other team.

Now keep in mind this is a higher level qualifying tournament. Your opposing captain seeks out the lo to ask if its legal form r him ti change who he throws...which by the way is not legal but never hurts to ask.

The lo comes to you and says its your option ... You can make them forfeit that match guaranteeing a win and move on to the next round without having to play a 3 match since this forfeit will give you the 2 wins you need.

Or...do you allow them to change who they throw and continue on with the match ?

More detail to help you make a decision. they only have 2-4's available to meet handicap. You have a 5 and a 3 available.

Considering those options ...what would you do ?
 

kcnate66

C Speed
I play a lot of leagues and I'm a big proponent of beating your opponent on the table and not a technicality. It sucks that the 7 already put this team in a crappy situation by playing for the other team, so I wouldn't rub it in by making them forfeit, even if it was within the rules.

But I'm also the guy who wont take a win when my opponent forgets to mark an obvious 8 ball
 

sixpack

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I let him change it up. Everybody wants to play and IMO it would be wrong to enforce in that situation. We all know teams and players that would. Most of us don’t like those teams or players.
 

jimmyco

NRA4Life
Silver Member
They know who their 7 is. Cannot have it both ways.

Poor planning on their part should not be rewarded, IMO.
 

couldnthinkof01

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It would be nice to make them forfeit just
to prove a point. They made a huge mistake.
If your team is in a big tournament, play for
one team, that back and forth on two teams
is just plain dumb.
That being said, In reality I would let them
throw up someone else. Its just not my style
to make someone forfeit over something like that.
Especially since the way you describe it the captain
didn't know that was going to be a problem.
 

RichSchultz

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I am a big fan of winning honorably, so no forfeit.

oh, and kharma is a biotch if you take the forfeit.
 

pt109

WO double hemlock
Silver Member
I think the league operator is not doing his job.
....it should be his decision with no pressure on any player.
 

hang-the-9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Wish they could find a way to just make it not legal for someone to be on more than one team per league if there is any chance of those teams playing in the same event or day or vs the other team.

I run into players that play on 3 teams, then if one of those teams plays in the playoffs or something vs the other they need to sit out, possibly causing issues.
 

Celophanewrap

Call me Grace
Silver Member
If I'm not mistaken we're talking about an APA Team tournament. If that's the case there
is no decision to be made, once the decision has been made and announced by the
captain or the acting captain there is no other option. At that point it's out of your hands
and the captains hands. When the the player has been announced He/She is the one
that must play. If you went as far as to ask the LO if they could switch I would assume
that you were just going to let them anyway, so, why not.
But according to the rules it sounds like you all had reached the point where it's no longer
at your discretion.
Many here say that rules are there for a reason and that they should be adhered to,
some of us are a little more casual. I know that in the National Tournament there is no
flexibility regarding this. At our qualifier our LO makes it a point to do her best to create
a Las Vegas like atmosphere and thus there would be no flexibility regarding this.
But just as in the National tournament prior to contacting the referee and the floor
manager it is left to the captains. Had I been in that situation, I would have asked for a
direct interpretation of the rule and left it that, given that the LO made it my choice, I
would have been (felt) forced to let them have a mulligan and pick again.
So, what did you do?
 

michael4

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I play a lot of leagues and I'm a big proponent of beating your opponent on the table and not a technicality. It sucks that the 7 already put this team in a crappy situation by playing for the other team, so I wouldn't rub it in by making them forfeit, even if it was within the rules.

But I'm also the guy who wont take a win when my opponent forgets to mark an obvious 8 ball

I'm with this. ^^

By the way, if the two matches were in the same room, would it have been possible for the "7" to play both matches at the same time?
 

Pete

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If it's your teams choice I would think a team "meeting" would be in order. If this would me your team was guarantied money or a trip to Vegas them I think it might suck but they should have known better (know all the rules of the league).

Tough call. The truth is your team are the ones who need to look in the mirror. So they need to decide what they can live with. Either way, you would be in the right...
 

jimmyco

NRA4Life
Silver Member
A good captain makes the call and accepts the outcome.

A good captain puts their team ahead of their own conscience.
 

kevoka

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
For a qualifying tournament the LO should have enforced the rule as written.

Totally off the main question but how could they put a 7, yet only have two 4s in which to keep under the level limit?

Other eligible player(s) on their team 8 or above?

Just curious....
 

lorider

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If I'm not mistaken we're talking about an APA Team tournament. If that's the case there
is no decision to be made, once the decision has been made and announced by the
captain or the acting captain there is no other option. At that point it's out of your hands
and the captains hands. When the the player has been announced He/She is the one
that must play. If you went as far as to ask the LO if they could switch I would assume
that you were just going to let them anyway, so, why not.
But according to the rules it sounds like you all had reached the point where it's no longer
at your discretion.
Many here say that rules are there for a reason and that they should be adhered to,
some of us are a little more casual. I know that in the National Tournament there is no
flexibility regarding this. At our qualifier our LO makes it a point to do her best to create
a Las Vegas like atmosphere and thus there would be no flexibility regarding this.
But just as in the National tournament prior to contacting the referee and the floor
manager it is left to the captains. Had I been in that situation, I would have asked for a
direct interpretation of the rule and left it that, given that the LO made it my choice, I
would have been (felt) forced to let them have a mulligan and pick again.
So, what did you do?



I will try to address every ones comments and questions in my reply to celo.

I agree completely with everything you stated celo. This is a last chance tournament to qualify for our ltc's . It consists of all the teams that played in any and all of our 3 tri cups and failed to qualify for ltc.

As you state....its ran in a more serious way than regular session but would not go as far to Sa its ran as serious as our ltc in which it is exactly like nationals.

I was actually quite surprised that the lo came up to me ...called me aside with his wife who is co owner and stated I did not have ti let them change players but it was up to me whether they were allowed to or not. As a few on here stated ...i did not feel right winning due to a rule and would allow them to make a change. Both of them thanked me for displaying good sportsmanship .

I know several captains that without a doubt would have caused a lot of drama the minute the other captain went looking for the lo. I have never been one of those guys and was no about to start being one now.

This actually made my decision easier to determine who to throw. Oh yea...some one asked about the handicaps. this is a 3 man tournament with a max handicap of 14.

I threw a 5 first and they countered with a 4 . My 5 won 4-0 which gave us 3 points and them 0 . 5 points could win this round . They wanted to play their 7 next and could only play a 3 last and their 3 oughta be a 4 in my opinion. Since their 7 was out of the picture they threw a 4 instead and that allowed them to play another 4 last instead of their 3 if they so desired.

During the wait for the lo I was contemplating ....do I throw myself or do I dump my 3 and I play last against their 3 who I would be spotting 4-2 and I felt I should only be spotting 4-3. I could easily lose either match and my 3 could easily loss either match giving them a move on to the next round.

When they threw their 4 I decided to play and won 4-1 in a 4-3 race and the 3 rd match was not required because even if they won 3-0 the could not catch us.

So in the end o looked good playing the good sportsman and our team moved on only to lose the next round. Btw.....it was a lot of pressure because this was a single elimination tournament.
 

u12armresl

One Pocket back cutter
Silver Member
Yes, agree 100%





I play a lot of leagues and I'm a big proponent of beating your opponent on the table and not a technicality. It sucks that the 7 already put this team in a crappy situation by playing for the other team, so I wouldn't rub it in by making them forfeit, even if it was within the rules.

But I'm also the guy who wont take a win when my opponent forgets to mark an obvious 8 ball
 

megatron69

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I never want to win on a technicality, so much so that I'll 'forget' a rule/reg occasionally to make sure it doesn't happen. I hate winning because of a technicality; it's not really winning, IMO. Heck, I hate winning because my opponent scratches on the money ball. I'd rather spot it and keep playing.

If there's a way around the technicality so that we can play out the match, I'll take that option every time.
 

JohnnyOzone

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
My first thought was, what league would allow a player to play on 2 different teams in the same event? My advice.....play in a different league
 
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