9-Ball vs. 10-Ball Breaking Formats

[MattPoland]

In the aftermath of the Fedor and SVB match, Jayson Shaw gives some hot takes on the comparison of the break between the two games. Interesting bit at the 1:07:31 mark.

They also go back into it even more around 1:13

Makes you think from 2000-2020 9-ball had the reputation of being a broken game because of the break and 10-ball was the answer. But from 2020+ we're seeing them trade places and 10-ball is the more broken game because of the break.

 

[MitchAlsup]

Makes you think from 2000-2020 9-ball had the reputation of being a broken game because of the break and 10-ball was the answer. But from 2020+ we're seeing them trade places and 10-ball is the more broken game because of the break.

Both 9-ball and 10-ball ARE broken games--simply because game result is so HIGHLY dependent on the break.

14.1 continuous does not have this problem
1-ball does not have this problem
3-ball does not have this problem
8-ball does not have this problem
Snooker does not have this problem
and certainly
no Billiards game has this problem

 

[MattPoland]

Both 9-ball and 10-ball ARE broken games--simply because game result is so HIGHLY dependent on the break.

14.1 continuous does not have this problem
1-ball does not have this problem
3-ball does not have this problem
8-ball does not have this problem
Snooker does not have this problem
and certainly
no Billiards game has this problem

I think the points I disagree on are…

8-ball is absolutely broken for elite players because having that many options after the break is just too easy for 800+ players. Ultimate Pool and World Championships demonstrates that where matches are pretty much decided by wet/dry break ratios.

9-ball with WNT rules doesn’t have this problem. There’s skill to make the 1-ball in the side. And. Depending on the random 2-ball position in the rack there might be some scenarios that are predictable but not all of them are. The proof is that we see a respectable amount of pushouts, safeties, jumps, kicks, and safeties after the break. And that means matches are decided by the total package of skills for the players plus whatever luck shows up. But break skills so far is more of a marginal advantage than an exploited easy-win situation like we’ve seen in all the prior incarnations of 9-ball in years past.

 

[straightline]

There are many conditions that could be imposed even open after the break.

High/Low only The high or low of a group is in play. Defense will be strategically bound as well.

Declare - Breaker must declare run or safety. Failure of a declared run could be a loss or subject to other peripheral conditions such as having to play through for the subsequent break and no score.

Break and first shot. Breaker shoots first inning regardless of break outcome.

Shake Break - All balls and CB go in a suitable shaker and are poured onto the playing area.

Any combination already mentioned and other conditions...

 

[InsertCleverNameHere]

I think the points I disagree on are…

8-ball is absolutely broken for elite players because having that many options after the break is just too easy for 800+ players. Ultimate Pool and World Championships demonstrates that where matches are pretty much decided by wet/dry break ratios.

9-ball with WNT rules doesn’t have this problem. There’s skill to make the 1-ball in the side. And. Depending on the random 2-ball position in the rack there might be some scenarios that are predictable but not all of them are. The proof is that we see a respectable amount of pushouts, safeties, jumps, kicks, and safeties after the break. And that means matches are decided by the total package of skills for the players plus whatever luck shows up. But break skills so far is more of a marginal advantage than an exploited easy-win situation like we’ve seen in all the prior incarnations of 9-ball in years past.

As much as I agree with here I don’t believe that citing 800+ fargos performances as the reason a game is broken means a whole heck of a lot. That’s only what 100 players if that?

And ultimate pool shouldn’t mean much either as the tables have literal buckets for pockets and brand new cloth for all the ones I’ve seen anyway. Don’t have to be very good at all to run a rack with those conditions.

For the record I do like the 9 on the spot version of 9ball much better and agree it’s a far better examination of one’s game.